Looking for a Fade-Resistant Royal Blue Ink

[SHPenFan]

Are there any fade-resistant royal blue inks? I have used Pelikan Royal Blue, Hero Blue, Parker Quink Washable Blue, and Lamy Blue. They all seem to fade relatively quickly in a few years. Is there a good ink that has a similar Royal Blue hue but is resistant to fading? I have heard good things about MontBlanc Royal Blue. Could you provide some good suggestions?

Thank you!

[A Smug Dill]

Typically if any colour in a given series of fountain ink products is designated washable or erasable, it'd be Royal Blue, so choosing Royal Blue from common ink lines, especially relatively lower-priced ones such as Pelikan 4001, would be setting oneself up for failure if the intent is to make archival written records with one's pen.

 

There is De Atramentis Document Ink, which is marketed for archival/document use, and mixable to boot. So, if you're not happy enough with the blue ink in the series, you can always mix your own with blue and violet until you get the ‘right’ shade and tint you want.

 

Rohrer & Klinger has a dark blue ink in its Dokumentus line of inks, but I don't think it qualifies as royal blue.

 

Then there's Pilot Tsuwairo blue ink.

 

Or you may want to look into Tramol's ever-growing number of colours for its pigment-based drawing inks (which are nevertheless fountain pen compatible).

[SHPenFan]

4 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

Typically if any colour in a given series of fountain ink products is designated washable or erasable, it'd be Royal Blue, so choosing Royal Blue from common ink lines, especially relatively lower-priced ones such as Pelikan 4001, would be setting oneself up for failure if the intent is to make archival written records with one's pen.

 

There is De Atramentis Document Ink, which is marketed for archival/document use, and mixable to boot. So, if you're not happy enough with the blue ink in the series, you can always mix your own with blue and violet until you get the ‘right’ shade and tint you want.

Thank you for the info! I think De Atramentis Document ink is pigmented though? Are there any dye-based blue inks (not Noodler's; their bulletproof inks seem to react badly with vintage pens) that have fade-resistant properties? I am looking for blue inks friendly to vintage sac-fillers that don't fade as much. I will put De Atramentis on my future ink sample shopping list to try out, but maybe for easier-to-clean pens.

[A Smug Dill]

Just now, SHPenFan said:

Are there any dye-based blue inks (not Noodler's; their bulletproof inks seem to react badly with vintage pens) that have fade-resistant properties?

 

You can look at fade tests that some other enthusiast has published or shared on FPN; there are a few fellow members who are particularly into lightfastness.

 

Personally, when I want waterproof and lightfast ink marks on the page, by default I'd be looking at using one of the three dozen or so pigment-based inks I have here.

[arcfide]

Bottom line: you're going to have a hard time finding what you're looking for. 

 

The cream of the crop for lightfast royal blue inks are the pigmented inks. Platinum makes an excellent one that is very "Royal Blue", as does Montblanc with their Permanent Blue. Both of them are meant to match pretty closely to the "standard blue" hue. 

 

If you don't want those, then the Noodler's Dye based blues are among the more lightfast, but also among the more difficult to work with. These are also not necessarily friendly to sacs due to their intense saturation levels, dye loads, and surfactants.

 

After that, you have the Iroshizuku line by Pilot, which includes a surprising number of relatively lightfast dye-based blue inks that could meet your requirements. Asa Gao is probably a big one, along with Kon Peki, both of which are "close enough." These are surprisingly good with light. However, all of them are alkaline inks, and thus potentially more trouble with vintage sac fillers. 

 

If you really want something to go with a vintage sac filler *and* you want a royal blue *and* you want a dye-based ink, you're going to have a tough time of it. All the more resistant dye-based blue inks I'm aware of are alkaline or leaning that direction. 

 

The final thing you might try is the Royal Blue leaning Blue Black inks with iron gall in them. These would be authentic to the vintage era and would also represent the "standard permanent ink" of the time. They would be sac friendly and at least initially will be more blue. Inks like the standard dye-based Blue Black ink by Platinum are more blue-leaning, and so they will be a little more towards the color that you want. However, these are not very strongly lightfast, but they are more archival than the washable blue inks by a long ways. These are permanent in the classic sense and will have water resistant and light resistant properties, as long as you don't want something as resistant as what pigmented inks can provide. They will still fade over time in strong UV light, but they will last on the page and not fade as easily when stored in good conditions or when exposed to a little harshness. They represent what I think is probably the best "step up" in terms of permanence compared to what you are using at the moment if you want to stick with the blue hue. 

 

I doubt that you will find a readily available, easy maintenance, acidic (sac friendly), royal blue dye-based ink that will meet your needs. You'll probably have to compromise on one of those requirements at least. 

[lapis]

Alongside the above-mentioned Document varieties and both MBs, I'd also check out GvFC's Royal Blue and  Monteverde's Horizon Blue.

[yazeh]

You can used Büroservice Bergman's Iron Gall blue ink, which is a great ink, and is bluish but it'll oxidize to blue black or black depending the paper. But IG inks aren't light fast, probably a year. You can order a bottle directly from Germany and the owner Thom is a very knowledgeable guy. You can see his comment both on mine and @LizEF ink reviews on the Fpgeeks website. 

 

As the others said, Document inks are the way ago. I wouldn't dismiss Noodler's ink though. In my experience some of the fluorescent inks are often times easier to clean than "normal ins". Only you have to test a few first in modern pens and see if you like them.

I've read excellent review about Noodler's Canyon Blue ( I don't know if it's a royal blue though) and  Luxury blue. The latter belongs to the 1 oz/30ml ink bottles series due to the expensive ingredients.  Fox Red (from the same series) is one of the best inks, I've ever tried. If Luxury Blue has the same properties then you have a winner. 

 

Note that pigment inks tends to be very wet, and if your vintage pens are  wet, then Houston you've got a problem  hence the recommendation to use IG inks in the first place to tame their nature  but then again they are not light fast. 

I would also check  R&K document ink, if it's anything like the brown it should be a very good ink. 

 

Here is a light test done on the German pen forum, you can see it's effect on IG inks: 

https://www.penexchange.de/forum_neu/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8142&start=2145#p274880

 

 

 

 

[Sailor Kenshin]

Monteverde also makes what they call a Documental Blue.  It's on the inexpensive side.

[A Smug Dill]

8 hours ago, lapis said:

… I'd also check out GvFC's Royal Blue and  Monteverde's Horizon Blue.

 

Royal Blue is one of few colours that are not designated as “document-proof” (or) in compliance with ISO-12757 by the manufacture in Graf von Faber-Castell's regular line-up of inks. (It was actually the first thing I checked yesterday, because GvFC usually makes a point of explicitly stating on the retail packaging that an ink is ISO-12757 compliant.)

 

I don't know about its fade-resistance, but Monteverde Horizon Blue is not water-resistant at all, so I wouldn't by default count on it having good fade-resistance.

[arcfide]

You might also investigate Levenger inks: Levenger Bottled Ink

 

I'm not sure how lightfast their blue is though. The fade tests seem to indicate good results. Something I read indicated that they might have been formulated by Noodler's. 

[lapis]

an/or Noodler's  "Blue". Takes forever to dry but is a nice "pure" blue.....................................................

[Runnin_Ute]

On 7/26/2023 at 3:41 AM, arcfide said:

You might also investigate Levenger inks: Levenger Bottled Ink

 

I'm not sure how lightfast their blue is though. The fade tests seem to indicate good results. Something I read indicated that they might have been formulated by Noodler's. 

I doubt it. I have a number of Levenger inks, and they are consistent in color from bottle to bottle, batch to batch and are generally well behaved. At least all the ones I have either had in the past or have currently.  Much better than the Noodler's I have tried. (Black, Eel Blue, 54th Massachusetts, Apache Sunset)

 

Raven Black - semi-permanent (their language), I finished my bottle in around 2013 and didn't replace. Mostly because I rarely use black. (I picked up a bottle of Noodler's Black in March 2014 and it is still clear up to the base of the neck of the bottle. Which means in 9+ years I have used maybe 10 ml.

Cobalt Blue - I am on my second bottle. Have had this one for a year or two, number one was purchased around 1998 or so, and finished a couple of years or so later. I just was busy using something else in between (Pelikan 4001 Blue Black and Raven Black) for much of that time, then lots of other colors/inks.

Forest Green- on 2nd bottle. Love the color

Pomegranate - discontinued about the time I finished my first bottle, but was able to track down a second bottle. Even though the second was only a partial. Great color.  If I could have found another I would have purchased it.

Amethyst- on 2nd bottle - again great color

[arcfide]

2 hours ago, Runnin_Ute said:

I doubt it. I have a number of Levenger inks, and they are consistent in color from bottle to bottle, batch to batch and are generally well behaved. At least all the ones I have either had in the past or have currently.  Much better than the Noodler's I have tried. (Black, Eel Blue, 54th Massachusetts, Apache Sunset)

 

I think that was speculation back in the day because the formulation was supposedly from an American ink company, and at the time, there weren't a lot of options to choose from. At the least, I do think Nathan is quite capable of producing good and more normal inks. His standard line of inks seems to have very little of the quirkiness of the more interesting options, but seem to fair well in the lightfastness department, nonetheless. Maybe you can provide more details, but from what I gathered online, it seems that the Levenger inks also have a reputation for being relatively wet, with above average levels of surfactants and relatively high saturation, which is not common among other big name ink makers, but is a hallmark of Noodler's "preferences." 

 

I also wouldn't be surprised if the formulas were developed by one group under contract (Noodler's, for example), and then outsourced to someone else for mass production. I could see that. 

 

Anyways, how have you found the performance of the Cobalt Blue, do you think it would meet the requirements here? 

[mge01park]

10 hours ago, Runnin_Ute said:

I doubt it. I have a number of Levenger inks, and they are consistent in color from bottle to bottle, batch to batch and are generally well behaved. At least all the ones I have either had in the past or have currently.  Much better than the Noodler's I have tried. (Black, Eel Blue, 54th Massachusetts, Apache Sunset)

 

Raven Black - semi-permanent (their language), I finished my bottle in around 2013 and didn't replace. Mostly because I rarely use black. (I picked up a bottle of Noodler's Black in March 2014 and it is still clear up to the base of the neck of the bottle. Which means in 9+ years I have used maybe 10 ml.

Cobalt Blue - I am on my second bottle. Have had this one for a year or two, number one was purchased around 1998 or so, and finished a couple of years or so later. I just was busy using something else in between (Pelikan 4001 Blue Black and Raven Black) for much of that time, then lots of other colors/inks.

Forest Green- on 2nd bottle. Love the color

Pomegranate - discontinued about the time I finished my first bottle, but was able to track down a second bottle. Even though the second was only a partial. Great color.  If I could have found another I would have purchased it.

Amethyst- on 2nd bottle - again great color

Levenger inks are phenomenal for me. I’ve been buying them since the 90’s and have every color ever introduced from the beginning and the cartridges. There’s so many discontinued colors through the years and a few new ones here and there. My favorite discontinued were the pomegranate, claret, shiraz, there were two grays that are now gone. Regal and Empyrean are nice too. For blue they also had a nice blue bahama and skies of blue. Teal also great. 

[SHPenFan]

Thanks! I'll definitely check out Levenger. I've used Iroshizuku Asa-Gao in modern pens before. It is a really nice blue, but I might keep it away from sac-fillers. Has anyone used Diamine Sargasso Sea or Diamine Royal Blue before?

[Bo Bo Olson]

DA Royal blue is as wet as Waterman, darker, shading a tad towards purple....'Royal'. I replace Waterman with the ink. Well lubricated.

 

Got to get off the gray kick. Just ran into a sample stash of blue inks.

[Penguincollector]

Is this a good match for what you’re looking for? It’s Cross Blue Archival ink. I bought it on Amazon.

[welch]

On 7/24/2023 at 8:08 PM, SHPenFan said:

Are there any fade-resistant royal blue inks? I have used Pelikan Royal Blue, Hero Blue, Parker Quink Washable Blue, and Lamy Blue. They all seem to fade relatively quickly in a few years. Is there a good ink that has a similar Royal Blue hue but is resistant to fading? I have heard good things about MontBlanc Royal Blue. Could you provide some good suggestions?

Thank you!

 

How have you stored the writings that faded in a few years? I have things I wrote in 1962 using Sheaffer's Skrip Washable Black, and they are as legible as they were 60 years ago. I put them in a three-ring binder back then, and that has kept them well. 

 

I went back to fountain pens in 2007 or so, writing in Levenger's Notabilia notebooks...my standard work notebook. I've tried various inks, and settled on Asa-Gao and Parker Penman Sapphire / Scribe Indigo as my favorites. Plus Pelikan Royal Blue. Nothing has faded. I tried Parker washable blue, which writes an appealing blue but dries into a washed out semi-blue. Never tried Hero Blue. Pelikan is on my desk right now.

 

Obvious question, then: do you put your writing in a notebook or binder, and then put the notebooks on a shelf? Yes, sunlight will kill off most inks and even the printing on dust-jackets. The fade-tests usually hang up written sheets into direct sunlight. The tests will tell you which inks will last longer, but the results do not tell how long an ink will last normally, where "normally" mean the user stored the document in a notebook or folder inside a house. 

 

(Also: paper might be important. In 1962, I wrote on 20-pound National Paper Company (best I remember) three-hole line paper. It seems to have a higher rag content than paper found today.)

[PJohnP]

13 hours ago, Penguincollector said:

Is this a good match for what you’re looking for? It’s Cross Blue Archival ink. I bought it on Amazon.

 

Hmmm...

 

I looked for a review of this Cross ink here on FPN and wasn't successful.  I then looked on Amazon, also without success.  I might not be using the right search terms or missing something in each case.

 

Have you tested this ink with respect to fading and water resistance ?  The colour looks good, but, as always, it's the actual behaviour of the ink that determines so much for personal enjoyment and pen usage.

 

Thanks for more information...

 

 

 

John P.

[Penguincollector]

I have used it for awhile now,  I know it meets ISO standards, it’s on the bottle. I would have to get back to you on lightfastness as my office is rather dark. I’ll write with it on a test sheet and leave it in a window for a week and let you know what happens. It’s well behaved, that much I can tell you.