Problem with vacuum fill on PenBBS 456

[Fuzzy Logic]

I have been struggling with a PenBBS 456 vacuum-filler.  The main problem is that I have to fight with the piston rod to draw it back, and that seems to be because of the air pressure.  I disassembled the pen for cleaning and I've been moving the rod in and out in the barrel without having the section attached.  So the nib-end is open.  Most of the time, I can't just pull the rod all the way back in one pull.  I have to pull several times.  And usually when I press it back in, I can press it 2/3 of the way in and let go, and the air pressure pulls it back an inch.  

 

I haven't had any such problems with my TWSBI 700R Vac, or a Wing Sung 699.  

 

Another oddity with this PenBBS is that it seems to leak ink along the rod, into the blind cap. 

 

Did I just get a lemon?  I've been looking at all the raves for this pen, and no one else seems to have had this problem.  

 

Thanks in advance for any suggestions!  I'm actually wondering how this thing is supposed to work.  Is it supposed to the the air past when you pull the rod out, but then not allow air past when you push the rod in?  That doesn't seem to happen with my pen.  

 

[Karmachanic]

2 hours ago, Fuzzy Logic said:

Thanks in advance for any suggestions

 

Pilot 823 🤡

[Detman101]

2 hours ago, Fuzzy Logic said:

I have been struggling with a PenBBS 456 vacuum-filler.  The main problem is that I have to fight with the piston rod to draw it back, and that seems to be because of the air pressure.  I disassembled the pen for cleaning and I've been moving the rod in and out in the barrel without having the section attached.  So the nib-end is open.  Most of the time, I can't just pull the rod all the way back in one pull.  I have to pull several times.  And usually when I press it back in, I can press it 2/3 of the way in and let go, and the air pressure pulls it back an inch.  

 

I haven't had any such problems with my TWSBI 700R Vac, or a Wing Sung 699.  

 

Another oddity with this PenBBS is that it seems to leak ink along the rod, into the blind cap. 

 

Did I just get a lemon?  I've been looking at all the raves for this pen, and no one else seems to have had this problem.  

 

Thanks in advance for any suggestions!  I'm actually wondering how this thing is supposed to work.  Is it supposed to the the air past when you pull the rod out, but then not allow air past when you push the rod in?  That doesn't seem to happen with my pen.  

 

1. Pressure hitches: Par for the course with that pen, I experienced the same with mine. Drawing the piston back and extending the rod was always a 3-part effort. Draw it back...let it rest...draw it back...let it rest...draw it back...let it rest...draw it all the way back.  It has something to do with how the piston seal at the end breathes...or in this case, doesn't.

2. Rod Leakage into rear cap: Also par for the course. You can disassemble the rear end and place silicone grease on the end-side of the piston to slow down the leak. you can never stop it, but only slow its progress into the end-cap. Just the way these pens operate I guess.
You can take the cap off with a pair of needlenose  hair-puller thingies (I can't remember what they're called). Use the thingie to hold the notches in place while you unscrew the cap.

I no longer use the penbbs-456 because of these self-same problems. I got tired of it all and moved on to the 355 model which, to me, is worlds better than than the 456.
But even the 355 are made cheaply and break easily.
I've moved on to the Opus-88 for a more durable and high-quality experience.

[Fuzzy Logic]

@Karmachanic : Ha!  Yes, hard to beat the 823.

 

@Detman101 : Thanks.  It's nice to know I'm not alone.  

 

Funny: I played with the piston for a while, drawing it back and forth.  It started freeing up, so that most of the time now I can freely pull it back.  I don't understand.  

 

My main problem with this pen was the nib and feed.  The pen was barely usable for me because it was so dry.  I succeeded in modifying the nib so that it was wetter.  But that odd upturned nib just wrote too fat and too inconsistently for me.  At the beginning, the feed seemed to dry out after a few days.  

 

I also had problems with a very dry PenBBS 309.  I discovered a round EF replacement nib on eBay, and that seems to have made my 309 a wonderful pen.  I believe the same nib replacement fits the 456.  I'm contemplating another $10 experiment...

 

[Detman101]

5 hours ago, Fuzzy Logic said:

@Karmachanic : Ha!  Yes, hard to beat the 823.

 

@Detman101 : Thanks.  It's nice to know I'm not alone.  

 

Funny: I played with the piston for a while, drawing it back and forth.  It started freeing up, so that most of the time now I can freely pull it back.  I don't understand.  

 

My main problem with this pen was the nib and feed.  The pen was barely usable for me because it was so dry.  I succeeded in modifying the nib so that it was wetter.  But that odd upturned nib just wrote too fat and too inconsistently for me.  At the beginning, the feed seemed to dry out after a few days.  

 

I also had problems with a very dry PenBBS 309.  I discovered a round EF replacement nib on eBay, and that seems to have made my 309 a wonderful pen.  I believe the same nib replacement fits the 456.  I'm contemplating another $10 experiment...

 

Ah yes...Penbbs is a chinese company. They design their pen nibs and feeds to write in their language, which requires lots of shading...which requires either a dry ink or a dry nib. I believe they've gone the way of the "Dry Nib" and others not writing in whatever their language is ( I won't presume to know exactly) will have to make the nib wetter or replace the nib/feed altogether.

I always just swapped the nib with another...easy and fast fix. Though you have to be careful, the Penbbs feeds are more fragile than dandelions. The fins on their feeds snap off like saltines..it's crazy.

[A Smug Dill]

8 minutes ago, Detman101 said:

Ah yes...Penbbs is a chinese company. They design their pen nibs and feeds to write in their language, which requires lots of shading...

 

I don't quite agree.

 

8 minutes ago, Detman101 said:

...which requires either a dry ink or a dry nib.

 

‘Dry’ ink flow reduces the likelihood of ink marks on the page being too broad from spreading and/or feathering, which could be a serious issue to legibility and the pen-ink-paper combination's usability, because of the stroke density in Chinese characters each occupying a relatively small amount of space, even when written on 7mm-tall rows. Nothing to do with shading.

[Detman101]

1 minute ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

I don't quite agree.

 

 

‘Dry’ ink flow reduces the likelihood of ink marks on the page being too broad from spreading and/or feathering, which could be a serious issue to legibility and the pen-ink-paper combination's usability, because of the stroke density in Chinese characters each occupying a relatively small amount of space, even when written on 7mm-tall rows. Nothing to do with shading.

^^^
I would agree with A Smug Dill, who definitely knows more on the subject. He actually writes in other languages!!

[A Smug Dill]

6 hours ago, Fuzzy Logic said:

The pen was barely usable for me because it was so dry.  I succeeded in modifying the nib so that it was wetter.  But that odd upturned nib just wrote too fat and too inconsistently for me.

 

I just happened to be testing one of those nibs last night, to check the range of line widths I can get from it. To me, being able to put down wet, broader lines on demand is a bonus; but being able to put down fine lines for small and/or stroke-dense writing is a core requirement and basic expectation of the ‘default’ nib size on a (fit-for-purpose) general/everyday writing instrument.

 

 

The line of Latin at the bottom has x-height of ≤2.5mm, and I think I should be able to get such tight writing out of the nib consistently for an entire page; it just requires a lot of mental concentration.

[Fuzzy Logic]

Beautiful.  Amazing to see what that nib can do in the right hand.  

[aliasmissferkit]

Thank you, Fuzzy Logic (for putting a pretty annoying, shared problem out there) and Detman 101 (for excellent substantiation and ... a helpful tip).  Using a pair of jeweler's tweezers to hold the nut's notches in place, I was able to unscrew the end cap and clean out gunk.  I also fiddled with reseating the rubber gasket on the plunger - in the process,  losing the tiny 'nose gasket' that seals off the section ink chamber.  With a small 'oh well, some remove that anyway', I reassembled the whole thing and - it seems that the 'three stage plunger-pull' and 'ink creep into endcap' issues areresolved.  At least for now. Small victories!

[Detman101]

On 9/11/2021 at 10:47 PM, aliasmissferkit said:

Thank you, Fuzzy Logic (for putting a pretty annoying, shared problem out there) and Detman 101 (for excellent substantiation and ... a helpful tip).  Using a pair of jeweler's tweezers to hold the nut's notches in place, I was able to unscrew the end cap and clean out gunk.  I also fiddled with reseating the rubber gasket on the plunger - in the process,  losing the tiny 'nose gasket' that seals off the section ink chamber.  With a small 'oh well, some remove that anyway', I reassembled the whole thing and - it seems that the 'three stage plunger-pull' and 'ink creep into endcap' issues areresolved.  At least for now. Small victories!

WOOHOO!!!
SUCCESS!!
Congrats and many well wishes with much less "ink-in-the-endcap" enjoyment of your pen.

[aliasmissferkit]

On 9/13/2021 at 9:21 AM, Detman101 said:

WOOHOO!!!
SUCCESS!!
Congrats and many well wishes with much less "ink-in-the-endcap" enjoyment of your pen.

Yes! Victory is ours, Detman101!  And ... updating: no more ink in endcap.  At least, for now.