Is This Nib Worn Beyond Repair?

[catgo]

Hello, my uncle just passed down a 144 Classique M nib pen to me, however is is not writing well at all. It is very scratchy even though the tines seem to be properly aligned. I noticed that my 146's nib M nib has sort of a round shape, and the nib on this one seems to be flattened. I have attached a few pictures of the 144's nib and the last picture is of my 146's nib which is a fairly new pen. In case it is worn, do you guys know how much Montblanc might charge to replace it? The pen is in excellent shape besides the nib. This was his daily go to pen btw.

 

Thanks for your advice.

 

 

[wimg]

Hi catgo,

 

It looks like the 144 has seen good use, it also looks like it has a proper Iridium point, rather than a more modern tipping, considering the extensive wear, from always holding it in the same position. I have seen this fairly often with well-loved and well-used vintage pens. I reckon it could be smoothed one more time for a couple of years of intense use still - I have done so with several other vintage pens.

 

OTOH, that could be fairly expensive too, for the few years you still would get to use it, so a new nib could well be the way to go.

 

Best thing to do would be to contact Montblanc and ask, or try and find a (slightly) used nib fro it, e.g. on John Mottishaw's site. The nibs are fairly easy to replace.

 

HTH, warm regards, Wim

[kazoolaw]

May I suggest that first you move the pen until the nib glides smoothly across the page? It may be worn to a stub shape which will create line variation.

 

Enjoy,

 

gary

[jar]

Humans are multi-function adjustable machines. First try adjusting the user before adjusting the nib. It looks like the pen was held at very close to a 45 degree angle. Give that a try.

[meiers]

Wim, what material does MB use currently in its nib tips?

Edited April 2, 2016 by meiers

[meiers]

Humans are multi-function adjustable machines. First try adjusting the user before adjusting the nib. It looks like the pen was held at very close to a 45 degree angle. Give that a try.

So true!

[wimg]

Wim, what material does MB use currently in its nib tips?

 

A Ruthenium-Osmium alloy, like many nib manufacturers do these days. It is extremely hard wearing, and it is made by spraying tiny droplets of molten material in a vapour cloud, as far as I know, and once cooled down, the thus formed tiny pellets, generally in an ovoid shape, are then sorted according to size for the different nib type options.

 

I reckon there are alloys of different compositions used in te industry, as it si quite clear to me that some are much harder to grind than others . The current Montblanc version, well, at least from the last 20 years or so, is very hard indeed, but so are the other (former West) German brands (no idea about the other German brands). Bock/Schmidt nib tipping is slightly easier to grind, even though that also is a Ruthenium-Osmium alloy.

 

HTH, warm regards, Wim

[wimg]

Humans are multi-function adjustable machines. First try adjusting the user before adjusting the nib. It looks like the pen was held at very close to a 45 degree angle. Give that a try.

 

That is very true, but the nib has a completely flat surface, with sharp edges. It will write at a larger size than it was originally meant to be, and has sharp edges like a sharp italic while not being any kind of italic - not comfortable to write with, not even for the best adjusted human . I have seen this before, and worked on such nibs too, plus, I can write with any nib, no problem .

 

Warm regards, Wim

[meiers]

Have you ever seen a Montblanc nib worn beyond repair? In my limited experience I haven't.

 

But I would very much like to hear from members who have experienced a wider range of Mb nibs. Remember I am from the Canadian prairies. The only MB's I see on a daily basis are mine.

 

Edited to add: yes, we did indeed have significant snowfall last night. It looked very wintery here.

Edited April 3, 2016 by meiers

[Caestus75]

Have you ever seen a Montblanc nib worn beyond repair? In my limited experience I haven't.

 

But I would very much like to hear from members who have experienced a wider range of Mb nibs. Remember I am from the Canadian prairies. The only MB's I see on a daily basis are mine.

 

Edited to add: yes, we did indeed have significant snowfall last night. It looked very wintery here.

If I am not mistaken they use Iridium balls on the tip of all Nibs, Stainless Steel, 14k, 18k Gold, and 23k Palladium Nibs.

 

Iridium is used for Spark Plugs in cars and you can get 40-60k miles per set of spark plugs under extreme conditions.

 

My best guess is someone had the pen tuned that way and it really does not look bad.

 

As someone mentioned above try altering how the pen is held and at what angle. I would bet it will write like a dream with little to no alterations.

 

Edit: (Because meiers added an edit I decided to also) I will be in Denver Colorado on Thursday for a short vacation until Sunday. I hope it snows there. I'm from upstate New York and I lived in Vermont for 6 years. This is my first winter without ANY SNOW in Miami so I need some snow!

Edited April 3, 2016 by Caestus75

[zaddick]

This nib and pen do not look old enought for typical use to have caused this wear. It looks like someone ground it down, perhaps using high grit sand paper of something. If it is scratchy it is probably because the writer is used to being able to rotate the 146 with the more rounded factory nib shape.

 

Replacing the nib through MB will be expensive, probaly in the $200 to $300 range - pretty much the cost of a good used version of the pen. Youc an send it to a nibsmith to have it rounded ou for you or send it to someplace like goldnibs in Spain to have it retipped completely.

[zaddick]

If I am not mistaken they use Iridium balls on the tip of all Nibs, Stainless Steel, 14k, 18k Gold, and 23k Palladium Nibs.

 

 

Just as an FYI, not all steel nib have tipping. Some are just the steel shaped to the desired width. Also, I think some OMAS italic nibs do not use tipping even though they are gold. (I can't recall for sure.)

[wimg]

If I am not mistaken they use Iridium balls on the tip of all Nibs, Stainless Steel, 14k, 18k Gold, and 23k Palladium Nibs.

 

Iridium is used for Spark Plugs in cars and you can get 40-60k miles per set of spark plugs under extreme conditions.

 

My best guess is someone had the pen tuned that way and it really does not look bad.

 

As someone mentioned above try altering how the pen is held and at what angle. I would bet it will write like a dream with little to no alterations.

 

Edit: (Because meiers added an edit I decided to also) I will be in Denver Colorado on Thursday for a short vacation until Sunday. I hope it snows there. I'm from upstate New York and I lived in Vermont for 6 years. This is my first winter without ANY SNOW in Miami so I need some snow!

 

Iridium hasn't been used for nib tipping for a long time now, ever since they stopped using little rounded pieces of iridium ore as tipping, and invented better ways of creating tipping. It is only called Iridium, or Iridium Point because of tradition. Iridium cannot be used in matrials with which consumers come into direct contact with it either, because it is poisonous.

 

BTW, I assumed this is a vintage pen, and any pen with 35-40 years of daily use, when used by the same person, would potentially get this type of tipping shape - I have seen quite a few like this as a nib master.

 

I could be wrong of course, as my knowledge of Montblanc pens is not very great, so it could be not a vintage pen and nib after all. Even so, this is a very strange grind if it would be a modern nib, and not a very smooth writer based on the pictures, not even when held at the correct angle.

 

Warm regards, Wim

[wimg]

 

Just as an FYI, not all steel nib have tipping. Some are just the steel shaped to the desired width. Also, I think some OMAS italic nibs do not use tipping even though they are gold. (I can't recall for sure.)

 

That actually was a post by someone as an April fool's joke several years ago, with pictures and all .

 

Warm regards, Wim

[meiers]

This nib and pen do not look old enought for typical use to have caused this wear. It looks like someone ground it down, perhaps using high grit sand paper of something. If it is scratchy it is probably because the writer is used to being able to rotate the 146 with the more rounded factory nib shape.

 

 

 

 

That was my hunch, too.

[Caestus75]

 

Iridium hasn't been used for nib tipping for a long time now, ever since they stopped using little rounded pieces of iridium ore as tipping, and invented better ways of creating tipping. It is only called Iridium, or Iridium Point because of tradition. Iridium cannot be used in matrials with which consumers come into direct contact with it either, because it is poisonous.

 

 

 

 

I am no expert, however, I thought iridium was in the platinum family and is non toxic. Iridium is also used as a hardening agent for platinum.

 

This is a fascinating topic to me, do you have a source that I can read up on this?

 

What do they use if not iridium?

 

How it's made should update their video!

 

 

 

 

 

In any rate OP Let us know what you do with the pen/nib. Sounds like if it does not write the way you want it to, you should send it to a nib meister.

[meiers]

I would very much like to see a writing sample.

[catgo]

That is very true, but the nib has a completely flat surface, with sharp edges. It will write at a larger size than it was originally meant to be, and has sharp edges like a sharp italic while not being any kind of italic - not comfortable to write with, not even for the best adjusted human . I have seen this before, and worked on such nibs too, plus, I can write with any nib, no problem .

 

Warm regards, Wim

Thanks so much for your replies. The nib behaves exactly as you describe, even though it is s M nib it writes more like a broad nib and not comfortable at all to write with since it feels a bit scratchy and harsh. I'm going to visit my local MB store to see how much a replacement nib would cost. Edited April 4, 2016 by catgo

[catgo]

I am no expert, however, I thought iridium was in the platinum family and is non toxic. Iridium is also used as a hardening agent for platinum.

 

This is a fascinating topic to me, do you have a source that I can read up on this?

 

What do they use if not iridium?

 

How it's made should update their video!

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuSqIbxQTjI

 

 

 

 

In any rate OP Let us know what you do with the pen/nib. Sounds like if it does not write the way you want it to, you should send it to a nib meister.

 

I use this pen in a notebook which I carry everywhere with me. I generally use Rhodia dot paper, however when I have to write on regular paper or perhaps sign a document, the line is a bit too wide for my taste, this also causes quite noticeable feathering which I really don't like.

 

I would definitely consider sending it to a nibmeister for adjustment, will he be able to make it write more like a F or M nib or is this something that can't be corrected at this point since the nib is so worn at this point?

 

Would you care to recommend one I can contact?

 

Thanks for your replies!

Edited April 4, 2016 by catgo

[catgo]

That was my hunch, too.

This nib and pen do not look old enought for typical use to have caused this wear. It looks like someone ground it down, perhaps using high grit sand paper of something. If it is scratchy it is probably because the writer is used to being able to rotate the 146 with the more rounded factory nib shape.

 

Replacing the nib through MB will be expensive, probaly in the $200 to $300 range - pretty much the cost of a good used version of the pen. Youc an send it to a nibsmith to have it rounded ou for you or send it to someplace like goldnibs in Spain to have it retipped completely.

I don't believe the pen is actually that old, since it's a classique with a screw-on cap (basically a Chopin) and I believe those came out only 5-6 years ago. Perhaps the nib was grinded at one point, my uncle says he bought the pen at a pen show and even though it seemed brand new it was sold as pre owned.