Montblanc Policy On Removed Parts And Nibs From Pens Sent For Repair

[FredRydr]

I had a conversation with Montblanc NA on the telephone regarding the return of parts removed from pens. Montblanc's policy is to never return parts, including nibs from nib swaps, that were taken from pens sent in for servicing. The reason given was to deny counterfeiters of a source for genuine parts. The policy probably has a limited impact, but counterfeit pens with genuine nibs have been submitted for repairs. Of course, the purchasers of these bargain pens were very unhappy when Montblanc refused to service them.

 

In the past, my replaced nib was returned with my pen as part of having a different nib installed at the full price, about 7 years ago I think. Times have changed.

 

Montblanc should print this policy on their repair orders so that the issue is clear when their customers sign them.

 

Fred

Edited April 17, 2015 by FredRydr

[NHsueh]

Would they accept a pen without a nib if you sent it in asking for a new nib? That way you get to keep the original nib, which is quite useful since Mb is now doing a more switchable nib unit.

[meiers]

Would they accept a pen without a nib if you sent it in asking for a new nib? That way you get to keep the original nib, which is quite useful since Mb is now doing a more switchable nib unit.

No, they would not. These people are not simpletons.

[Paul Raposo]

Yeah, Olivia at the Mississauga service department told me the same thing.

 

I took in a 161P to have the cap replaced and asked for the old one back and she told me she can't do that. All the parts she removes from pens have to be sent back to Richemont/Montbalnc USA.

 

I'm sure they melt the gold for scrap, but what happens to all the barrels, caps, clips, feeds, etc is a mystery.

[EclecticCollector]

So if I understand this correctly, doing a nib swap now on an older pen still costs full price, but you no longer get the original nib back?

 

Non-nib parts they have never returned to my knowledge, not returning swapped nibs is news to me.

Edited April 18, 2015 by EclecticCollector

[meiers]

That's it.

[meiers]

That's it.

[Mister Mont Blanc]

I also just found out as well that the warranty does not cover "any breakage" on the pen, even if the pen was sold with the damage or the damage resulted from incorrect assembly. The lady on the phone said the warranty now basically covers "discoloration," whatever that means. They are also charging level two service for things that used to be covered under level one service. Seems they are really finding ways of increasing profit nowadays! It comes at the cost of losing customers though. In my eyes, this gives me valid reason to buy secondhand since the warranty isn't worth paying extra for.

[Chrissy]

This is interesting. I must contact Montblanc Hamburg and see if this is their policy too.

 

If an owner sends in his pen with his nib and pays the level 3 service price for a brand new nib to be put in his pen, then the original nib never becomes Montblanc's property to keep. The owner bought and paid for that nib. Now he is merely buying another nib from Montblanc. All they are doing within the terms of the contract, is selling him a new nib, and putting it into his pen. It never makes the original nib anyone else's property but the original owners.

 

Unless Montblanc want to send him money as a replacement for it I suppose.

[Mister Mont Blanc]

This is interesting. I must contact Montblanc Hamburg and see if this is their policy too.

 

If an owner sends in his pen with his nib and pays the level 3 service price for a brand new nib to be put in his pen, then the original nib never becomes Montblanc's property to keep. The owner bought and paid for that nib. Now he is merely buying another nib from Montblanc. All they are doing within the terms of the contract, is selling him a new nib, and putting it into his pen. It never makes the original nib anyone else's property but the original owners.

 

Unless Montblanc want to send him money as a replacement for it I suppose.

I completely agree with this, especially for the price paid for a new nib under level three service. Maybe they've enacted this policy and in return, reduced the level three service price. Either way, I'd be interested to find out how it works now.

[FredRydr]

This is interesting. I must contact Montblanc Hamburg and see if this is their policy too.

 

The pen that gives rise to the issue (a Proust) is in Hamburg for repair, where the dictate came from.

 

Fred

Edited April 18, 2015 by FredRydr

[FredRydr]

Insofar as nib swaps, Montblanc could simply be saying that the price of a new nib is $X and a nib, and will not offer to sell new nibs without a trade-in.

 

I'm not in a position to test the "submit a pen without a nib" scenario. Anyone?

 

Fred

Edited April 18, 2015 by FredRydr

[Vlad Soare]

I also just found out as well that the warranty does not cover "any breakage" on the pen, even if the pen was sold with the damage or the damage resulted from incorrect assembly. The lady on the phone said the warranty now basically covers "discoloration," whatever that means.

 

That may not be up to them to decide. Many European countries have strict laws regarding the warranty. If you can prove that the pen was sold with the damage, or that the damage is the result of incorrect assembly, then the authorities will force them to fix it whether they like it or not.

Edited April 18, 2015 by Vlad Soare

[kuli1961]

 

As a judge with 25+ years of experience in civil and administrative law, I am joining to Chrissy's post- a customer who requests nib replacement ,providing MB with the entire pen, remains the owner of the pen and it's parts. The content of the price for the service level (e.g. service 3) contains the retail price for the new nib and fee for putting the new nib into customer's pen. MB is under a legal obligation to return the old nib to it's original owner.

Those are the basic rules on the ownership rights over the movable things (latin: res mobilia). Any country-EU, non-EU or overseas country- USA, Canada, Mid or Far East, Australia, etc..- inhered those rules from ancient Roman Law. In Europe, (in particular EU) those rules have been implemented into the legal system under a various Directives and Regulations. Prior to establishment of the EU (EEU)in the 70-ies, those rules existed under the respective country's Property Act (or similar name of the Law).

If MB, somehow, found an legal basis for their current policy complained of here, there must be a sort of adisclaimer, clearly transparent to the customers. If not, such behaviour is in breach with Consumers' Rights Act, also heavily covered (and punished) with Directives & Regulations ,as well as with well developed national and international case law (in EU-Int. Court of Justice, Luxembourg).

Here, the value of the service is not an issue, but nevertheless, we're not talking about bits and pieces (needles and pins), but about dozens and hundreds of EUR.

However, if we're talking about service covered with guarantee, then MB is not under obligation to return "old nib".

[mislav]

I agree with kuli. If you paid that pen it is yours with all parts, and none can take it from you. That what Montblanc do is stealing.

[max dog]

For my 145 EF I asked the MB boutique if I could just order am OM nib with section so I could keep my EF nib. The answer is even if I pay full price for the new nib, they require I surrender my EF nib. This is to prevent counterfeiting.

[JLS1]

As a judge with 25+ years of experience in civil and administrative law, I am joining to Chrissy's post- a customer who requests nib replacement ,providing MB with the entire pen, remains the owner of the pen and it's parts. The content of the price for the service level (e.g. service 3) contains the retail price for the new nib and fee for putting the new nib into customer's pen. MB is under a legal obligation to return the old nib to it's original owner.

Those are the basic rules on the ownership rights over the movable things (latin: res mobilia). Any country-EU, non-EU or overseas country- USA, Canada, Mid or Far East, Australia, etc..- inhered those rules from ancient Roman Law. In Europe, (in particular EU) those rules have been implemented into the legal system under a various Directives and Regulations. Prior to establishment of the EU (EEU)in the 70-ies, those rules existed under the respective country's Property Act (or similar name of the Law).

If MB, somehow, found an legal basis for their current policy complained of here, there must be a sort of adisclaimer, clearly transparent to the customers. If not, such behaviour is in breach with Consumers' Rights Act, also heavily covered (and punished) with Directives & Regulations ,as well as with well developed national and international case law (in EU-Int. Court of Justice, Luxembourg).

Here, the value of the service is not an issue, but nevertheless, we're not talking about bits and pieces (needles and pins), but about dozens and hundreds of EUR.

However, if we're talking about service covered with guarantee, then MB is not under obligation to return "old nib".

 

Thanks for clarifying - this issue raised some questions in my mind about what someone is actually buying from MB:

- a pen in its totality (including the nib); or

- a pen excluding nib, but where a nib is basically 'leased' to the customer for the lifetime of the pen as part of the price.

 

If we assume the first situation, then not returning the old nib is (at least to me) theft, since the customer paid for the nib but didn't receive either the nib back or compensation in lieu. OTOH, if it's the second situation, then MB might be well within its rights to reclaim the old nib (since the customer never actually owned it), but then buying a pen becomes a very strange business transaction.

 

FWIW, I can understand MB's reasoning and I do believe that there is some kind of guarantee provided with MB service (so they're off the hook for returning the part), but this still really leaves a bad taste in my mouth. A better approach (at least to me) would be to mark up the old nib in some way or to offer some kind of FMV compensation for the gold content in the old nib they're keeping.

Edited April 18, 2015 by JLS1

[Chrissy]

I think that if we were talking about the Montblanc nib exchange scheme, then that would be entirely different. There they merely exchanging one nib for another, free of charge, as a service.

 

If we are talking about someone buying a new nib at their current level 3 service price which is:

flat rate 3 -> for 146 -> GBP 209,00 incl. VAT, 149 -> GBP 231,00 incl. VAT

 

then that always did mean that the customer received his old, used, nib back.

[KAC]

Whatever the pretext du jour may be for MB failing to return a nib, the most implausible one of all is the reason they've apparently provided. Legality aside (since the "law" is practically unenforceable for an individual customer, both for economic and time-investment considerations), why anyone would deal with a company that manifests so little regard for the customer's intelligence is beyond me. There are plenty of expert MB service people in business for themselves who can (and do) provide first-class work. Why not patronize them instead of an indifferent conglomerate?

 

As for myself, I've used MB repair twice, but that was decades ago. The first time, I availed myself of the nib exchange offer on my then-new Hemingway: I exchanged a medium for a medium-oblique. The second was a couple of years later when I dropped the pen and the nib was hopelessly damaged. Both times, I had excellent and attentive service along with a typewritten (yes, typewritten) personal note from the company included in the box.

 

Incidentally, the moderators of this forum confidently assert that MB assiduously studies postings here on FPB. If that's in fact the case, maybe MB ought to attend to the recurrent complaints about current repair and customer-service issues. That seems to be a recurring theme, amongst at least a significant minority of clients that purchase their (new) products and then post about them on FPN.

[Vlad Soare]

Legality aside (since the "law" is practically unenforceable for an individual customer, both for economic and time-investment considerations)

Not necessarily. There are governmental agencies whose precise job is to deal with such matters. Where I live all you have to do is provide all proof and information to them, and they will do the rest, including taking the offending vendor to court if needed (though they rarely need to go that far). And you don't have to pay anything.

 

why anyone would deal with a company that manifests so little regard for the customer's intelligence is beyond me. There are plenty of expert MB service people in business for themselves who can (and do) provide first-class work. Why not patronize them instead of an indifferent conglomerate?

Maybe because private experts cannot provide you with a new Montblanc nib if you want yours replaced.

Edited April 19, 2015 by Vlad Soare