Ammonia Alternative

[B_Type13X2]

I am having quite abit of difficulty finding household ammonia, I visited 4 separate stores today and they all carry a wide variety of cleaners but none seem to stock unscented household Ammonia. I would rather my pens not all smell of lemony freshness so I was wondering if anyone knew of any effective substitutes. In a previous topic from a long time ago someone had suggested using Windex with Ammonia-D in it, but I am wondering if the other ingredients in it would be damaging.

[Wahl]

I never use ammonia in my pens, as it will possibly damage them.

 

Water should be enough to clean your pens, if necessary add a few drops of common dishwasher detergent.

[Cob]

Ammonia is easily available on Amazon. Some people suggest vinegar, which is a waste of time and vinegar, because it does nothing except smell of vinegar.

 

Ammonia should be used as a 10% solution and kept away always from hard rubber barrels and caps; the results are most unpleasant - this writer KNOWS. For some reason I do not understand, hard rubber feeds are seemingly unaffected.

 

Cob

Edited January 9, 2015 by Cob

[B_Type13X2]

Ammonia is easily available on Amazon. Some people suggest vinegar, which is a waste of time and vinegar, because it does nothing except smell of vinegar.

 

Ammonia should be used as a 10% solution and kept away always from hard rubber barrels and caps; the results are most unpleasant - this writer KNOWS. For some reason I do not understand, hard rubber feeds are seemingly unaffected.

 

Cob

 

for some reason the canadian version of amazon is not stalking anything but ammonia wipes and ammonia free cleaners, that was my first stop and its frustrating. I would rather make my own flush to run through every few flushes.

[Wheatflower]

I am having quite abit of difficulty finding household ammonia, I visited 4 separate stores today and they all carry a wide variety of cleaners but none seem to stock unscented household Ammonia.

May I ask what kind of stores you have been at? I get my plain ammonia from a grocery store, and it's the sort of thin I'd expect any grocery store to have on hand. (Indeed, my local,store carries two different brands of it.)

[Buzz_130]

If you are having a hard time finding ammonia, how about using a pen flush? Goulet is now selling their pen flush with ammonia, and J & B is available on many online pen stores. It's arguably not the most cost effective solution to cleaning those stubborn pens, but it's convenient and readily available.

 

Buzz

[B_Type13X2]

May I ask what kind of stores you have been at? I get my plain ammonia from a grocery store, and it's the sort of thin I'd expect any grocery store to have on hand. (Indeed, my local,store carries two different brands of it.)

 

I went to home hardware, Canadian tire had it but had lemon scented (no thanks), Then off to Save on foods, and then Safeway. No one had clear unscented Ammonia.

[Chrissy]

If you are having a hard time finding ammonia, how about using a pen flush? Goulet is now selling their pen flush with ammonia, and J & B is available on many online pen stores. It's arguably not the most cost effective solution to cleaning those stubborn pens, but it's convenient and readily available.

 

Buzz

I would also go down the Pen Flush route. I believe that 2 of the common choices are Goulet's pen flush or J.B.'s Perfect Pen Flush that is available online from Fahrney's

Edited January 10, 2015 by Chrissy

[B_Type13X2]

I would also go down the Pen Flush route. I believe that 2 of the common choices are Goulet's pen flush or J.B.'s Perfect Pen Flush that is available online from Fahrney's

I have some goulet pen-flush but @ 11$ for 8oz its expensive for the quantity provided. Which is why I want to make my own rather then continuing to buy it.

[Ron Z]

Water alone is not enough to clean a pen. It can not break down some of the dried on, concentrated ink, let alone some of the modern boutique inks. Ammonia in short cycles with a good rinse after, while not completely without risk, is a low enough risk that it can be used safely.

 

If you can not find ammonia, though a bit expensive, you can use Koh-I-Noor Rapido Eze, which will clean out India ink as well. I find that a few drops of Dawn Ultra will also work well in an ultrasonic.

[JimCouch]

Thanks for the info Ron. Any issue with using the lemon scented ammonia? (Other than maybe the scent?) Or should one stick with unscented.

[Cob]

 

for some reason the canadian version of amazon is not stalking anything but ammonia wipes and ammonia free cleaners, that was my first stop and its frustrating. I would rather make my own flush to run through every few flushes.

Sorry about that, of course I couldn't know. Here in "'elf 'n'safety" obssessed Britain I was quite surprised to be able to buy it on line; I cannot find it in the shops I visit.

 

After living six years in France where one can buy Alcohol, Acetone and Hydrochloric acid in any supermarket, returning to Blighty was a culture shock.

 

Best wsihes

 

Cob

[Sandy1]

Hi,

 

+ for Koh-i-Noor Rapido-Eze or equivalent technical / draughting pen cleaner.

 

If one removes as much ink as is practical/reasonable with plain water, the pen cleaning solution is only cleaning-up the stubborn residue, so should last a very long time indeed. Also, those cleaners are often available at art supply and draughting supply stores, so cost of shipping can be avoided.

 

By going into such shops there is considerable temptation to make unplanned purchases of dip pens, nibs, dip pen inks and fancy paper.

 

I also agree with the esteemed Mr Zorn that plain water is insufficient to clean-up some inks.* Even though one may go for months on end rinsing their pens with water, the 'headroom' of the pen's ability to operate with a load of gunk/residue is continually being reduced, performance degrades, and the risk exposure to a nasty reaction of that residue with some inks increases.

 

That said, many simple aniline dye inks can be thoroughly removed from a pen with patience and plain water. With a new ink, it is my personal practice to use an escalating series of cleaning solutions to confirm that no residue remains after a plain water clean-up. (As my Tedium Tolerance is low, I often use a cleaning solution as a matter of course, especially with slow to clean pens such as Parker Vacumatics, Sheaffer Snorkies, Waterman Carenes, most lever fillers, etc.)

 

The nuances of pen handling during use also influence clean-up. I do not let ink linger in an idle pen, so most often clean-up is uneventful.

 

Bye,

S1

 

__ __

* Clean-up of Noodler's 54th Massachusetts : https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/topic/255965-noodlers-54-massachusetts/?p=2825711

Edited January 11, 2015 by Sandy1

[Moshe ben David]

If you are having a hard time finding ammonia, how about using a pen flush? Goulet is now selling their pen flush with ammonia, and J & B is available on many online pen stores. It's arguably not the most cost effective solution to cleaning those stubborn pens, but it's convenient and readily available.

 

Buzz

 

JB's Pen Flush is indeed available at a multitude of online stores. Cost is not quite as bad as it first appears in that you do not need to dispose of the flushing liquid after passing it through your pen. Basically, you flush it back into the bottle for most inks. As long as you can see through the solution in the bottle it is still OK to use. Only if it gets so murky that you can no longer see through it would you need to dispose of it.

 

And just to 'clear up' (had to do that ) a misunderstanding: when dealing with solutions, there is a definition difference between 'clear/transparent' vs 'colorless'. A liquid with color can also be clear/transparent if you can see through it. Colorless simply means no apparent color to the human eye, e.g., drinking water.

[inkstainedruth]

Ammonia is easily available on Amazon. Some people suggest vinegar, which is a waste of time and vinegar, because it does nothing except smell of vinegar.

Cob

Not strictly true. If you're using iron gall inks, you want to do a vinegar solution flush (with a water flush beforehand and in between) before doing an ammonia solution flush, because iron gall inks are generally relatively acidic (i.e., low pH) and, IIRC, ammonia is fairly basic (high pH). You don't want bad chemical reactions between the ink and the flush -- that will cause stuff turning into solids which are Very Bad for your feed....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Cob]

Not strictly true. If you're using iron gall inks, you want to do a vinegar solution flush (with a water flush beforehand and in between) before doing an ammonia solution flush, because iron gall inks are generally relatively acidic (i.e., low pH) and, IIRC, ammonia is fairly basic (high pH). You don't want bad chemical reactions between the ink and the flush -- that will cause stuff turning into solids which are Very Bad for your feed....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

Thanks very much for that, well worth bearing in mind as I am now using some Rohrer & Klingner inks (Salix and Scabiosa) which are iron gall types.

 

Of course I was referring to the suggestions that vinegar be useful for cleaning pens, which, as I am sure you'll agree, it isn't - that is it certainly does not dissolve dried-up ink.

 

Cob

Edited January 11, 2015 by Cob

[Oldane]

Ammonia is easily available on Amazon. Some people suggest vinegar, which is a waste of time and vinegar, because it does nothing except smell of vinegar.

 

As Ruth has written above, Vinegar and ammonia have two different uses.

 

Ammonia is used for removal (bleaching) of ink stains. Sometimes it works, sometimes it don't. If possible, manual cleaning with a Q-tip may be just efficient.

 

Vinegar does nothing if modern dye based inks without iron-gall are used. Vinegar is used for dissolving iron-gall residues. Vinegar is acidic and iron-gall is soluble in acid. If one uses ink with iron-gall content, vinegar may be useful. OTOH, I have found it just as easy to clean out ink channels of the feed with a needle if needed. Some users of iron-gall ink begin cleaning with vinegar, then clean water, then ammonia, the finally clean water (in that order). Having used iron-gall containing inks for many years (MB BB, then MM MB and now mostly Salix), I have not found such an elaborate precedure necessary to keep my Pelikan pens flowing well. It may depend on the actual pen, though. Thorough cosmetic cleaning with a sale in mind might be another matter. The more "heavy duty" Iron-gall inks like Diamine RI and ESSRI may also necessitate more thorough cleaning precedures from time to time.

Edited January 11, 2015 by Oldane

[Wheatflower]

. Some users of iron-gall ink begin cleaning with vinegar, then clean water, then ammonia, the finally clean water (in that order).

I do this, but only when switching between an iron-gall ink and a non-iron-gall. Ink PH is all over the place, and I really don't like taking apart pens to clean them. When I switch between two iron-gall inks I just flush with water.

[Samthor]

Hi,

Unless you find lemon scent particularly unpleasant – even more than ammonia – and since, surprisingly, there's no plain ammonia to be had, I suggest go ahead and buy the scented stuff. If a pen has the slightest smell of lemon, or ammonia, after rinsing with water, well, it needs more rinsing.

Cheers

Samthor

[GTVi]

Heavily diluted windex (with demineralized water) is the simplest solution (no pun inteneded) 10:1

Flush using this mixture.

Then rinse well with just the water.

I have been doing it for years, but then again I always flush my pens between uses and for storage.

A pen that has ink "caked" in for years is more challenging to remove, and usually requires more extreme measures.

 

The other ingredients of Windex, as used by a window cleaner as an occupation, is more toxic in large doses to humans than it is to pens.

 

I would not use vinegar, it loves "eating" certain metals if it remains long enough or not flushed. But in small doses it will do neither harm nor any good IMHO.