Visconti Pens' Aesthetics

[RMN]

If you design a pen on a certain theme, or in honour of a famous person, a city, etc, you have to use images and designs that the larger public can connect to that person/city etc.

That means copying.

 

A Churchill pen will perhaps use images of his cigar. A Patton pen of his dog, the Titanic of the iceberg etc. (Not all designs by Visconti, just examples)

You can try to be original, but that will not give the connection. Perhaps Churchill loved violets, (I don't know, just a silly example) but a pen with a Violet theme will give very few people the connection to the statesman. It might be highly original, but it won't work.

 

Not that I like all the designs, far from it, and sometimes I fail to make the connection.

 

The Manhattan is a pretty pen, in my opinion. But the connection to the part of New York is thin. You could see a skyscraper by night with many lights on, but there are skyscrapers all over the world. That does not change that I like the visual design, whatever the name.

 

So I think you are expecting unreasonable qualities.

Again, that does have nothing to do with the endresult. You can like it, or not. (I dislike several) But saying: I don't like it because it is not original seems unfair to me.

 

D.ick

[jar]

If you design a pen on a certain theme, or in honour of a famous person, a city, etc, you have to use images and designs that the larger public can connect to that person/city etc.

That means copying.

 

A Churchill pen will perhaps use images of his cigar. A Patton pen of his dog, the Titanic of the iceberg etc. (Not all designs by Visconti, just examples)

You can try to be original, but that will not give the connection. Perhaps Churchill loved violets, (I don't know, just a silly example) but a pen with a Violet theme will give very few people the connection to the statesman. It might be highly original, but it won't work.

 

Not that I like all the designs, far from it, and sometimes I fail to make the connection.

 

The Manhattan is a pretty pen, in my opinion. But the connection to the part of New York is thin. You could see a skyscraper by night with many lights on, but there are skyscrapers all over the world. That does not change that I like the visual design, whatever the name.

 

So I think you are expecting unreasonable qualities.

Again, that does have nothing to do with the endresult. You can like it, or not. (I dislike several) But saying: I don't like it because it is not original seems unfair to me.

 

D.ick

 

Well, let's look at a couple themed pens. The Sheaffer Roaring Twenties has engravings of items from the period. The Montegrappa Romeo or Juliet have clips that are casts of a young man and young woman.

 

I simply don't see any similar thought in the Visconti pens.

 

Others may.

[kazoolaw]

Maybe you can explain the connection between Copernicus and the Conklin clip? Or Millenium and crescent fillers? Or how the Ragtime clip reflects ragtime?

 

Copying other designs and innovations then claim originality doesn't make sense to me.

First, let's stay on task: your initial complaint was that the clips were after thoughts. I gather you concede that not all of them are by you changing the subject, and changing your complaint.

 

Sadly, I can't link to photos from my iPad, so I can't put up a Conklin and a Copernicus clip side-by-side. I'm guessing that it's really the name "Copernicus" that you object to, which is an entirely a different matter.

 

You dislike the reference to the turn of a thousand years being incorporated into the name of a pen. Or the reference to the music of the era when accommodation clips were more common. But a roaring twenties pen meets your approval because it has period engravings: not very original is it?

 

Nor does your last sentence itself make sense, as nether Visconti nor I made those claims for these pens.

 

We understand that you don't like Visconti pens. Good thing there are others to choose from.

 

gary

Edited October 5, 2014 by gary

[jar]

First, let's stay on task: your initial complaint was that the clips were after thoughts. I gather you concede that not all of them are by you changing the subject, and changing your complaint.

 

Sadly, I can't link to photos from my iPad, so I can't put up a Conklin and a Copernicus clip side-by-side. I'm guessing that it's really the name "Copernicus" that you object to, which is an entirely a different matter.

 

You dislike the reference to the turn of a thousand years being incorporated into the name of a pen. Or the reference to the music of the era when accommodation clips were more common. But a roaring twenties pen meets your approval because it has period engravings: not very original is it?

 

Nor does your last sentence itself make sense, as nether Visconti nor I made those claims for these pens.

 

We understand that you don't like Visconti pens. Good thing there are others to choose from.

 

gary

 

Well no, I'm not conceding that the clips look like after thoughts. So far absolutely none of your explanations for Visconti seem realistic.

[kazoolaw]

Well no, I'm not conceding that the clips look like after thoughts.

Of course not: You were the one that claimed they WERE.

 

So far absolutely none of your explanations for Visconti seem realistic.

I hope that your reality re-aligns soon.

 

gary

[RMN]

Of course not: You were the one that claimed they WERE.

 

 

I hope that your reality re-aligns soon.

 

gary

Not a matter of reality.

 

The reality is that Jar does not like them, which is his good right.

 

Sometimes people try to rationalise taste. They hardly ever succeed to convince others in that. In this case Jar does not succeed, nor do we vice versa. So be it.

 

D.ick

[Namo]

One can understand a design and still not like it. The case here is a bit different: Jar just says he doesn't understand Visconti designs, ergo it's bad design... One taste is not an universal criterium.

[kazoolaw]

Not a matter of reality.

 

D.ick

Millenium referring to Y2K is a reality.

 

Ragtime as an era is a reality.

 

The explanations, to which jar objects, are genuine, and accurate.

 

You are free to like, despise, or yawn at a pen design at your discretion. You may claim that the connection is too tenuous between a model name and its design, so be it. You may have an irrational revulsion toward a certain pen. See my own postscript above. We may agree that all marketing is hyperbolic.

 

But let's try to be clear and consistent in our own conversations.

 

gary

[jar]

Of course not: You were the one that claimed they WERE.

 

 

I hope that your reality re-aligns soon.

 

gary

 

 

Gary, that was simply a case of fumble fingers.

 

It really is simply, I do not see any signs of forethought or originality in Visconti pens and in particular, their clips.

 

You do. That's fine. I certainly would not and have not suggested anyone should take my opinion other than as my opinion. If like you, they appreciate the aesthetic of Visconti, great.

 

I just haven't found any that I would want. It's not a matter of facts but opinion and it is not just one make. I have not found a Krone I'd want, a modern Onoto I'd want, a Sailor or Platinum or several other makes.

 

Others like what I do not.

 

But the thread was asking opinions on the aesthetics of Visconti pens and my opinion is that aesthetics are jess plain lacking when it comes to the clips they chose to use.

[kazoolaw]

Opinions vary, which makes the pursuit all the more fun. Go and enjoy a pen.

 

And, lest the OP feel ignored, some of the early LEs were a bit out there. Being just a guy I can't say for sure, but I suspect that at some point the esthetic changes for high-end collectors.

 

gary

Edited October 5, 2014 by gary

[cellmatrix]

According to Dante Del Vecchio, founder of Visconti:

 

"The Visconti clip, for instance, represents the bridge, a symbol for friendship, of union between peoples. Its a unifying not a dividing element."


So Jar, you and Gary should just gaze at that clip and think about friendship and unity today, and every day.

Edited October 5, 2014 by cellmatrix

[kazoolaw]

According to Dante Del Vecchio, founder of Visconti:

 

"The Visconti clip, for instance, represents the bridge, a symbol for friendship, of union between peoples. Its a unifying not a dividing element."[/size]

 

 

So Jar, you and Gary should just gaze at that clip and think about friendship and unity today, and [/size]every day.

[/size]

And, my friend, what makes you think we don't?

 

It's just like DDV to prove Jar was right all along.

 

gary

Edited October 5, 2014 by gary

[cellmatrix]

[parban]

Among different models of Visconti, the Opera Club Honey Almond looks the best to me. I was looking the images of the Camelots and they are so costly while honey almond being almost onethird in price looked far superior to my eyes.I would like to know the opinion of the esteemed visitors.Thanks and regards to all.