Odd Problem With Two Nos Sheaffers

[Sailor Kenshin]

I recently bought a NOS Prelude and a 330 Imperial (actually I don't recall if the Imperial was NOS). Love the way they both look, though. Both have M nibs.

 

Didn't flush either before inking. I always fill pens as-is, just to see how they behave.

 

I loaded the Imperial with a Skrip Gray cart. It needed a dip to start, but following that, it wrote stingily, then normally, within the same paragraph. After a week of this I opened the barrel. The cart had leaked everywhere. Cap fulla ink......lucky I didn't also get ink everywhere.

 

The cart may have been at fault here. Perhaps it had developed a crack.

 

I cleaned the pen and flushed it. On to the Prelude.

 

Loaded with the same color. This would not write at all without a dip in either ink or water. After a week of this, opened barrel.

 

Cap full of ink. Cart NOT leaking this time. Nib unit sitting in water and dish soap now.

 

Any ideas on the problem, hints, tips? Thanks.

[whych]

Could be that the seals have been removed. There is a seal that is accessed by removing the metal connector from the section.

Look at this thread for an idea of how to do it. Make sure you use a dowel or something to plug the connector to save it from being made oval and wrap lots of masking tape around your pliers to stop you damaging the threads. You should be able to use reasonably hot (not boiling) water as a heat source to loosen any glue if needed.

Of course, if they are White dot pens, Sheaffer may fix them for free, so try asking them first.

They swapped my nib that disintegrated around the edges of the clutch ring for free here in UK. so they may do the seals for free.

Edited February 18, 2013 by whych

[Ron Z]

The Prelude and Imperial are very different animals.

 

The Prelude has a molded plastic section, threads part of the section, no seal inside. Nib and feed are a press fit into the section. The same feed was used for the open nib pens - Prelude, Balance/Connoisseur and No Nonsense. When a gold nib was installed, the ID of the section was smaller.

 

There should be a metal piercing tube in the section that extends to the end of the feed. If it's missing or does not go all of the way to the end of the feed, the writing unit is defective. You do see cases where these tubes have shifted down into the bushing inside, on occasion. They can be repaired, but this is a defect.

 

The Imperial does have an 0-ring inside the section, but also has the metal piercing tube. I've never seen one fail unless the section has been opened up. Be careful removing the metal connector threads to open the section. Sheaffer used a white glue on the later pens to secure it that can be softened with heat, but the plastic around the pressure ring (the tabs) is relatively thin compared to the rest of the section, and it can be distorted or melt if you get it to hot.

[Sailor Kenshin]

Thanks!

 

I'm probably not up to that level of repair, but I will at least take a flashlight to the sections and see what's going on.

[Harlequin]

So, since they have the same feed, does that mean that the nib units from the Prelude and Connoisseur can be swapped into a NoNonsense (and vice versa) without any modification?

[Ron Z]

So, since they have the same feed, does that mean that the nib units from the Prelude and Connoisseur can be swapped into a NoNonsense (and vice versa) without any modification?

 

No. Well, sort of. Reread my post comments...

 

For this discussion BTW, when I say No Nonsense, I'm talking about the original variety with threaded barrels and without the silly rubber grip.

 

The section threads on the Balance/Connoisseur/No Nonsense pens are the the same, and the sections are the same length. Which means that you can swap the complete writing units between pens. Since the feeds are the same and you can swap the writing units (as Sheaffer called the nib assembly) between pens, you might think that you could swap the nibs themselves between sections. You can't.

 

The Prelude and No Nonsense pens have steel nibs. The Connoisseur and Balance II pens in their various forms have gold nibs. The steel nibs are thicker so the ID of the section is larger. The thinner gold nibs of the Connoisseur and Balance II pens are quite loose in a No Nonsense section and would be in a Prelude section as well. The other way of looking at it is that the steel (even gold plated steel) nibs of the Prelude and No Nonsense pens are too thick to fit into a Connoisseur section.

 

I have installed Prelude nibs in No Nonsense sections though. The Prelude nibs are tipped with better material (as in they ARE tipped)VS the cheap No Nonsense nibs. I also have some loose LO nibs which make for an interesting No Nonsense. But then I also gold plated the trim on my orange No Nonsense just because I like the orange and gold, and could do it.

 

Make sense?

Edited February 19, 2013 by Ron Z

[Harlequin]

Followed that pretty well. But let me ask a couple of follow -up questions. What does LO mean, left oblique? And am I understanding you here correctly: if I have a Prelude nib OR nib unit (what you called nib assembly, meaning the nib, section and feed), I could actually swap either/or into a NNS to replace its nib or nib assembly, yes? Likewise, the nib assemblies/nib units ARE swappable between the Prelude, NNS, Connoisseur and Balance (technically, the Balance II, right)- but not the nibs alone of the Conns/Balances to the Preludes/NNSes ?

 

 

[Pincel]

... if I have a Prelude nib OR nib unit (what you called nib assembly, meaning the nib, section and feed), I could actually swap either/or into a NNS to replace its nib or nib assembly, yes?

No, you can't swap a Prelude nib assembly (nib, section and feed) into a NNS, Balance II, Connie. The threads are different and the whole section of the Prelude looks a lot longer than those of Connie, B2, and NNS. As for the nib alone, you could try but I don't think it's practical and easy. Ask a competent pen repairman/restorer like Ron, he has done it.

 

Pimp up your NNS pens and fit them with Balance II Lifetime and Feathertouch nibs or even better with Connaisseur nibs. Give these lowly NNS a touch of class! WARNING: The original two-tone 18k Grande Connie section with metal sleeve hiding the nipple won't fit the NNS, some Balance IIs nor the standard 1st edition Connies.

Edited February 19, 2013 by Pincel

[Harlequin]

I think I did in fact misread Ron's reply, I included the Prelude where-as he did not. So to ammend my earlier question , according to what Ron said above, since the Balance II/Connoisseur nib assembly is threaded the same and is also the same length as that of the NNS, those are the ones that can be swapped in. But not the Prelude nib assembly. OTOH, the nib itself from a Prelude will fit in a NNS section, but the nibs from the B2/Connies won't. Right?

[Ron Z]

Correct. I have fit a Prelude nib into a No Nonsense section. Getting the nib and feed out of the section, and especially the feed, can be difficult because it can be quite tightly fit in to the end of the section.

 

Pincel is correct - the metal threaded sections will not fit - they fit only the Connoisseurs with a metal overlay.

[Pincel]

I think I did in fact misread Ron's reply, I included the Prelude where-as he did not. So to ammend my earlier question , according to what Ron said above, since the Balance II/Connoisseur nib assembly is threaded the same and is also the same length as that of the NNS, those are the ones that can be swapped in. But not the Prelude nib assembly. OTOH, the nib itself from a Prelude will fit in a NNS section, but the nibs from the B2/Connies won't. Right?

Even if I could fit nibs from B2/Connies into No Nonsense sections, I WOULDN'T, when it is much easier to just swap the whole sections! Why do it the hard way? Moreover, why house a more expensive, better Connie, Balance II nib in a cheapo looking No Nonsense section?

[Harlequin]

Well, I wouldn't be moving the NNS nib assemblies into the Connies/B2s. But if I ever had a nib assembly from one of those and the rest of the pen was not salvageable, I would definitely want to put it in a NNS so I could keep using it.

[Ron Z]

I did this once. I had a stainless No Nonsense (really quite the cool pen) which is IMO a couple steps above the normal No Nonsense. I bought a Balance nib assembly to use in the pen. When I sold it I kept the nib and put a regular NN section with a Prelude LO nib in it.

 

If I had an Old Timer, which is an upscale No Nonsense, I'd be inclined to put a better nib in it than the gold plated one it comes with.

[Harlequin]

Hey, that reminds me... have anyone ever seen a NNS (not an old timer) with a gold cap button? Not marbled like a vintage either, just a solid color.

[Pincel]

Hey, that reminds me... have anyone ever seen a NNS (not an old timer) with a gold cap button? Not marbled like a vintage either, just a solid color.

The only one I have is the Vintage Solid Black, not marbled but it's still part a No-Nonsense Vintage series. The Le Bourdeaux and Le Black as well as the Old Timer are also not marbled, just solid color (black and burgundy) No Nonsense pens that have gold plated furniture BUT no "gold cap button"/insert/medallion/whatever.

[terim]

1361328453[/url]' post='2604548']

Hey, that reminds me... have anyone ever seen a NNS (not an old timer) with a gold cap button? Not marbled like a vintage either, just a solid color.

 

Yes, we had them in solid black for a while .....

Teri

 

 

[Harlequin]

Wasn't that a black (not marbled) Vintage? It is listed on this page, so I assumed that was actually the first, or "base", Vintage model. But my question is, is there any difference between that one and a Le Black? The only one I would guess is that the Le Black has a gold ring on the section, where-as the Black Vintage doesn't (none of the Vintage models do, right)? Oh yeah, iirc, the Le Black also doesn't have a cap button either.

Edited February 21, 2013 by Harlequin

[Pincel]

Wasn't that a black (not marbled) Vintage? It is listed on this page, so I assumed that was actually the first, or "base", Vintage model. But my question is, is there any difference between that one and a Le Black? The only one I would guess is that the Le Black has a gold ring on the section, where-as the Black Vintage doesn't (none of the Vintage models do, right)? Oh yeah, iirc, the Le Black also doesn't have a cap button either.

Trust Gary Elison's well-researched sheaffertarga.com website. The pen IS a Le Black NOT the Vintage Solid Black. I know, that was my Le Black I sold him last year. The differences between Le Black and Vintage Solid Black?

4 grams (Le Black - 17.2 g; Vintage Solid Black - 13.2 g)

2 mm (Le Black is about 2 mm longer in length than the Vintage Black).

 

Ben

Edited February 21, 2013 by Pincel

[Harlequin]

I should send him an email with pics of my Le Bordeaux if he wants them to add to that website. I have enjoyed it immensely, especially the photos of the many many varieties of NNSes!

[Sailor Kenshin]

Update: I think it's the cart's fault.

 

Of all three new Sheaffers, the only one to NOT leak into the cap was my VFM, which doesn't use Sheaffer carts.

 

I switched one of the Skrip gray carts into a very reliable NN viewpoint with the F italic nib. Didn't wanna start. Dipped it. Started. Next day, ink in cap.

 

Cleaned section, cleaned cart. Cart has minute split on either side of piercing.

 

Which end of the cart do you poke anyhow? :bonk: