Sepia Inks - Multi Ink Review

[Uncle Red]

Wow David, you've had a busy month and a half. I hope everyone in the car was ok.

[dcpritch]

... I hope everyone in the car was ok.

 

I was the only passenger of my car, and the young gal who ran a red light while changing lanes and texting her boyfriend was the only passenger of hers. Both cars totally destroyed, but no serious or permanent injuries. I have been to the doc a number of times, though, working on my back and neck. My face wasn't damaged in the crash but still the doc offered to help make it better.

[Torculus Resupinus]

Oof! Reminds me of an accident I drove into 40 years ago -- glad no-one was badly hurt.

 

Sailor LE Rikyu-cha is my favorite ink, but it doesn't belong in a sepia comparison. The true color is green-grey without any brown in it -- paper chromatography will demonstrate this. But somehow it bewitches the beholder into seeing a brown tint in the writing.

 

I am dying to see a one-on-one face-off between Rohrer & Klingner Sepia and Hakase Sepia -- the latter is the genuine article, being based on cuttlefish ink (it's not clear which species of the genus Sepia, however; the classic Sepia officinalis is confined to the Mediterranean, North, and Baltic Seas, and this is a Japanese ink). I have had a lot of trouble before finding a pen that would really show off the best of R&K Sepia, and I would become even more enthusiastic if I could be convinced that it is nearly identical to the real thing.

 

The other "sepia" ink I have is the Diamine, which I value in almost the opposite way as a shade of brown that is just sober enough for continuous writing but altogether bright enough to stand out in mark-up of a black-and-white print-out.

 

(I also have Winsor & Newton Sepia, but although it claims to be FP safe I use it only in dip pens, and it really is just a basic brown.)

[dcpritch]

... I have had a lot of trouble before finding a pen that would really show off the best of R&K Sepia, and I would become even more enthusiastic if I could be convinced that it is nearly identical to the real thing. ...)

 

I plan to use three different nibs in the comparison, a really wide, wet stub, a medium or smaller broad nib, and a smaller nib. Do you have any suggestions as to pens/nibs to use?

[Gobblecup]

... I have had a lot of trouble before finding a pen that would really show off the best of R&K Sepia, and I would become even more enthusiastic if I could be convinced that it is nearly identical to the real thing. ...)

 

I plan to use three different nibs in the comparison, a really wide, wet stub, a medium or smaller broad nib, and a smaller nib. Do you have any suggestions as to pens/nibs to use?

 

This is a more fanciful suggestion, but I would appreciate seeing use in a nice flexible nib, perhaps a vintage nib for the best effect...

[Soundsider]

Even with a modern flex like Pilot Falcon Diamine's Sepia brings back the smell of ammonia. (...comment meant for those who remember the real process of sepia reproduction).

 

There are other browns out there that come close, but this one hits the mark with vintage look and great shading.

[dcpritch]

... I would appreciate seeing use in a nice flexible nib, perhaps a vintage nib for the best effect...

 

Actually, I wrote my last post in a hurry, and forgot to mention that my third pen to use will be a vintage flex nib, so I will be comparing the inks with a wide wet stub, a Medium nib, and a vintage flex nib (I'm thinking Waterman 54 with a super-flex nib that I got last summer from Mauricio )

 

Even with a modern flex like Pilot Falcon Diamine's Sepia brings back the smell of ammonia. (...comment meant for those who remember the real process of sepia reproduction). There are other browns out there that come close, but this one hits the mark with vintage look and great shading.

 

Diamine Sepia is in hand and ready for the comparison! Also, I've been using OMAS Sepia for the past two weeks in a Tibaldi with a Minuskin stub nib and it is such a great shading ink with a great color, but very different from Diamine (and from R&K, Visconti, Noodlers, etc.). One of the reasons to do this comparison is because of the remarkable difference between each manufacturer's idea of how sepia ink should look.

[Torculus Resupinus]

If you've got it, a good F/EF (generous but not too wet, springy but not flex) would be a good point of comparison. That describes the nib I finally got R&K Sepia to please me in -- a Bock for Nero Muse. A 1950s Pelikan would also do the job nicely. Keep in mind, a lot of FPNers are committed to broad nibs and stubs, but there are also plenty of those who prefer a finer line. To make the comparison most useful, show the effect of the widest variety of nibs. (Myself, my grail nib is a fine cursive italic . . .)

[Bronze]

- Looking forward to this!

[Bo Bo Olson]

When testing, I can see six nibs and two to three papers; one paper a normal copy paper.

Ink testing don't seem to have any logic.

 

If the ink is dry, medium or wet could/should influence what nibs do best.

 

B, M, F and EF in regular flex will give you one set of tones. (could be nail and regular flex will give similar results)

A semi-flex will give deeper tone being wetter, and different widths will make for major differences. Obliques, cursive italics/stubs will too.

 

An easy full flex or wet noodle some other tones.

 

One has to test on a regular copy paper and one or two papers that take the ink well.

 

I have a number of inks that dance quite well in M and F, and not so with wider nibs.

 

I ran 8 assorted nibs on two papers with Pelikan Blue Black and got 8 tones. With 8 other nibs I got 4 tones with Waterman Blue Black.

Right now I have MB Winter Forest loaded most (5 pens); having added two pens since starting this post. :hmm1:

 

The idea was not to praise MB Winter Forest so much as to talk about narrow nib shading. With narrow and medium nibs, that wet ink shades well.

My springy nibbed MB B-BB nib gave some shading but had a lot of feathering. Too wet an ink with a wet nib. (My other Bs and regular flex M nibs are loaded with other inks.)

 

 

When using a nib with some flex, there is a difference between, ham fisted, semi-ham fisted and light writing pressure for ink tone.

 

MB Winter Forest my wettest ink...as far as I know a very wet ink. It has been described so by others.

 

On 90 gs/m or 24 pound Hammer paper was better of course than 80g/22 pound copy paper...but each paper including copy did ok with one or two nibs, mostly the F nibs. Also scribbled on was 90 gs/m laid & marbled, and 120 gs/m linen.

 

I'd say the regular flex F came out very good on all the papers.

 

My maxi-semi-flex/'flexi' OF on the Hammered paper. It is great. The oblique wides and narrows gives great shading; three tones when one looks hard. That is The Paper for that nib and ink.

 

On the laid paper it trailed the regular flex F for shading. Close, but second.

 

My semi-flex F, is too wet. The shading is much less when written ham fisted... It still shades ok with a light hand. Whee saved by the bell.

Fine regular has very good shading in this ink, in fact better than semi-flex F.

 

The day before yesterday having discovered I have not two Reforms EF's, but one EF and one XXF. I had to put my wettest ink Winter Forest in the very dry XXF, to my utter shock...I got some touch of shading considering the nib was an XXF.

 

I just put Winter Forest in a Reform F that had been sitting around doing nothing. That was a completely different tone than with the semi-flex M I just loaded, or the semi-flex F or the maxi-semi-flex/’flexi OF.

That semi-flex M was a better shading ink than my semi-flex F. :blink: And my regular flex F shaded better than both. :blink:

The regular flex F and the 'flexi' OF were best, each a bit different.

 

So I think you need a few narrow nibs in your test.

 

Each ink will be different. I have MB sepia in a semi-flex KOB and a vintage regular flex F. I prefer the much darker shade of the semi-flex. The tone difference is enough that one could think they were different inks.

[dcpritch]

I continue to think about this and agree there should be two or maybe three types of paper. Not sure if I have enough of each ink to get six pens loaded, but I do have plans to do a couple of different flex nibs, in addition to the stub and M nibs. Thanks Bo Bo!

[Bo Bo Olson]

I don't think one needs to load each pen fully. One can load a piston or a cartridge/converter with less. Even a rubber sac pen can be loaded low.

 

I have to keep my two rubber sac pens filled, the P-75 is rubber from 1970, and the Esterbrook is from '48-52 original sac and it's on it's last legs at sucking ink.

 

I have mostly piston pens so load them low, if I'm checking out inks.

 

If one organizes the test right, one can do a full test of that nib, then dump the ink back into either the bottle or a small inkwell, so the next pen can be loaded, used and unloaded. That would push the ink supply furtherest.

One could use a syringe to load a cartridge.

 

I am sure one sentence can do a test.

 

I use Let it Be, for my quick test phrase.

Let it Be gives me some action when I use nibs with some flex.

Of course I do that ham fisted and lightly written.

 

I am sure there are other short phrases that do fine.

One don't have to test the whole dumb dog sentence, every time.

 

Some where you might already have how many seconds with what nib and paper it takes an ink to dry.

If its slow start with 15 seconds. If fast 5 then you only need two time tests. It is important to show at least one smeary number in smeared ink shows the soul of the ink...but IMO no need for every couple of seconds.

Some gray ink I looked at recently shaded towards green in the smear. The green was minimized in regular writing. Should you have any ink left, leave the nib and feed on a sheet of Kleenex to see what color separates out. That gray that tinged toward green, was real green when the ink bled into the Kleenex. That was a surprise.

 

The rest; how wet, lubricated, shading and so on, can be written/checked off in an other color if need be on inks with only a sample. Or written under the picture, like Sandy does it.

 

It's going to be a lot of work. I have seen three forms. Each requires a lot of work. One was with two papers and two pens, one was with three pens. One was just one pen and one paper.

 

Could be it would be easier to write all the nibs on one sheet of paper, and do the lube, shade and other tests on a separate like Sandy does.

 

 

So much cleaning of pens.

 

I'm off to clean five right now, my self.

Edited October 21, 2011 by Bo Bo Olson

[Soundsider]

Thank you for doing this test. Your labor of love is appreciated by those of us who appreciate the subtle expression of muted tones.

[BiggieD]

Is it too late to add a suggestion? Stipula Calamo Sepia - I really like this ink and would love to see how it compares!

[dcpritch]

I am not nearly as far along as I thought I would be, but I have begun, and I have my new scanner, so things are moving forward. Sorry about the delay - my September and October were filled with many unexpected happenings.

 

More to come!

[SamCapote]

Also remember, no matter how many you will end up testing, there will always be those who want to know how they all compare with another you never got. In other words, however many you end up doing will be just fine.

[meghan]

dcpritch, do you need samples of Montblanc Sepia and Montblanc Carlo Collodi? If so, I'd be happy to provide.

[tinta]

Quickly scanned through this thread.

Did I miss Pelikan 4001 Brilliant Brown?

To my eyes, this one registers as a darkish Sepia.(at least on Rhodia vellum)

Edited November 1, 2011 by tinta

[dcpritch]

Did I miss Pelikan 4001 Brilliant Brown?

 

 

Nope, Brilliant Brown is on the list! Thanks for checking, though.

[tinta]

Thanks & eureka!