Ph Level Of Inks (Results)

[sivvi]

Hi guys,

 

Longtime reader and first-time poster.

 

I recently got my hands on a PH Pen Tester (can check out the site at http://www.up-aqua.com/00-dm-page/00up_dm-phpen-big.jpg) which allows you to measure the PH Level of any liquid that you dip the thing into. Having a bunch of ink which I have always been curious about, I decided to stick this electronic device into some of my available inks with some expected and unexpected results.

 

Methodology

1) Calibrate the device to ensure that the reading is accurate. This is done by sticking it into a purchased solution with PH 7.

2) Stick the device into the ink and get the PH reading after 30 sec.

3) Wash the device clean.

4) Recalibrate the device by dipping it into the solution to make sure that it measures 7. Otherwise wash clean again. (I will only measure the PH of another ink when my tester records PH 7 when dipped in the solution)

5) Repeat from step 2 onwards.

 

Caveat: I usually dip straight into the ink bottle, but in the event that the bottle hole is too small, like Herbin's I will pour some ink directly into a clean glass container and measure from there.

 

Readings

Expected Results

Caran D'Ache Caribbean Sea - 3.2

Mont Blanc Seasons Greeting White Forest - 5.3

J.B Herbin Bleu Nuit - 6.4

Noodler's Year of the Golden Pig - 7.4

Noodler's Upper Ganges - 7.7

Noodler's La Reine Mauve - 7.7

Namiki Iroshizuku Asa-Gao - 8.4

Sailor Sky Blue - 9.6

 

Caran D'Ache and Mont Blanc are well-known acids, while Japanese brands are the alkaline. While Herbin and Noodler's live up to their (near-)PH Neutral reputations.

 

Unexpected Results

Private Reserve Electric DC Blue - 3.8

Private Reserve Tropical Blue - 4

Noodler's Black - 8.5

 

My PR inks seems to be overly-acidic. Similarly, I thought Noodler's Black to range in 7-7.9. I wonder whether there is any chance of contamination or having left the ink out for too long, but I can't recall. The Black is 1 year old, the Tropical Blue is 4 months and the Electric Blue is only 1 month old (From time of purchase).

 

Any opinion is greatly appreciated.

 

Regards.

Edited August 15, 2011 by sivvi

[handwriter]

Hi and welcome, may I suggest you read the pinned topic, thanks, it is above and in red.

Kind regards

[sivvi]

Hi handwriter,

 

Didn't think that I was ink-bashing (if that is what you are refering to). I tested a bunch of inks and came up with the results, so I was wondering whether there are any problems with my ink bottles, whether it be a bad batch or due to the duration that I had kept them. This is the reason why I broke my silence and posted on this forum, hoping to get some help and explanations on my ink results.

 

Thanks for the advice though, I will sure to take note.

 

Regards.

[corniche]

Hello Sivvi,

 

I would not necessarily call it "bashing" either, per se; you are merely stating your findings, (I know PR American Blue tests at 4.4).

 

That said, before you can make blanket statements about the brand, you really do have to test ALL, (or 90% of them at any rate), of their colors; most PR inks are pH neutral; however, they do have a few that test on the lower end.

 

I know SamCapote has intermittently posted his results on various brands/colors; you may want to try to find one of his posts, (or contact him by PM), and see how your results compare to his.

 

Keep up the good work- but be careful about the "blanket" statements.

 

All the best,

 

Sean

Edited August 15, 2011 by S. P. Colfer

[sivvi]

Hello Sivvi,

 

I would not necessarily call it "bashing" either, per se; you are merely stating your findings, (I know PR American Blue tests at 4.4).

 

That said, before you can make blanket statements about the brand, you really do have to test ALL, (or 90% of them at any rate), of their colors; most PR inks are pH neutral; however, they do have a few that test on the lower end.

 

I know SamCapote has intermittently posted his results on various brands/colors; you may want to try to find one of his posts, (or contact him by PM), and see how your results compare to his.

 

Keep up the good work- but be careful about the "blanket" statements.

 

All the best,

 

Sean

 

Thanks Sean, nothing a little rephrasing can't solve

[Possum Hill]

Hi handwriter,

 

Didn't think that I was ink-bashing (if that is what you are refering to). I tested a bunch of inks and came up with the results, so I was wondering whether there are any problems with my ink bottles, whether it be a bad batch or due to the duration that I had kept them. This is the reason why I broke my silence and posted on this forum, hoping to get some help and explanations on my ink results.

 

Thanks for the advice though, I will sure to take note.

 

Regards.

I've seen brand bashing and what you're doing isn't that. Thanks for posting your results.

[wallylynn]

Do you have any iron-gall inks to test? Many, especially newbies, are afraid the acid will eat their pens. But I've not seen any actual pH numbers.

[handwriter]

Sivvi,

I personnally don't think that what you wrote is brandbashing either, just wanted to make sure you know that certain thinks happened and that certain measures have been taken in this forum.

 

Hi handwriter,

 

Didn't think that I was ink-bashing (if that is what you are refering to). I tested a bunch of inks and came up with the results, so I was wondering whether there are any problems with my ink bottles, whether it be a bad batch or due to the duration that I had kept them. This is the reason why I broke my silence and posted on this forum, hoping to get some help and explanations on my ink results.

 

Thanks for the advice though, I will sure to take note.

 

Regards.

[psrivats]

Do you have any Pilot Iroshizuku inks? I'd love to see what numbers we get from these inks.

[Blizzard42]

Methodology

1) Calibrate the device to ensure that the reading is accurate. This is done by sticking it into a purchased solution with PH 7.

2) Stick the device into the ink and get the PH reading after 30 sec.

3) Wash the device clean.

4) Recalibrate the device by dipping it into the solution to make sure that it measures 7. Otherwise wash clean again. (I will only measure the PH of another ink when my tester records PH 7 when dipped in the solution)

5) Repeat from step 2 onwards.

 

I guess the "purchased solution with pH 7" is a buffer solution (at least I hope so). Is it only possible to calibrate your pH-meter with a pH of 7? In the lab we always have to calibrate with pH 7, 4 and 9.

Am I right that you do rinse the electrode after step 1 with distilled water? You didn't write it, but it's sure you will contaminate the ink if you will go straight from the buffer solution to the ink. The buffer solution is not just out of water, it's made of diverse chemicals which you really don't want to have in your inks.

[sivvi]

Do you have any iron-gall inks to test? Many, especially newbies, are afraid the acid will eat their pens. But I've not seen any actual pH numbers.

Hmmm, I have a bottle of Mont Blanc Black (from the older series) somewhere, not sure whether that is iron-gall.

 

Do you have any Pilot Iroshizuku inks? I'd love to see what numbers we get from these inks.

Sorry, I only have Asa-gao Iroshizuku from Pilot (I labelled as Namiki above), and it registered 8.4.

 

I guess the "purchased solution with pH 7" is a buffer solution (at least I hope so). Is it only possible to calibrate your pH-meter with a pH of 7? In the lab we always have to calibrate with pH 7, 4 and 9.

Am I right that you do rinse the electrode after step 1 with distilled water? You didn't write it, but it's sure you will contaminate the ink if you will go straight from the buffer solution to the ink. The buffer solution is not just out of water, it's made of diverse chemicals which you really don't want to have in your inks.

Honestly, I don't really know how to use this device. Being a Finance student, I haven't touch anything litmus paper for the last 10 years. Haha.

I literally followed every step from the instruction manual, and yes, the rinsing of the tester is written in it.

However, I used tap water instead of distilled water, do you think it will affect the result by alot?

I actually did test the tap water, pH and it was 7.6 or so. Lol.

 

Sivvi,

I personnally don't think that what you wrote is brandbashing either, just wanted to make sure you know that certain thinks happened and that certain measures have been taken in this forum.

Noted

[Blizzard42]

Honestly, I don't really know how to use this device. Being a Finance student, I haven't touch anything litmus paper for the last 10 years. Haha.

I literally followed every step from the instruction manual, and yes, the rinsing of the tester is written in it.

However, I used tap water instead of distilled water, do you think it will affect the result by alot?

I actually did test the tap water, pH and it was 7.6 or so. Lol.

Yes. The rinsing with tap water will affect the results. The other problem is the limestone in the water which will cover your pH-meter over time, giving more inaccurate results. Also, if you don't wipe it dry entirely, you will have rests of the water which will contaminate the ink, maybe changing the pH a bit, like you've seen, tap water is not exactly 7, but distilled water will be.

I don't know how your pH-meter works, but electrodes always need to be kept wet. If they run dry, they will go broken over time. Our electrodes in the lab are super sensitive, if we leave them for a whole day dry, it will be already broken. I don't know for yours, but of course ours are much more accurate and made of glass and some other things in it... I don't know if you got a reactivating solution with your pH-meter, we use a potassium chloride solution from the manufacturer, which is also filled into the electrode.

I really recommend you to use distilled water. You can get it at gas stations, super markets or at some chemist's. It's also very inexpensive. Here it costs 0.77 USD per litre (that's about a quarter gallon). It will certainly participate in keeping your pH-meter in a healthy condition.

[sivvi]

Yes. The rinsing with tap water will affect the results. The other problem is the limestone in the water which will cover your pH-meter over time, giving more inaccurate results. Also, if you don't wipe it dry entirely, you will have rests of the water which will contaminate the ink, maybe changing the pH a bit, like you've seen, tap water is not exactly 7, but distilled water will be.

I don't know how your pH-meter works, but electrodes always need to be kept wet. If they run dry, they will go broken over time. Our electrodes in the lab are super sensitive, if we leave them for a whole day dry, it will be already broken. I don't know for yours, but of course ours are much more accurate and made of glass and some other things in it... I don't know if you got a reactivating solution with your pH-meter, we use a potassium chloride solution from the manufacturer, which is also filled into the electrode.

I really recommend you to use distilled water. You can get it at gas stations, super markets or at some chemist's. It's also very inexpensive. Here it costs 0.77 USD per litre (that's about a quarter gallon). It will certainly participate in keeping your pH-meter in a healthy condition.

 

Icic. I got my tester yesterday and it was fresh out of the box, with some sponge thingy built into the cap that keeps the electron wet.

I will buy some distilled water tomorrow and re-run some of the results to ensure that no results are particularly off.(Just a side note, I wipe the tester after the rinse with the tap water, I don't think the 1-2 drops of tap water residual into the 50ml of ink will change the pH level by much right?)

From your experience, how much do you think the results will vary? +/- 0.1 to 0.5?

Edited August 15, 2011 by sivvi

[Blizzard42]

Yes. The rinsing with tap water will affect the results. The other problem is the limestone in the water which will cover your pH-meter over time, giving more inaccurate results. Also, if you don't wipe it dry entirely, you will have rests of the water which will contaminate the ink, maybe changing the pH a bit, like you've seen, tap water is not exactly 7, but distilled water will be.

I don't know how your pH-meter works, but electrodes always need to be kept wet. If they run dry, they will go broken over time. Our electrodes in the lab are super sensitive, if we leave them for a whole day dry, it will be already broken. I don't know for yours, but of course ours are much more accurate and made of glass and some other things in it... I don't know if you got a reactivating solution with your pH-meter, we use a potassium chloride solution from the manufacturer, which is also filled into the electrode.

I really recommend you to use distilled water. You can get it at gas stations, super markets or at some chemist's. It's also very inexpensive. Here it costs 0.77 USD per litre (that's about a quarter gallon). It will certainly participate in keeping your pH-meter in a healthy condition.

 

Icic. I got my tester yesterday and it was fresh out of the box, with some sponge thingy at the end that keeps the electron wet.

I will buy some distilled water tomorrow and re-run some of the results to ensure that no results are particularly off.(Just a side note, I wipe the tester after the rinse with the tap water, I don't think the 1-2 drops of tap water residual into the 50ml of ink will change the pH level by much right?)

From your opinion, how much do you think the results will vary? +/- 0.1 to 0.5?

 

I guess the drops of water won't be the problem. The problem is, tap water contains minerals, limestone and other things. When you wipe off the electrode, these will remain in small parts on the electrode as residues, staining the electrode more and more over time.

I can't really say how much it changes, I guess you'll see tomorrow.

Also, electrodes are quite sensitive, so you're not allowed to really "wipe" them off, like you would do with nibs. If you do that, you will produce static electricity which is not good for your electrode. Instead, just blot it dry instead of swiping. Always use a clean, dry tissue to do that.

I think it would also be interesting to see how accurate the results of such a cheap pH-meter is. I have the Carribean Sea of the inks you tested, I'll try to measure the pH of it maybe tomorrow with the device in our lab, so we'll have a reference.

 

I've just seen on the picture you posted, that it is possible to calibrate it with a solution with a pH of 4 and of 7. Is it written somewhere in your book how to do that? Do you have also a pH 4 solution? If yes, I'd calibrate it with both, as that will give you more accurate results.

Edited August 15, 2011 by Blizzard42

[sivvi]

I guess the drops of water won't be the problem. The problem is, tap water contains minerals, limestone and other things. When you wipe off the electrode, these will remain in small parts on the electrode as residues, staining the electrode more and more over time.

I can't really say how much it changes, I guess you'll see tomorrow.

Also, electrodes are quite sensitive, so you're not allowed to really "wipe" them off, like you would do with nibs. If you do that, you will produce static electricity which is not good for your electrode. Instead, just blot it dry instead of swiping. Always use a clean, dry tissue to do that.

I think it would also be interesting to see how accurate the results of such a cheap pH-meter is. I have the Carribean Sea of the inks you tested, I'll try to measure the pH of it maybe tomorrow with the device in our lab, so we'll have a reference.

 

I've just seen on the picture you posted, that it is possible to calibrate it with a solution with a pH of 4 and of 7. Is it written somewhere in your book how to do that? Do you have also a pH 4 solution? If yes, I'd calibrate it with both, as that will give you more accurate results.

That sounds awesome! I would also like to know how accurate all my readings are.

Will be eagerly awaiting your results. Thanks

I will pick up the pH 4 solution along with the distilled water tmr. Thanks.

Edited August 15, 2011 by sivvi

[Blizzard42]

Do you mean "Sailor Sky High" by "Sailor Sky Blue"? If yes, I also have that.

[sivvi]

Do you mean "Sailor Sky High" by "Sailor Sky Blue"? If yes, I also have that.

It's one of the six inks released from Sailor latest ink series.

Great that you have it too, makes for more comparison.

[Lloyd]

After some more testing, you could re-run your original samples to see if the meter's calibration has changed.

[The Good Captain]

If it's any help, they all taste the same to me.

[txinsk]

If it's any help, they all taste the same to me.

 

But did you recalibrate your tongue after each sample?

 

Rick