For those who hate Waterman Blue Black

[tonysameh]

I am one of those who hate Waterman BB because of its ugly green tint.

But then I discovered something interesting. The label on the Waterman BB bottle is exactly the same color: A greenish blue black.

So the guys where honest with us.

We are the ones who bought.

[HenryLouis]

Apparently it's a well behaved ink, and many well behaved inks have bad color.

[Aysedasi]

Personally, I like it and use it a lot.....

[Silvermink]

Eh - that's what aniline dye blue-blacks are, though. Never particularly cared for 'em. I'll stick with the MB iron gall blue-black, myself.

[lapis]

A. I like Watermans in general and I'd say that Florida Blue is maybe even NUMBER ONE OF ALL INKS.

B. But I still don't like their BB. Ditto Parker's BB.

C. Maybe/apparently/probably they both come out of the same retort.

 

In any case, too green and muddy for me.

LSS: there are dozens if not hundreds of BBs... just take your pick.

 

Dick

[tawanda]

I much prefer Pelikan BB. Its a lovley chalky greyish BB with no hint of green, unlike my Diamine and Waterman BBs.

[StyloBug33]

Eh - that's what aniline dye blue-blacks are, though. Never particularly cared for 'em. I'll stick with the MB iron gall blue-black, myself.

 

 

What do you mean by aniline dye blue-black. I always thought it was kind of misleading to call a teal-looking ink "Blue-Black" and wondered where that practice came from.

[Silvermink]

Eh - that's what aniline dye blue-blacks are, though. Never particularly cared for 'em. I'll stick with the MB iron gall blue-black, myself.

 

 

What do you mean by aniline dye blue-black. I always thought it was kind of misleading to call a teal-looking ink "Blue-Black" and wondered where that practice came from.

 

From Richard's site:

 

blue-black: An ink color originating with iron gall ink, whose blue component (indigo) fades to leave black as the ink's iron salts oxidize. Modern fountain pen inks are colored with aniline dyes; since there is no true black aniline dye, these inks usually assume a greenish hue as the blue dye fades. See also iron gall ink.

 

Basically, aniline dye blue-blacks are called "blue-black" mainly for historical reasons rather than because of the actual color.

Edited July 29, 2009 by Silvermink

[Fernan]

It's one of my favourites. Specially the vintage.

 

 

Fernan

[HenryLouis]

tried some of the blue-black today, didn't see much green, although there is a small tint...

[Ondina]

This is modern Waterman's Blue-Black:

 

http://i348.photobucket.com/albums/q347/Ondina_2008/BeachWBB.jpg

 

In an Safari 1.1 nib. 3 weeks after loading the converter and exposed to warm weather conditions -beach, long rides in a car-. On an archival quality paper. Surprise, surprise.....

[HenryLouis]

This is modern Waterman's Blue-Black:

 

http://i348.photobucket.com/albums/q347/Ondina_2008/BeachWBB.jpg

 

In an Safari 1.1 nib. 3 weeks after loading the converter and exposed to warm weather conditions -beach, long rides in a car-. On an archival quality paper. Surprise, surprise.....

 

What happened? Does the color turn bluer?

[Ondina]

No, just stays the way it comes right out of the pen. While in other papers turns to the usual teal (which I like a lot) color. So my guess is that oxidation/concentration of the ink, paper, sacs and converters do change the final color. When BB is used in a lever pen, the color quickly turns tealish within minutes. In an converter, does not change unless it evaporates and concentrates -darker color-. The ink turns to the usual teal when used on any modern paper I have, but stays dark blue -as the old one used to be- in two pieces of stationery and envelopes from the 70's. Curious, huh?

[greencobra]

Personally, I like it and use it a lot.....

Same here. I have 8 pens on the desk all powered with it.

[Silvermink]

This is modern Waterman's Blue-Black:

 

In an Safari 1.1 nib. 3 weeks after loading the converter and exposed to warm weather conditions -beach, long rides in a car-. On an archival quality paper. Surprise, surprise.....

 

Huh, that's weird. I've never seen it not shift like that.

[RLTodd]

Eh - that's what aniline dye blue-blacks are, though. Never particularly cared for 'em. I'll stick with the MB iron gall blue-black, myself.

 

I always thought that was the point of the whole issue. (Richards definition sums up the point clearly.)

 

BB means iron gall ink, the aniline dye inks approximate something between the blue of the indigo on the color trip to the oxidized black. The anilines do not duplicate it. If someone wants true BB, they go iron gall. Otherwise, one just picks what they like off the shelf, which considering what true BB does, should be BLACK ink.

 

The real discussion, cutting it right down to the base, is about peoples's opinions on grey and very dark blue inks.

 

YMMV

 

p.s. Myself, I kind of liked the old Skrip BB which was more of a neutral grey. The Slovenian one is ok, but its more of a blue grey. But that is just me, and I could get along perfectly well if black ink was the only thing made.

 

p.p.s. Forgot, as I have said before, Watermans BB to me is a pleasant Teal shade.

 

Edited July 30, 2009 by RLTodd

[Ondina]

This is modern Waterman's Blue-Black:

 

In an Safari 1.1 nib. 3 weeks after loading the converter and exposed to warm weather conditions -beach, long rides in a car-. On an archival quality paper. Surprise, surprise.....

 

Huh, that's weird. I've never seen it not shift like that.

 

Actually is not a shift, is the very same color that you can see in the bottle. So it stays like it should be.

[Silvermink]

BB means iron gall ink, the aniline dye inks approximate something between the blue of the indigo on the color trip to the oxidized black. The anilines do not duplicate it. If someone wants true BB, they go iron gall. Otherwise, one just picks what they like off the shelf, which considering what true BB does, should be BLACK ink.

 

I don't disagree. I think aniline-dye inks can only ever really be said to be blue-black-ish, as you can't get a real blue-black with them, but manufacturers insist on calling them blue-black.

 

I think one of the main issues is confusion over the term - if I said something was a green-black, I'd mean it was a really dark green like PR Ebony Green, but blue-black has a very specific meaning that not everyone's aware of.

Edited July 30, 2009 by Silvermink