Pilot Custom 74 vs Custom 742

January 3, 2009

Troglokev,

Thank you for clarifying the issue for me. I would like to save some money, but I also want to get what I want, and not be disappointed. Now, if only the Custom 742 was available in Dark Green like I have seen some Custom 74s.

Donnie
Happy to have been of some help.

Just for fun, here's the Babelfish version

It has not produced Fa of custom 74.
It published to the sight of Ebay by mistake.
Applying annoyance, you said and reason were not.
:blink:
Don't imagine that the Japanese produced by machine translation software is any better! Unfortunately machine translation is a somewhat capricious intermediary in most interactions with Japanese web vendors. :bonk:

Kev.

Kev,

It is not restricted to Japanese, though. I do some business with a company in Mali, and my French is not what it once was nearly 40 years ago when I took two semesters of it, so I have had to rely somewhat on Babelfish. Somewhat, because even my miniscule amount of French has noted some horrendous faux pas in translation. What I do now is send my proposed text to a bilingual associate in Mali for clearance and understanding prior to transmitting to the agent with whom I deal in Mali.

Also, two of my sons are relatively fluent in Spanish, and have laughed at some of the Babelfish output.

Donnie

Donwinn, Troglokev:

Here’s some more fun at Babelfish’s expense:

From the website of scientist and science-fiction writer Geoffrey A. Landis, Babelfish was given the highly idiomatic English phrases "Out of Sight, Out of Mind" and "The Spirit is Willing, But The Flesh is Weak" to translate into selected target languages and then back into English again with the following, sometimes comical, results:

"Out of Sight, Out of Mind":

Italian: Out of sight, out of mind

French: Out of the sight, of the spirit

German: From sight from understanding out

Portugese: Except of the sight, it are of the mind

Spanish: Outside Vista, the mind

Japanese: In the place where it is not visible, from heart

"The Spirit is Willing, But The Flesh is Weak":

German: The spirit is ready, but the flesh is weak

French: The spirit is laid out, but the flesh is weak

Portugese: The spirit is made use, but the meat is weak

Italian: The spirit is arranged, but the meat is weak person

Spanish: The alcohol is arranged, but the meat is weak

Japanese: It heats heart truly and [re] physical weakness does

Korean: The spirit puts out the flag and does, the flesh omits but

This can be contrasted with the almost apocryphal story, recounted in Art Buchwald’s syndicated column of July 2, 1959, which described the proceedings of the "International Conference on Information Processing" of a Machine Translation (or MT) given the task of translating from English into Russian the aforementioned English phrase "The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak":

"At the beginning of the conference one of the lecturers was describing a machine which translates English into Russian. The first phrase put through the machine was, "The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak." But the Russian equivalent which came out read: "The whisky is fair, but the meat is foul."

So it would seem that these MT technologies still have a long way to go before they can realistically compete with the human mind when it comes to understanding the subtle nuances of linguistic forms in all of our human languages.

--Nick

January 3, 2009

:roflmho:

It's a fun game to play, isn't it?

We're getting a bit off-topic, though it's worth noting the point that we need to be particularly aware of the problem when we deal with international vendors. Stay patient, stay polite, and be wary of the possibilities for misunderstandings.

January 4, 2009

I received a similar note this morning. I guess Reagan was right.

Rob:

Sorry for my slightly off-topic previous post, but to get back to solidly on-topic, I too was hoping that this Pilot Custom 74 was going to turn out to be what it was pretending to be on Ujuku’s Ebay site. After all, who wouldn’t be hoping for a fountain pen of modern manufacture, with a femiflex+ nib, capable of accepting Pilot’s own high capacity CON-70 converter, at a delivered price of only $116.50 (pen) + $14.00 (shipping) = $130.50 (total)!! With the Namiki Falcon in the US selling for the discounted price of about $136.00, this would be quite a deal in flex-pen offerings to say the least!

............But then Reagan spoke, and I awoke from my hope filled dream of a Custom 74, with FA nib, to see that dream flee to that place where dreams and shadows stay. Oh well, some dreams, I guess, are just too good to be true.

--Nick

January 4, 2009

Yep, I had the same dream, and was even ready to send the $$, based on the seller's reputation, which has possibly taken a bit of a beating now.

I'm curious, though - a 742 uses a #10 FA nib, and a 743 uses a #15 FA, so what pen would use a #5 FA? (Since this pen was apparently a figment of someone's imagination, is there a #5 FA?)

Edited January 4, 2009 by Rob G

January 4, 2009

Yep, I had the same dream, and was even ready to send the $$, based on the seller's reputation, which has possibly taken a bit of a beating now.

I'm curious, though - a 742 uses a #10 FA nib, and a 743 uses a #15 FA, so what pen would use a #5 FA? (Since this pen was apparently a figment of someone's imagination, is there a #5 FA?)

Hi Rob:

It is my heart felt wish that the seller Ujuku (k.a.k. Tadashi Yamada) experience no ill effects to his reputation as a result of this Ebay listing mishap. Mr. Yamada is one of the most scrupulously honest pen dealers in all of the pen retailing world, with, given the inherent language barrier involved, absolutely the most accurate and forthright product representation of any of the merchants out there. The very fact that he immediately pulled the listing for the bogus Custom 74 with FA nib, after being made fully aware of the problem through unambiguous communication in Japanese, is surely proof of his utmost integrity. How the errant listing happened in the first place is anybody's guess. But what I do know is that I would not hesitate to do business with him again in the future if the opportunity ever arose. He really is a very pleasurable person to deal with.

Disclaimer: I am in no way a representative of Ujuku's or affiliated with this buisiness in any way whatsoever, I'm just a very satisfied customer on the basis of past interactions with Mr. Yamada. Anyway, I hope that this statement helps in restoring some peoples confidence in Ujuku's services.

Anyway, as to your question as to what pen would use the #5 FA nib -- that is, if there were a #5 FA nib in existence to begin with -- that would undoubtedly have to be the Custom 74 series, since all the nibs that come native to that pen series are either #3 or #5 in size. Although what the difference is between the #3 and #5 sizing is something that somebody else might know. I'm not even sure if the #3 size is even available anymore.

Warm Regards,

Nick

January 4, 2009

Anyway, as to your question as to what pen would use the #5 FA nib -- that is, if there were a #5 FA nib in existence to begin with -- that would undoubtedly have to be the Custom 74 series, since all the nibs that come native to that pen series are either #3 or #5 in size. Although what the difference is between the #3 and #5 sizing is something that somebody else might know. I'm not even sure if the #3 size is even available anymore.

The Custom 98 uses a #3 nib.

January 4, 2009

Pen gallery has the 742FA on sale currently for $US 189.

Usual "no affiliation" stuff.

January 4, 2009

Anyway, as to your question as to what pen would use the #5 FA nib -- that is, if there were a #5 FA nib in existence to begin with -- that would undoubtedly have to be the Custom 74 series, since all the nibs that come native to that pen series are either #3 or #5 in size. Although what the difference is between the #3 and #5 sizing is something that somebody else might know. I'm not even sure if the #3 size is even available anymore.
The Custom 98 uses a #3 nib.

Hi Deirdre:

You're absolutely right, and I should have been more careful in what I said. What I meant to say was that I didn't know if the #3 nib was available for the Custom 74 pen anymore, although I do believe that I've seen them sold with that choice of nib configuration at some time or another. But I don't know, I may be mistaken, and in which case I apologize for any misinformation.

--Nick

Edited January 4, 2009 by NickM

January 4, 2009

I checked the Ebay listing again for the Custom 74 with #5 FA nib, and while the picture of the nib is not too clear, it may be a #15 FA nib most likely in a 743, which was inadvertedly posted for the Custom 74. At any rate, the listing has ended.

January 4, 2009

It is my heart felt wish that the seller Ujuku (k.a.k. Tadashi Yamada) experience no ill effects to his reputation as a result of this Ebay listing mishap. Mr. Yamada is one of the most scrupulously honest pen dealers in all of the pen retailing world, with, given the inherent language barrier involved, absolutely the most accurate and forthright product representation of any of the merchants out there.

Agreed. In no way did I think that he was trying to pull a fast one. I just cannot help wondering how an experienced vendor got into a pickle like that.

Let's be honest - if that listing had been from an unknown vendor with little feedback, the reaction here would have been just a wee bit different. If I had obeyed my first impulse to grab one of these before they were gone, what with waiting for it and then having to return an international shipment, certainly my reaction would have been, well, unprintable.

Thank God for the FPN...

January 4, 2009

Anyway, as to your question as to what pen would use the #5 FA nib -- that is, if there were a #5 FA nib in existence to begin with -- that would undoubtedly have to be the Custom 74 series, since all the nibs that come native to that pen series are either #3 or #5 in size. Although what the difference is between the #3 and #5 sizing is something that somebody else might know. I'm not even sure if the #3 size is even available anymore.
The Custom 98 uses a #3 nib.

You're absolutely right, and I should have been more careful in what I said. What I meant to say was that I didn't know if the #3 nib was available for the Custom 74 pen anymore, although I do believe that I've seen them sold with that choice of nib configuration at some time or another.

I'd thought that too, so I'm glad I'm not the only one.