Sheaffer Legacy - Controversy?

[PenHero]

Since the Sheaffer Legacy was introduced, it has gone through three design changes:

 

1995-1998 - The original Legacy was designed in homage to the PFM / Pen for Men, a pen introduced in 1959 and the pen that introduced the hallmark Sheaffer Inlaid nib. The Legacy had squared cap and plunger cap ends and a three "pip" friction fit cap, all design elements from the PFM. It was a Touchdown filler with a removable converter unit so cartridges could be used, as the Snorkel system was impractical for cartridge use.

 

1999-2003 - The Legacy 2 was an improved design, as far as the cap fit is concerned, with a ridge on the section that snaps into the inner cap for a secure fit. The cap and plunger cap are rounded and the Touchdown system stays.

 

2004 - The Legacy Heritage drops the Touchdown system in favor of a standard cartridge / converter system. The pen retains the design elements of the Legacy 2, without the plunger cap, so the barrel is smooth and unbroken.

 

Given the three designs, and the original PFM, which model do you prefer? Legacy or PFM? One of the Legacies? Did Sheaffer make a good decision with these design changes? What do you think of a cartridge / converter Legacy?

 

Cheers,

[KendallJ]

do you have some pics for comparison purposes?

[Maja]

do you have some pics for comparison purposes?

I found some pictures on Jim's very own site (no, this is not a commercial plug---Jim just takes really nice clear pictures ) here:

http://www.penhero.com/PenSale/SheafferSto...afferLegacy.htm (Legacy)

http://www.penhero.com/PenSale/SheafferSto...fferLegacy2.htm (Legacy II)

http://www.penhero.com/PenSale/SheafferSto...acyHeritage.htm (Legacy Heritage)

 

Hmmm.....Well, given a choice between the three Legacy pen designs, I would have to opt for the original Legacy. I love the PFM "look"and the way its cap friction-fits onto its barrel. I am not as big a fan of caps that "click" on (is that being overly fussy? ) Also, Sheaffer's touchdown-filling mechanism is a very reliable one and I think the sacs can hold a fair amount of ink so that would be a plus. The only drawback would be sac replacement, but having the option to use cartridges (thanks to the removable convertor unit) would be compensation enough for me....

Speaking of the removable convertor unit above, Jim, is that the plunger-style convertor, or the squeeze one?

 

Now, Legacy or PFM? Well, with the PFM, there is no cartridge option, so I would want to know how to fix a snorkel-filler myself before buying one! I think the snorkel mechanism is a fascinating one, so given the choice, I would probably get a PFM, although it's a tough call.....The PFMs are nice big pens....Are the Legacies about the same size and/or weight? (I don't own a Legacy.....yet )

 

 

Design changes = good or bad? Well, I guess many companies were heading towards sacless filling mechanisms (too complicated for people to repair at home) so I can see why they went for the cartridge/convertor options. Why they wanted to change the design of the caps and barrel ends, I don't know.....I would have kept them as is.....Thank goodness they didn't mess with the shape of the beautiful inlaid nib!

[Michael R.]

The PFM is the best of the mentioned pens in my opinion!

 

I like the light-weight plastic, the original design with the squared of cap and barrel ends as well as the color coordinated gripping section. Love the PFM V because of the metal endings on the barrel's end - I miss those on the Legacy Is with gold cap!

 

Also like the bulbous cap design on the PFM I and III better compared to the all black Legacy I, II or Heritage.

 

The nicest modern Legacys are the Sterling Silver and colored laquered Legacy I and Linear Matte Black Legacy II.

 

The Legacy Is perform very well but overall quality could be better (laquer chips of easily on green, red and blue laquered models and have had problems with the end knob of the filling mechanism); cao snaps on much better on Legacy IIs and overall quality seems better, even I've had terrible writing problems with my Legacy IIs in Linear Matte Black and Black Pearl with rhoidum plated nibs. Tried a "M", "B", "Stub" and two "F" nibs so far and they all skipped or didn't start writing - so I send those to Sheaffer for repair again. The "XF", "F", "M" and "Stub" nibs on the Legacy I never caused any problems.

 

Haven't tried the new Heritage (I like the look of the deep cut rhodium) but will miss the Touchdown-filler.

 

 

By the way, there were two versions of the Legacy I gripping section with different "snap on clutches"-designs !

 

 

Michael

[Keith with a capital K]

Despite their status among collectors I do not favour the original PFM as it lacks the robust construction of it's other Snorkel and TD filling brethren.

 

The Legacy 2 is probably my favourite as I was not enamoured with way the cap fit on the original Legacy and the elimination of the touchdown filling system on the Legacy 3 was a bad move as one the biggest appeals of the Legacy was the touchdown filler.

[Maja]

Despite their status among collectors I do not favour the original PFM as it lacks the robust construction of it's other Snorkel and TD filling brethren.

And PFM's are pretty darned expensive, too....Another drawback

[rivieraranch]

The Legacy I should have had a snorkel; failing to reprise the snorkel fill system was only going half-way in homage to a great design.

 

The Legacy II is far easier to use and I have owned several.

 

The current Legacy "Heritage" is a disgrace; no touchdown filler, a dumbed-down version that is no different from similar cartridge/converter pens that Sheaffer had been making in the 60's through the '80's.

[RLTodd]

I have one of the BIC L.H.s and I like the simplicity and reliability of the C/C design and the flow of the lines. My only complaint is the weight. If they could make the current L.H. design in a light, modern, high impact plastic I think it would be a very good pen. Also they should do something about their nib QC, mine is ok but not for the price point.

 

As far as the touch down tray gimic or the old fashioned and complex snorkel I have no desire to go back to them.

[Michael Wright]

I have a copper Legacy II and a couple of PFMs.

 

The restyled barrel-end of the Legacy II makes it pretty hard to grip to unscrew. The Touchdown filling is neat, though I wonder about the ink capacity. The design seems to compromise the ability to seat a cartridge firmly, though I haven't experimented enough to be sure about that. I understand the cap seating was not entirely satisfactory on the original Legacy, so that bit of redesign seems necessary (nothing wrong with the PFM design, but that's dealing with lighter components).

 

Visually, I rather like the styling of the Legacy II -- it manages to combine a homage to the Balance along with the PFM styling, and makes it a bit more than a straight copy. The copper and gold plate finish is awfully pretty. The fine nib on my Legacy II is quite superb, with genuine semi-flex.

 

The PFM is a more significant pen, and I prefer the lighter weight, but at the moment I'm using the Legacy II -- probably because it's the new kid in the pen frog, and also because the nib is really really nice. And I'm not doing prolonged writing these days.

 

Michael

[contravox]

Legacy I. The styling is superior to the Legacy II and Heritage in my opinion. I've never had the pleasure of writing with a II or Heritage, but I imagine it is much the same. The squared-off barrel ends just do something for me visually, more so than rounded-off ends. I've never had a problem with line skipping with my black and gold Legacy I, nor have I had a problem with the cap ever slipping off. If anything, that sucker gets stuck on there a little too good! The nib has great response to my writing style and gives a little flex. The sac inside the TD convertor looks to be plastic, so I really don't think it will be wearing out anytime soon. Just in case, I own 2 back-ups

 

To me, the weight of the modern Legacy is a big plus to my modern writing style. The pen's weight helps deliver the energy of my writing to the paper in a commanding way. Maybe this is why I feel like I'm writing very profound things with this pen...umm...yeah. Never wrote with a PFM, but restoring the snorkel mechanism is pretty simple. All you need is a sac, two seals, some shellac from a harware store, a coat hanger, a pencil, a cheese grater, some bubble gum, tweezers, and MacGyver.

[ChristopherH]

I have a PFM IV and a Legacy 2 Matte Black & Gold. Both are great pens, but in my opinion the PFM is far superior. It's light, perfectly balanced, and has a sense of precision that the Legacy lacks. The squared-off edges really complete the design. The PFM has the best filling system ever, with great capacity and a long snorkel. The Legacy's touchdown filler requires a lot more force and doesn't hold much ink.

 

On the other hand, the Legacy 2 can be found new and pristine and under warranty for prices in the double digits. A true steal! PFMs are tricky to acquire at reasonable prices... I've had one excellent experience buying a PFM here, and one rather unfortunate one buying a PFM on eBay.

 

The Legacy also offers an interesting solid and substantial feel -- the click when taking on or off the cap is loud and reassuring, a bit of a "german car door" feeling. And, in contrast to the usual vintage/modern comparison, the Legacy nib is much softer than the PFM's (though it's not flexible enough to make much difference in practice).

 

So, a near mint PFM IV or V if you can find one in your price range, otherwise stick with the Legacy 2. The PFM is modern enough that it doesn't look great (or function well) if worn... it's not much fun if the clutch cap doesn't work, or the snorkel is fussy, etc. So stick with examples in excellent condition.

[Richard]

There's really no comparison. The Legacys are "lookalike" pens, and they are pretty, but they are heavy, and I don't care at all for that "German car door" click of the Legacy II's cap. The PFM is the real McCoy. I own exactly one PFM; until recently it was a black PFM III, but then I stumbled into this PFM V:

 

http://www.richardspens.com/images/collection/zoomed/pfm_v.jpg

 

I'm not big XF nib guy, but the probability that I'll part with this pen in the foreseeable future is nil.

[Velma]

I continue to be confused. I have a Legacy with an extra-fine nib, in the sandblasted palladium finish, that is from 2003, and is a cartridge/converter fill, not a Touchdown. This particular style is what the Fountain Pen Hospital had in the last quarter of 2003. The label on the box reads "9038 LEGACY FPEN," for what it's worth.

 

It's the one at the bottom of this photo:

http://www.well.com/~wren/sheaffers2.jpg

[contravox]

Velma,

It looks to me like you have a Legacy Heritage pen. I'm basing this on the fact that there's no noticable blind cap on the barrel of your pen, so it can't be a touchdown model. Beautiful pen BTW!

-Robert

[Johnny Appleseed]

I can't really offer a comparison of a Legacy I vs Legacy II - I only have a Legacy II. However, I will say that the Legacy Heritage gets a big thumbs down for dropping the touchdown converter system. I would never have gotten a Legacy II if it didn't have the touchdown system (and if it hadn't been a fantastic price )

 

John

[npt3]

My answer is "yes, but." ;-) Both are great, but I'd have to agree with Richard and give the nod to the PFM.

 

I have five PFMs and love them all, with my favorite probably the blue IV with the highly polished SS cap. The pen is a nice, light weight and the Snorkel filler just rocks.

 

But... I found mine at steal prices on eBay, and it took a long time to find them. And fixing them up so's they work is easy, but God forbid you've got to find (or fix) a part. The nib section on my PFM I had a hairline crack which I was luckily able to weld with some Plastruct welding cement. But not everyone's up to this.

 

The Legacies are a lot heavier in comparison, but the Touchdown works great (a Legacy without a Touchdown filler is not a Legacy - sorry), and there are some much nicer finishes, especially in the Legacy IIs. My absolute favorites are the King's Gold and the Pd Cap/Linear black matte finish - which is hands down one of the coolest looking pens ever. And I don't think the weight is a whole lot more than, say, the MB 146, so those who whine are just girly-men. ;-) The only thing I don't much care for on the Legacies is that the cap just doesn't post well. At all.

 

Nick

[contravox]

I've really never had a problem posting the cap on my pen. Curious...is the posting problem with the Legacy I or Legacy II?

[rivieraranch]

I never put the cap on the back of the pen to write; never have. It is like walking with a bowling ball in your hand. It is much easier to write without the cap stuck on the end of the barrel.

[amin]

If anyone is reading this thread and feels like they need a PFM right away, I just noticed that Richard put his black PFM III for sale on his web site. Doubt this one will last very long.