what is your definition of 'mint

[aunt rebecca]

a friend asked me for the meaning of the term "mint." someone told this collector that "mint" meant that the pen had never been written with. so the "mint" pen could have teeth marks, dings on the cap and a filler that does not work, as long as it has never been written with. i disagreed. "mint" means, not only unused, but also pristine, undamaged, and looks new.

 

what do you think?

Edited February 14, 2008 by aunt rebecca

[Lifesaver]

I agree. Mint, to me, not only means unused but in the same condition it left the factory. That means no chips, scrapes or teeth marks.

[dcwaites]

I understand it to mean that it has been used, but is otherwise in the condition it was when it left the factory.

The coin collecting equivalents are

 

Uncirculated -- New In Box

Mint -- Opened, filled and used, but perfect (literally perfect) condition

 

Edited to add -- I am most likely wrong. Can any numismatists correct me, please?

 

Edited February 14, 2008 by dcwaites

[FrankB]

I also agree. "Mint" means more than just unused. Anything "mint" is in its factory fresh condition. I do not like the term "minty," which to me means something that tastes of mint. It seems to be a bogus word that hints of some damage or use, and implies that the item is below "new in the box."

[Shangas]

To me 'mint' means unused - in ANY way - no dip-testing, no once-off writing, no nothing - And absolutely perfect - no dings, dents, scrapes, knocks, brassings, bent tines, clogged feeds, missing doo-dahs or whatever.

[jimg]

I agree with lifesaver (he says, opening umbrella awaiting downpour of flaming abuse which usually accompanies this question).

 

"Mint " to me means perfect and as it left the factory. I would not apply it to even a NOS pen unless it was free of scratches and wear and it had not been inked. Looking around I have only one mint condition pen and many many "excellent", "NOS" and "as new" pens.

[Tom Pike]

Hi Aunt Rebecca,

 

I tend to favor your definition, but...

 

The word "mint" is a coin collecting term, not a fountain pen collecting term. Many FP collectors use the word, but there is no commonly agreed upon definition in our hobby. That's the real problem; it is a virtually meaningless word when used to describe pens. Don't even get me started on "minty" :ltcapd:

 

When talking about pens like you've described, I prefer terms like NOS (New Old Stock), or NIB (New In Box), along with careful descriptions of use (including dipping), and any and all defects. Careful photographs combined with questions (or careful inspection in person) are much better than words, especially those that don't apply to our hobby.

 

There's really no need for us to have to have a single word that describes something like "mint" or "uncirculated". We've got many words and nice pens with which to write them

 

 

Cheers,

Tom

 

P.S. Did you hear about the two cannibals that were eating a clown? One turns to the other and says "Does this taste funny to you?"

 

 

[captnemo]

Gee, interesting to see the different interpretations. To me, mint means "like new" (no visible or functional difference from new) but not new. New means new. Mint means indistinguishable from new but not new. If it's actually new then just say new, or NIB (new in box), or NOS. New means unused.

 

Since new means new, why would anyone invent the term "mint" if it meant new / unused?

[captnemo]

P.S. Did you hear about the two cannibals that were eating a clown? One turns to the other and says "Does this taste funny to you?"

 

No, but it is a little greasy! :ltcapd:

[Shimon]

a friend asked me for the meaning of the term "mint." someone told this collector that "mint" meant that the pen had never been written with. so the "mint" pen could have teeth marks, dings on the cap and a filler that does not work, as long as it has never been written with. i disagreed. "mint" means, not only unused, but also pristine, undamaged, and looks new.

 

what do you think?

In my opinion "mint" = As it was when it left the factory

[HDoug]

I notice different vintage pen sellers have different definitions of "mint." But they define what they mean -- I guess it's a "definition of variables" kind of process. To me, "mint" would have to mean the highest condition. If a seller allows his mint condition pens to have tooth marks on it, what is the condition he calls in the condition it left the factory? Grand Mint? Ultra Super Minty Mint?

 

It's kind of like ordering a Large coffee when you want the small one because the large coffee is called a Grande.

 

Doug

 

P.S. Here's Richard Binder's definitions for his vintage pens.

[Beechwood]

To me, Mint means perfect condition and as new, but not neccesarily unused.

 

Edited, sorry, Tom made all the points that I was about to use, the coin collecting analogy is useful.

Edited February 14, 2008 by Arthur

[Pendragon]

To me, mint means in like new condition, with no marring, blemishes or wear of any kind. It does not necessarily mean unused or new.

[OldGriz]

My definition of mint is a pen that might have been filled or dipped, but is in factory new condition... absolutley no marks, brassing or anthing that would not make it look like it just came out of the box...

A mint pen, IMO, does not mean that the pen has never been used....

I use the following conditions when I sell a pen

NOS (New Old Stock) ~ the pen has never been used, inked or otherwise seen ink... it is brand new.

Mint ~ see above

[MikeLip]

Mint - looks like it just left the factory. It could have been used, but was so well cleaned up before selling that it looks unused. The first mark or blemish on the pen means it is no longer mint.

[Keng]

My definition of mint is a pen that might have been filled or dipped, but is in factory new condition... absolutley no marks, brassing or anthing that would not make it look like it just came out of the box...

A mint pen, IMO, does not mean that the pen has never been used....

I use the following conditions when I sell a pen

NOS (New Old Stock) ~ the pen has never been used, inked or otherwise seen ink... it is brand new.

Mint ~ see above

 

I agree with Tom's definition of mint and NOS. To me it is more subjective when a pen is described as "near mint" or "excellent"

 

Mike

[Titivillus]

To me 'mint' means unused - in ANY way - no dip-testing, no once-off writing, no nothing - And absolutely perfect - no dings, dents, scrapes, knocks, brassings, bent tines, clogged feeds, missing doo-dahs or whatever.

 

 

Yep that's my definition of mint- unused and pristine. NOS could be unused but chewed.

 

 

Maybe a spectrum of pens from perfect to junk could be:

 

The T Scale of Fountain Pens

 

(S)ealed in box (nothing has touched the pen including light since it was made)

(M)int ( unused and pristine but may have been handled)

(D)ip Tested (Pen is mint but has been dipped in ink to test nib)

(I)nked (pen is mint but has been filled with ink)

(N)OS (new old stock)

(DR)awer wear ( micro scratches and other marks that could occur by storing the pen in a desk drawer)

(U)sed Pen ( The pen has been used and there is noticable wear)

(US)er ( there is some damage to the pen but it operates fine)

(F)ixer-upper (some work could get it back to user)

(P)arts Pen ( Pen is only good as parts)

(T)rash (pen is not worth keeping

) Edited February 14, 2008 by Tytyvyllus

[Ernst Bitterman]

Isn't Minty the abandoned girlfriend of Carrot Ironfoundersson in Guards! Guards! of the Discworld series?

[EventHorizon]

For me, mint means something that was produced back in time (i.e. vintage) but never used, in a box, stickers still there so on and so forth but that's just me.

 

My definition of mint is the same as OldGriz's definition of NOS but for me, "vintage" and/or "old" still has to apply. A pen manufatured today is only "New".

[AllWriteNow]

Could the establishing of grading criteria be something the PCA and WES could develop?

Seems like the perfect function for the 2 main Pen Collecting Associations?

 

Steve