Iron gall ink flushing recommendations

[Sh.Andrews]

Okay, I definitely appreciate all of the information but I am now convinced that the IG inks need to go to the far back corner of the cabinet.

[OCArt]

Please don't give up on them as modern IG inks are very mild. If you happen to like blue-black inks then you'll really love some of the modern IG inks like Pelikan 1001 Blue-Black (if you get the one marked for Europe with the IG component,) Hero 232 Blue Black is an astonishingly good ink that many of us always have loaded into a pen, and then there's the Platinum line of "Classic" inks see here

59 minutes ago, Sh.Andrews said:

Okay, I definitely appreciate all of the information but I am now convinced that the IG inks need to go to the far back corner of the cabinet.

 

[Sh.Andrews]

I have the Pelikan BB (purchased around? 3 years ago from overseas) and but I really like the R&K Salix.  Very interesting in a hard to explain way.

 

Mostly joking.  I'm sure it will get used again but in a carefully selected pen.  If I could just find something with an acrylic or ebonite nib then I wouldn't even hesitate.  Preferably on the soft, non-nail side.

[yazeh]

1 hour ago, Sh.Andrews said:

Okay, I definitely appreciate all of the information but I am now convinced that the IG inks need to go to the far back corner of the cabinet.

If you have real IG inks, like Essri / Diamine Registrars etc, might as well throw them out. As they will go "bad" in a couple of years or so...

[Mercian]

On 10/7/2024 at 10:11 PM, yazeh said:

Would that affects the sacs in vintage pens?

 

I've only just realised that you'd asked this...

 

I have only my own limited experience of my own practice to go on, and I don't use any sac-filled pens (apart from my Parker "51"s & UK 'Junior' Duofold).
Which is because I don't get-one well with lever-filler mechanisms, and because I like to be able to see how much ink I have left in my pen.

I therefore think that, in order to satisfy our curiosity about the following questions...

1. are iron-gall inks likely to be 'safe' to use in vintage sac-filled pens? And;
2. is an ammonia soak/fill/flush likely to damage a rubber sac?

...we ought to ask for the opinions of @Ron Z, and other experienced pen-repair professionals.

 

Now that I have my caveat out of the way, my own uninformed guess is as follows.

 

With respect to the rubber sacs in vintage pens, most of those pens were designed/manufactured/sold in the era when blue-black iron-gall inks were still commonly used to serve as 'permanent' inks for business/'document' use.

And I also recall seeing comments on here to the effect that it is alkaline inks (or ammonia) that destroy the rubber sacs in old pens, rather than acidic ones.
E.g. Waterman 'Serenity Blue' is actually fairly acidic (its pH is around 3.4 iirc), and the warnings that I remember seeing about which inks to not use in sac-filled pens seemed mostly to cite Japanese inks, on the grounds that they are often alkaline.

 

As such, I would expect that modern, commercially-made iron-gall inks are safe to use in lever-fillers/sac-filled pens.
I-g inks that have been 'home-brewed' by hobbyists may of course be a different kettle of fish entirely, as who knows what components have - or have not - been put into those, and in what proportions they have been mixed 🤷‍♂️

 

Do though bear in mind not only that my memory is far from perfect, but also that the comments that I recall having seen may not have been accurate in the first place, but only the repetition of rumours!

[Mercian]

16 hours ago, Sh.Andrews said:

Mostly joking.  I'm sure it will get used again but in a carefully selected pen.  If I could just find something with an acrylic or ebonite nib then I wouldn't even hesitate.  Preferably on the soft, non-nail side.

 

I strongly recommend the type of pen that I have dedicated to ESSRI - a vintage UK Parker Duofold.

Bouncy 14k nib. Ebonite feed.
They were made as button-fillers prior to WW2, but the later (1953 onwards) examples have the the fill mechanism from a Parker "51" Special, with the long-lived 'pli-glass' sac.

They were made in a range of sizes, and in a few colours.

 

Personally, I would not buy one of the pens that was made after the mid-1960s, because I read somewhere that the plastic from which they were made is reputed to be thinner/more-brittle/more-prone to cracking.
That said, my own pen dates from some time in the 1960s.
 

Here is a picture of my own Duofold 'Junior':

 

Here's a link to the page about these models on Tony Fischier's 'ParkerPens.net':

https://parkerpens.net/ukduofold.html

 

And here is a link to a search on eBay.com for these pens:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=vintage+parker+duofold+uk&_sacat=0&_sop=15

 

Happy hunting!

 

Slàinte,
M.

[yazeh]

@Mercian The logic in your explanation makes complete sense to me. I believe I had to resort to mild vinegar at one point. Later on, a few full time IG ink users (and one maker) told me that they use IG inks in old vintage eyedropper, like Swan etc.  

[Sh.Andrews]

5 hours ago, Mercian said:

I strongly recommend the type of pen that I have dedicated to ESSRI - a vintage UK Parker Duofold.

I realize I'm missing out on an entire world - don't own a single Parker and nothing older than the '80s.  Makes perfect sense that these would be better equipped for IG.  I appreciate the recommendation and know that you are completely right but never started down that slippery slope [yet].  Went to a pen show a couple of weeks ago with the intention of looking at vintage/something completely different but found I was completely overwhelmed by the amount of pens and people all in one place.  Very few tables were well organized in groups or signage.  Ended up leaving with a new Platinum 3776 Century which I love BTW.