Some Ink Tests

[Lithium466]

Hard to commit to an ink for such a long time! I would pick something simple that isn't too much of a pain to clean, like Diamine Blue Velvet, J. Herbin Bleu de la verrerie or one of the Pelikan Edelstein you have.

Do you have any GvFC inks? Gulf blue, Cobalt blue, Carbon black, Viper green? Don't get their Lapis lazuli though.

Alternatively, one of the Taccia inks. For some reason I'm also seeing something light in that pen, which may not be your taste. Taccia Asahanada? 

[USG]

5 hours ago, Lithium466 said:

Hard to commit to an ink for such a long time! I would pick something simple that isn't too much of a pain to clean, like Diamine Blue Velvet, J. Herbin Bleu de la verrerie or one of the Pelikan Edelstein you have.

Do you have any GvFC inks? Gulf blue, Cobalt blue, Carbon black, Viper green? Don't get their Lapis lazuli though.

Alternatively, one of the Taccia inks. For some reason I'm also seeing something light in that pen, which may not be your taste. Taccia Asahanada? 

 

We think alike.  I have all the blues you mentioned.  My first dip was Verrerie but it was just a dark blue, really bland, without any pizazz.  I also tried Supernova, which is a pizazz ink in the "light ink" category you mentioned.  I like Taccia Ruri but it's already living in a Purple Asvine C80.  Are Taccia inks they easy to clean?

 

I don't have any GvFC inks.

 

If I had the brown model I'd put Sailor #973 brown in it.  I love that ink.  It has a different character depending on the pen and paper.  It's a Nice rich brown with some bright green outlining on Cosmo Snow.

 

 

I also considered the Sailor #743 you turned me on to.  I like that ink a lot and it has some pizazz, but I have it in a couple of pens already.   Shin-Kai would also be a candidate but it's living in a Pilot 743 <sf>.  I could be wrong but I think I remember Pilot blue black as not being easy to clean... was there a kind of grey film that stayed behind and didn't want to wash out??

 

This pen would be so much easier to find an ink for if the section unscrewed from the body like it did on older models.

 

Gotta love this hobby....😀👍

 

 

[Penguincollector]

  What about Shin-Kai? I’ve been getting into it lately.(ETA: just saw your answer, would skip it)I can totally see Platinum BB eating the vacuum rod, It’s the only cartridge they don’t use the agitator in for good reason. 
 

  I love the way Mississippi sheens, but I worry that it might be too dry for a Pilot feed. I say this because I just had to add White Lightning to a Pilot 78g BB to get Miruai to flow. I also has issues with Birmingham Tesla Coil in my 743 FA, and Diamine in a Prera. On the other hand, my Pilots LOVE wet inks like Private Reserve Tanzanite and Midnight Blues. My rule of thumb is: for a first inking, use the same brand. It can be a bit boring, but it does teach me about a pen when I’m first getting to know how it writes. I especially worry, because as @Lithium466 noted, that’s metric ton of ink that goes into that 823 barrel. Although @Mechanical is the one who knows BB ink and the 823 best out of all of us, I think. I wonder what BB ink his 823 seems to get along with best?

 

ETA: IF you have White Lightning or another surfactant, try the Sailor inks. You might have to empty and refill, but they are pretty and worth the trouble.

[USG]

On 8/24/2025 at 6:24 AM, Lithium466 said:

I think I remember this with #743, as well as in some other blurple blue inks (like GvFC Lapis Lazuli) but for good measure I have #443 and #743 lined up for retest  It seems most of the "intersesting" blues have either some pink/red component, or some turquoise, or both.

@Penguincollector created a very interesting mix with some PR inks to recreate something close to the Colorverse FP day limited edition, using both some teal leaning and purple leaning blues as a base.

 

(currently have way too many pens inked in black in an attempt to find my favourite black)

 

 

Regarding what you are describing with b7 paper, I noticed that with some other papers, and I hate it. You write, think "all is good nice lines" and then a few minutes later thickly spread lines? Yuck. My probably worst offender is some Tsubame Airmail paper...it's a pencil or maybe ballpoint paper.

I also vaguely remember some paper about ink spreading and the effect of pH, where some high pH inks would do better. But then some low pH inks are known for thin lines so there's more to it.

 I owe you a response and I'll add to this later.... 😀

@Lithium466

Of course CluelessMe didn't realize that the #743 had red in it, but what caught my attention was that the red-pink residue didn't want to wash off while the blue component washed right off.

 

So where are you in your "Black" quest?  Years ago I settled on Aurora Black as my black ink.

 

b7 has that "spreading" factor for sure.  It would be a real contender if it didn't do that.  It doesn't bother me too much but I know you like fine lines so I can see how it's not your Huckleberry.

 

Are you referring to InesF's ink chart? I can't find my link to it atm but I have the dry ink part of it in my albums...  what this shows is that Waterman Inspired blue is dryer than most of the Pelikan 4001 inks

 

 

Wait,I found the link

The thread is: An alternative look at ink wetness

 

 

[USG]

5 minutes ago, Penguincollector said:

  What about Shin-Kai? I’ve been getting into it lately. I can totally see Platinum BB eating the vacuum rod, It’s the only cartridge they don’t use the agitator in for good reason. 
 

  I love the way Mississippi sheens, but I worry that it might be too dry for a Pilot feed. I say this because I just had to add White Lightning to a Pilot 78g BB to get Miruai to flow. I also has issues with Birmingham Tesla Coil in my 743 FA, and Diamine in a Prera. On the other hand, my Pilots LOVE wet inks like Private Reserve Tanzanite and Midnight Blues. My rule of thumb is: for a first inking, use the same brand. It can be a bit boring, but it does teach me about a pen when I’m first getting to know how it writes. I especially worry, because as @Lithium466 noted, that’s metric ton of ink that goes into that 823 barrel. Although @Mechanical is the one who knows BB ink and the 823 best out of all of us, I think. I wonder what BB ink his 823 seems to get along with best?

 

Shin-Kai would be a great if I didn't already have it in a Pilot 743<SF>.

Thanks for the heads up on MIssissippi, it was going to be next.  Maybe I'll give it a dip to see if it flows. 

 

I guess if I want to use Platinum Blue Black in a Pilot the answer is to get a 743<M>, but then I'd have 2 743 mediums.... I'm not doing that 🤔

 

It's surprising that Birmingham Tesla Coil doesn't work in you  743FA.  I have Diamine Bilberry that hard starts and dries on the nib in other pens. it's fine in the 743FA.

 

To get around loading a ton of ink in the vac fillers where I want to change inks frequently, I unscrew the section and load them with a syringe or dropper.  With the 823 I'd have to pull it out of the ink bottle before it sucks up too much ink.

I wasn't quick enough with an Asvine V126 and it sucked up 1/2 a barrel of Supernova.  Previously I had unscrewed the section to load it, I don't know what possessed me to use the Vacuum system.  With it's fine nib it's going to be writing with Supernova for a long time... 😱

 

LTM said you made an interesting mix with Private Reserve inks.  What was it?   I haven't done this in a while but I used an old formula from years ago to make a Penman Sapphire color: equal parts of Naples and Plum.

[Mechanical]

10 hours ago, USG said:

I could only look at pics of  MCL's Pilot 823 for so long before joining the 823 Club.👍😀 

  I really like the smooth Medium nib.👍

 

Welcome to the club!  This is a fine pen. I love it's nib and I enjoy every stroke when writing.  Really, I just don't want to put it down once I've started. I could go on and on...

 

Originally I thought to use it as one of my "desk pens" -- but it's such a delight to use, that I carry it about almost every day.

 

 

59 minutes ago, Penguincollector said:

My rule of thumb is: for a first inking, use the same brand. It can be a bit boring, but it does teach me about a pen when I’m first getting to know how it writes.

 

While I make exceptions, I think this way also.  The Pilot 823 had a big bottle of Pilot Blue included, so I used that.  And I also used it for my second fill  because of its shading and flow. 

 

Next up, I think, will either be Pilot Blue Black or Sailor Souboku.  I did have the idea of using either Salix or Pelikan BB... but  wanting to maintain that beautiful steel plunger rod has put me off that idea.  

 

But also up for consideration is Diamine Bleu de Profondeurs or possibly Lamy Pink Cliff.  This pen is also one of my candidates for my next fill of  R&K Verdigris.  Probably I'll go Souboku, though.

 

[USG]

52 minutes ago, Mechanical said:

 

Welcome to the club!  This is a fine pen. I love it's nib and I enjoy every stroke when writing.  Really, I just don't want to put it down once I've started. I could go on and on...

 

Originally I thought to use it as one of my "desk pens" -- but it's such a delight to use, that I carry it about almost every day.

 

 

 

While I make exceptions, I think this way also.  The Pilot 823 had a big bottle of Pilot Blue included, so I used that.  And I also used it for my second fill  because of its shading and flow. 

 

Next up, I think, will either be Pilot Blue Black or Sailor Souboku.  I did have the idea of using either Salix or Pelikan BB... but  wanting to maintain that beautiful steel plunger rod has put me off that idea.  

 

But also up for consideration is Diamine Bleu de Profondeurs or possibly Lamy Pink Cliff.  This pen is also one of my candidates for my next fill of  R&K Verdigris.  Probably I'll go Souboku, though.

 

 

Hi MCL

 

Do you think Platinum Blue Black is safe for the 823?  It would have been my 2st choice but I was afraid it would corrode the metal rod.

 

I think you mean J Herbin Bleu de Profondeurs.  It looks interesting, as does Lamy Pink Cliff.  R&K Verdigris leans toward green so I don't know about that one.  Souboku is a great choice and shades like a bandit.

 

. I have it in a Sailor 1911L.

[Penguincollector]

2 hours ago, USG said:

LTM said you made an interesting mix with Private Reserve inks.  What was it?   I haven't done this in a while but I used an old formula from years ago to make a Penman Sapphire color: equal parts of Naples and Plum.

  I was looking for something similar to Colorverse’s Fountain Pen Day 2024 ink, as it’s beautiful but scarce, and wound up with this recipe:

  

8 parts PR Lake Placid blue

8 parts PR Black Magic blue 

4 parts PR Tropical Blue 

4 parts Monteverde Midnight Black (PR black would probably work as well, I don’t have any)

 

  Parts can be as small as large as you want to make them, my original try was by the drop, what I sent Lithium was by the mL, they turned out the same, a beautifully saturated blue leaning blurple. 

 

    I would avoid pigmented inks in the 823. I am not good at quoting from another thread, but Dillo, who I trust about inks said:

 

  “I would pick a different pen to use with these inks. Pilot even calls out the 823 specifically as not compatible with their own line of pigmented inks.”

[Mechanical]

56 minutes ago, USG said:

Do you think Platinum Blue Black is safe for the 823?  It would have been my 2st choice but I was afraid it would corrode the metal rod.

 

I really am not sure.  I really haven't had any problems with Platinum Blue Black... but I'm not sure I want to try it in this pen, even though I love the ink.

 

58 minutes ago, USG said:

I think you mean J Herbin Bleu de Profondeurs.

 

Oof!  Yes of course.

 

 

[TSherbs]

@USG Above, you list Waterman Inspired Blue as a dry ink. But aren't you asking here about blue-blacks, so don't you mean their "Mysterious Blue"? (And yes, I see that this also has a higher surface tension on InesF's list....)

 

For what it is worth, I'd try Diamine Denim (for safety's sake, and I like the color a lot for a blue-black with no gall).

[Mechanical]

20 minutes ago, TSherbs said:

@USG Above, you list Waterman Inspired Blue as a dry ink. But aren't you asking here about blue-blacks, so don't you mean their "Mysterious Blue"?

 

Waterman Mysterious Blue would be another wonderful choice.

[Penguincollector]

What about Herbin’s Bleu Nuit? 

[Lithium466]

20 hours ago, USG said:

Are Taccia inks they easy to clean?

I don't remember them being particularly bad, but apart from Ruri I don't remember trying some that "do tricks". Did you check Naka Murasaki? I think I have some...I should really do better in cataloguing inks 😕

 

20 hours ago, USG said:

I don't have any GvFC inks.

 

There you go! Pretty sure that's the answer you were looking for  

Why would you fill that cavernous tank with an ink you already have inked somewhere else? You know it's going to stay there for a while^^
Or on the other hand, use an ink you particularly appreciate. I can see both, if you don't want the risk taking of filling the super tanker with unknown. (I'm hoping this is clear that this is all humoristic there, I totally get the indecision)

 

20 hours ago, USG said:

I also considered the Sailor #743 you turned me on to.  I like that ink a lot and it has some pizazz, but I have it in a couple of pens already.   Shin-Kai would also be a candidate but it's living in a Pilot 743 <sf>.  I could be wrong but I think I remember Pilot blue black as not being easy to clean... was there a kind of grey film that stayed behind and didn't want to wash out??

 

Surprisingly I too found Pilot blue and BB to be kind of "harder than expected" to clean. Very different style from the classic Waterman blue and BB for sure. I have Pilot black inked at the moment, in a Capless EF that cartridge will last forever (especially since it's a particularly boring pairing), so I don't know about Pilot black yet. Pilot blue is cellulose reactive, BB is likely a mix of blue and black. 

 

20 hours ago, USG said:

This pen would be so much easier to find an ink for if the section unscrewed from the body like it did on older models.

 

Gotta love this hobby....😀👍

 

 

 

I thought that was possible on some older versions of the 823? Did they change the design?

 

 

20 hours ago, Penguincollector said:

  What about Shin-Kai? I’ve been getting into it lately.(ETA: just saw your answer, would skip it)I can totally see Platinum BB eating the vacuum rod, It’s the only cartridge they don’t use the agitator in for good reason. 
 

  I love the way Mississippi sheens, but I worry that it might be too dry for a Pilot feed. I say this because I just had to add White Lightning to a Pilot 78g BB to get Miruai to flow. I also has issues with Birmingham Tesla Coil in my 743 FA, and Diamine in a Prera. On the other hand, my Pilots LOVE wet inks like Private Reserve Tanzanite and Midnight Blues. My rule of thumb is: for a first inking, use the same brand. It can be a bit boring, but it does teach me about a pen when I’m first getting to know how it writes. I especially worry, because as @Lithium466 noted, that’s metric ton of ink that goes into that 823 barrel. Although @Mechanical is the one who knows BB ink and the 823 best out of all of us, I think. I wonder what BB ink his 823 seems to get along with best?

 

ETA: IF you have White Lightning or another surfactant, try the Sailor inks. You might have to empty and refill, but they are pretty and worth the trouble.

 

+1 on first trying a ink from the same brand as the pen as initial fill if you can.

That said since USG has like dozens of similarish Pilot pens...does the big ink reservoir of the 823 influence in any way the ink flow or behaviour compared to a 743? I like the 743 and kind of want a 823, but I'd like it in EF or PO which is not easy to source (if possible - that was at some point but haven't checked in a while). And then you need to commit to ~2+mL (?) of ink with such a frugal thing point nib? That would be a one fill every 3 months 😂

 

20 hours ago, USG said:

 So where are you in your "Black" quest?  Years ago I settled on Aurora Black as my black ink.

 

Ugh. Stalled. Some have been eliminated, including Aurora black. Maybe my bottle went bad? It's really not that dark in EF nibs, not as dark as I'd like. Maybe a combination with higher surface tension compared to Japanese inks? It was a surprisingly terrible match in the Parker 75, and not good either in the Pilot 912 PO. Iroshizuku Take Sumi is still going strong so far, I almost emptied the Wing Sung 601 EF.

Montblanc vintage black was surprisingly black but the lack of lubrication eventually got it eliminated. Also the total lack of water resistance. Sailor black was eliminated too, not dark enough, maybe some Sailor black fatigue as well.

J. Herbin Noir Abyssal is still going strong, surprisingly. I only had 2 long cartridges, the first one felt very meh when I tried it months ago, this time I'm starting to like it, even if it's not particularly dark, it flows well and the lubrication is excellent. It could be advantages in that I only have very few pens that can take long standard international cartridges, and that the Kaco (Bock? Jowo?) #6 EF nib is quite thick and inklously generous in its lines.

 

Sailor 023 and 027 are on standby on the shelf, I'm having decision paralysis, what pen to try them in? Platinum 3776? Sailor 1911? Pilot 74/742-912/743? I'm leaning toward a Pilot for now.
I also have some J. Herbin Perle noir cartridges somewhere, to be used with some Platinum international cartridges adapters maybe.

 

 

20 hours ago, USG said:

b7 has that "spreading" factor for sure.  It would be a real contender if it didn't do that.  It doesn't bother me too much but I know you like fine lines so I can see how it's not your Huckleberry.

 

 

20 hours ago, USG said:

Are you referring to InesF's ink chart? I can't find my link to it atm but I have the dry ink part of it in my albums...  what this shows is that Waterman Inspired blue is dryer than most of the Pelikan 4001 inks

 

 

Wait,I found the link

The thread is: An alternative look at ink wetness

 

 

 

Yes, this chart. Making me not recommend high surface tension inks in your new 823. Would recommend something medium-low at least. But surface tension isn't everything, as I'm sure Platinum BB is there to say.

 

17 hours ago, USG said:

Do you think Platinum Blue Black is safe for the 823?  It would have been my 2st choice but I was afraid it would corrode the metal rod.

Short term no, it has a "surprisingly high" pH of around 3 (there's more than just pH though), AKA higher than some Pelikan or Waterman inks. But let it mature, evaporate, concentrate, and I could see it having a nefarious effect on that steel rod. Perhaps that's more of a 743 ink, where you can replace the converter?

 

I was surprised by @Penguincollector 's comment about Platinum BB being the only cartridges without agitator? I only have old cartridges that are just the same as the Platinum red or black, with the annoyingly giant ball bearing used as a plug-then noisy agitator. I always wondered about that ball thing corroding, maybe it would be interesting to cut a cartridge open to examine it closer, that's a good point.

 

 

One last minute shader suggestion: R&K Permanent blue. Not sure about flow properties or ease of cleaning. And what about Sailor ink studio #943?

[USG]

18 hours ago, TSherbs said:

@USG Above, you list Waterman Inspired Blue as a dry ink. But aren't you asking here about blue-blacks, so don't you mean their "Mysterious Blue"? (And yes, I see that this also has a higher surface tension on InesF's list....)

 

For what it is worth, I'd try Diamine Denim (for safety's sake, and I like the color a lot for a blue-black with no gall).

The reason I mentioned Inspired Blue has a history.  It dates to when I was looking for a dryer ink for my Maga 600.  The regular inks I tried practically poured out of the pen.  I was looking for a turquoise ink so I tried Edelstein Topaz because I thought the Edelsteins were dry inks, but I didn't get the results I was looking for.  After looking at InesF's chart I switched to Inspired blue and that's where I am now.  

[TSherbs]

13 minutes ago, USG said:

The reason I mentioned Inspired Blue has a history.  It dates to when I was looking for a dryer ink for my Maga 600.  The regular inks I tried practically poured out of the pen.  I was looking for a turquoise ink so I tried Edelstein Topaz because I thought the Edelsteins were dry inks, but I didn't get the results I was looking for.  After looking at InesF's chart I switched to Inspired blue and that's where I am now.  

 

roger that

 

inky journeys, the long and winding roads

[USG]

18 hours ago, Mechanical said:

 

Waterman Mysterious Blue would be another wonderful choice.

 

I have some vintage MB, I'll give it a dip, but I think it might be too tealy for me....? 😀

 

17 hours ago, Penguincollector said:

What about Herbin’s Bleu Nuit? 

 

I have vintage BN.  I don't remember it doing any tricks like shading...  I'll give it a dip and check it out.... 😀  Have you had a chance to compare it to Verrerie?

 

[USG]

@Lithium466

I didn't forget your post.  😀👍

[Lithium466]

4 hours ago, USG said:

 

I have vintage BN.  I don't remember it doing any tricks like shading...  I'll give it a dip and check it out.... 😀  Have you had a chance to compare it to Verrerie?

 

BN is more muted, with a slight fading tendency once dry, maybe some "old school" vibe? BdlV is just more "modern" feeling, more lubricated, "wetter" and bluer instead of greyish blue.

[USG]

8 minutes ago, Lithium466 said:

BN is more muted, with a slight fading tendency once dry, maybe some "old school" vibe? BdlV is just more "modern" feeling, more lubricated, "wetter" and bluer instead of greyish blue.

 

That's a good description 😀👍

[Penguincollector]

 I agree with both @Lithium466’s  description and @USG’s response.