Sheaffer Snorkel Repair Assistance

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

So... I am trying to fix up my first Sheaffer Snorkel and it is not going the greatest so far. I have put placed a new sac in the pen, put it back together but it is not filling.

 

The problem I am trying to figure out... when I extend the snorkel and pull the "tube" out, the snorkel shoots back into the pen and then back out again with a pop (almost looks like it's jumping).

 

This, I am assuming, should definitely not be happening. As far as I can tell I have all the required seals and gaskets so I am not sure what the problem is. I did not replace the old ones but I checked them and they seemed pliable, especially the "point holder" gasket. Goes without saying it does not fill either. Is the problem with the o-ring and/or point holder or did I do something else incorrectly? Really struggling here.

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

Okay, there is a possibility here that I am an idiot and it is working. I tried filling it with water. So... I extend the snorkel and pull out the tube, put it in the water, then quickly press the tube in. If I pull the tube out again, nothing happens. If I push it in again, the water shoots out and there seems to be quite a bit coming out at high pressure.

 

Does that sound like how a Snorkel should work?

 

Will probably wait for an answer before trying to fill it with ink. Cleaning up water is easy enough, getting ink all over the place will not be fun.

 

 

[effrafax]

Sounds about right: to fill, you just extend the snorkel and pull out the filler tube, insert the snorkel into ink (or water for testing, as you have done), then push the tube in.  Leave the snorkel in the ink/water for a short time to allow the sac to expand back to its normal size and fill wilth ink, then screw the filler knob back in to withdraw the snorkel.

 

If everything is working, you should see some bubbles when you push the filler tube back in.  That's the sign that the sac is compressed, ready to fill with ink.

As you noted, if you extend the filler tube and push it back in again after filling, you will get a stream of ink/water from the snorkel.

 

[es9]

By “tube,” do you mean the filler tube that pulls out the back of the pen? 
 

First things first: Snorkels fill on the downstroke. Pressing the filler tube compresses ink sac which—assuming the snorkel is submerged—fills with ink when the vacuum is released. So it’s not surprising that nothing really happens when you pull the tube out after filling with water.* If you’re getting water shooting out on the downstroke then things are probably working as they should. 
 

Re the snorkel snapping back in: I suspect the filler tube is still threaded on the sac protector. As I’m sure you’ve discovered, the sac protector is extended/retracted by twisting the blind cap. It’s critical that the threads be totally disengaged before operating the filler type. Otherwise, it will not move freely; it will just pull the sac protector. If this is still a problem, first try making sure you’re fully turning the blind cap such that the threads are disengaged. If that doesn’t work, you might check to make sure the blind cap screw is fully screwed in. 
 

Also, a friendly warning: Water can do plenty of damage to a snorkel that has not been properly restored. If water gets into the barrel, the carbon steel spring will rust scarily fast. If it were my pen, I wouldn’t trust old seals or gaskets. New ones are not very expensive and, if you have the pen open, they’re easy enough to replace. The point seal gasket is particularly important because it stops ink from getting into the barrel. 
 

*I find on my snorkels that a little bit of ink or water shoots out when the filler tube is fully extended on a full pen. But that’s not the primary way these pens fill. 
 

 

Edited October 29, 2022 by es9
Added note about gaskets

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

4 minutes ago, es9 said:

By “tube,” do you mean the filler tube that pulls out the back of the pen? 
 

First things first: Snorkels fill on the downstroke. Pressing the filler tube compresses ink sac which—assuming the snorkel is submerged—fills with ink when the vacuum is released. So it’s not surprising that nothing really happens when you pull the tube out after filling with water.* 
 

Re the snorkel snapping back in: I suspect the filler tube is still threaded on the sac protector. As I’m sure you’ve discovered, the sac protector is extended/retracted by twisting the blind cap. It’s critical that the threads be totally disengaged before operating the filler type. Otherwise, it will not move freely; it will just pull the sac protector. 
 

First, try making sure you’re fully turning the blind cap such that the threads are disengaged. If that doesn’t work, you might check to make sure the blind cap screw is fully screwed in. 

 

*I find on my snorkels that a little bit of ink or water shoots out when the filler tube is fully extended on a full pen. But that’s not the primary way these pens fill. 

 

Hmm, interesting, you may be right, I may not have twisted it out all the way. Thanks for the help guys, I will give inking it a shot. Hopefully there are no leaks!

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

1 hour ago, es9 said:

Also, a friendly warning: Water can do plenty of damage to a snorkel that has not been properly restored. If water gets into the barrel, the carbon steel spring will rust scarily fast. If it were my pen, I wouldn’t trust old seals or gaskets. New ones are not very expensive and, if you have the pen open, they’re easy enough to replace. The point seal gasket is particularly important because it stops ink from getting into the barrel. 

 

Oh okay... the gasket really feels plenty springy and soft to me. My main reservation in regards to getting a new one is they're only sold in bulk and I don't need more than one. I kind of just wanted one Snorkel for my collection and now that I have one, I'm not interested in getting any more. The filling system is a little too fidgety for me and style-wise I'm really more into their Balance pens.

 

Is there a place I can buy just one of these? Or something I can improvise as a replacement? I'm more worried about the gasket, not at all about the o-ring. My understanding is the worst that can happen with the o-ring is that if it doesn't provide a proper seal, the pen won't fill. So that'll be easy enough to see if it's causing an issue.

 

Edit: I'll bite the bullet and buy some I guess. Replacing the gasket takes one second anyways so it's worth the peace of mind. Might leave the old o-ring until it fails though. If I ever decide to trade it to someone or give it away as a gift I'll replace that too. For my purposes the old one seems good enough for now.

 

Edit 2: Pen works fine so far by the way. Not a huge fan of the nib though, very dry. But might be partially my fault, I think there was still a bit of water in the snorkel and sac when I inked it up so the ink is a little diluted. I consider this a minor success for my first time, took the pen completely apart, put in a new sac, and everything is more or less functional.

[es9]

Re gasket: DM me if you just want one. That said, in my personal experience, snorkels tend to spontaneously multiply. 
 

Re nib: Can you share more about the nib itself? Assuming there’s nothing bent or misaligned, the normal tricks usually work to resolve flow issues. E.g., running it through an ultrasonic in a solution of water and ammonia, making sure it’s properly heat-set, carefully widening the channel just a little, etc. 

 

You should definitely feel accomplished about the restore! There are so many things that can go wrong when trying to service snorkels. Trying to get the rubber snorkel plug out without hurting the sac protector makes me nervous every time. 

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

51 minutes ago, es9 said:

Re gasket: DM me if you just want one. That said, in my personal experience, snorkels tend to spontaneously multiply. 
 

Re nib: Can you share more about the nib itself? Assuming there’s nothing bent or misaligned, the normal tricks usually work to resolve flow issues. E.g., running it through an ultrasonic in a solution of water and ammonia, making sure it’s properly heat-set, carefully widening the channel just a little, etc. 

 

You should definitely feel accomplished about the restore! There are so many things that can go wrong when trying to service snorkels. Trying to get the rubber snorkel plug out without hurting the sac protector makes me nervous every time. 

 

Oh I just ordered it, it's fine. Thank you for offering!

 

The nib looks fine as far as alignment and has ample tipping. The tipping is maybe just a tiny bit uneven but I've found there's really no good fix for that, whenever I try to grind to better shape I make it worse. The feedback would probably be fine if it was a bit wetter, only reason I'm feeling it is because the flow is stingy. 

 

I really think I must have left water in the nib or feed, I put Waterman Serenity Blue in it, and it's coming out super light as if it's watered down. I will probably try to write with it for a day or two and see if it improves.

 

Edit: wanted to ask something else, the snorkel is a little loose in the sac plug... is this an issue? Like I can move it freely by pulling on it.

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

The snorkel shouldn’t easily move in the plug. 
 

http://www.richardspens.com/ref/repair/snorkel.htm
 

tldr. A tiny drop of shelack will hold it in place

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

10 minutes ago, IThinkIHaveAProblem said:

The snorkel shouldn’t easily move in the plug. 
 

http://www.richardspens.com/ref/repair/snorkel.htm
 

tldr. A tiny drop of shelack will hold it in place

 

Hmm looks like I have some work to do... what is the consequence of leaving the snorkel tube a little loose? I am a little apprehensive putting shellac in an area that an easily get clogged and make the filler not function. Or getting it between the plug and protector which would be very bad...

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

If it’s too loose you will essentially have an air leak and everything that comes with that: Leaking pen. 
 

it’s a tiny drop of shellack on the outside of the rubber plug where the snorkel goes in to the plug. Shellack shouldn't be getting anywhere near the primary feed on the back of the plug. Richard’s instructions are very detailed and in depth. I recommend reading them a couple of times. 
 

maybe someone like Ron will chime in with his far more extensive knowledge. Mine is rather limited. 
 

I’ve only had to do it once (I think)

I’ll try and get a pic of the final result later if i get a chance. 

[es9]

+1 on a tiny drop of shellac. A pin or sewing needle can be used as an applicator.
 

Remember also that a leak won’t just cause writing problems; it will also cause the spring to rust. 

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

Ugh, I got shellac all over the base of the snorkel tube, is that an issue? I am definitely done with these. Sheaffer was the absolute king of whackadoodle asinine filling systems (vac-fill, touchdown, the "natural" evolution of the touchdown, the snorkel). At least they were good at marketing, I guess.

 

For the life of me I can't understand why American manufacturers didn't pick up on piston fillers from their European counterparts. You can find Pelikans from the early 50's that require zero maintenance. In comparison Sheaffer pens from this era are absolutely archaic.

[es9]

A little rubbing alcohol on a cotton swab should take care of it. (The alcohol won’t hurt anything since all you’re touching is metal or hard rubber.)
 

Can’t speak to the piston question, but I personally love snorkels. I’m not saying they’re a rock-solid design like the 51 aero. But the amount of imagination and ingenuity that had to go into figuring out how to make them work is really impressive. And that there are so many still hanging around with nothing needed other than a new sac is a testament to the design. It’s not like they’re red bands. 
 

That said, there is a decent learning curve. Restoring them is certainly much more complicated than a lever-filler. But it’s also much more satisfying. 

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

1 hour ago, es9 said:

And that there are so many still hanging around with nothing needed other than a new sac is a testament to the design.

I bought a triumph (all gold) snorkel a few weeks ago and it arrived WORKING   Yes. I know eventually I’ll have to do a kit. But man… working on arrival and that was my second or third that arrived that way! ( i buy unrestored pens)

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

2 hours ago, LoveBigPensAndCannotLie said:

Ugh, I got shellac all over the base of the snorkel tube, is that an issue?

Got any pics?

 

 It’s probably fine

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

here are a couple pics of the one I had to seal up, yes, the shellack spreads and the entire end of the rubber plug is covered.

Hence why it is shiny. Personally, I didn't and don't consider it to be a big issue. It has a job; to seal and hold in the snorkel tube, and it does it, well.

 

Hope this helps.

 

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

17 minutes ago, IThinkIHaveAProblem said:

here are a couple pics of the one I had to seal up, yes, the shellack spreads and the entire end of the rubber plug is covered.

Hence why it is shiny. Personally, I didn't and don't consider it to be a big issue. It has a job; to seal and hold in the snorkel tube, and it does it, well.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

Oh okay, yeah, this is what mine looks like now. About 1mm of the snorkel from the plug upwards has some shellac like on yours, I guess it's nothing to worry about. Thank you for the pictures.

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

1 hour ago, LoveBigPensAndCannotLie said:

 

Oh okay, yeah, this is what mine looks like now. About 1mm of the snorkel from the plug upwards has some shellac like on yours, I guess it's nothing to worry about. Thank you for the pictures.

You’re welcome

 let us know how it works out. 
and pics of the job and the pen would be great!

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

21 minutes ago, IThinkIHaveAProblem said:

You’re welcome

 let us know how it works out. 
and pics of the job and the pen would be great!

 

 

It's kind of okay. Not really all that satisfied in the flow. I cleaned it out and switched out the inks to a Pilot one which is on the wetter side and now it's just kind average. On the slightly cheap paper above it writes like a medium (which it should given the "M5" code) but on Rhodia it writes more like a fine nib.