Sailor PG KOP cap disassembly.

[4030]

Hello. I am pleased to join the FPN forums, I am looking forward to chatting with you. 

 

I have a late model Sailor Pro Gear King of Pen demonstrator. These models have a spring loaded inner cap that rotates as the pen is capped and threaded, much like the Platinum 3776. This action produces small specks of plastic dust particles (from the inner cap itself, rotating against the spring and shaving off material) between the cap and the inner cap. These tiny shavings are not possible to remove while the inner cap is still in place. Do any of you have any experience in disassembling these spring loaded models? 

 

I realize these kinds of visual annoyances is to be expected with a demonstrator pen, but I would just like to see if any of you have any tips for me. It is a shame that this is the case with an otherwise great pen. If I keep using it for many years to come, this constant removal of material will likely result in the inner cap falling out at some point. My experience however is that Sailor nibs function well without the inner cap, the cap itself is airtight enough to keep the ink in the nib wet.

 

Thank you for taking the time to read my question.

Edited August 17, 2022 by 4030
Added a picture of the cap.

[gerigo]

Wow, I can't even see the specks. Those bother you and not the ink trapped between the grip and the nib holder? Because there is no way for me to easily remove the grip to clean the water out, the pen is now left dry as an object of admiration:)

[A Smug Dill]

Welcome to FPN.

 

9 hours ago, 4030 said:

If I keep using it for many years to come, this constant removal of material will likely result in the inner cap falling out at some point.

 

I seriously doubt that will happen.

 

9 hours ago, 4030 said:

My experience however is that Sailor nibs function well without the inner cap, the cap itself is airtight enough to keep the ink in the nib wet.

 

That is my experience with both Profit and the Professional Gear gold-nibbed models. Still, having a spring-loaded inner cap makes doubly that ink evaporation is kept to a minimum, which to me is a boon.

[4030]

15 hours ago, gerigo said:

Wow, I can't even see the specks. Those bother you and not the ink trapped between the grip and the nib holder? Because there is no way for me to easily remove the grip to clean the water out, the pen is now left dry as an object of admiration:)

You are right, the specks are not easy to spot in this picture. This is why I will not disassemble the cap if noone tells me it is easy on this model. It is not the end of the world. I realize I am being very silly, I just wanted to check with a pen authority before I started opening it up.

 

I am happy to inform you that the pen has never had any ink or water inside the grip section. Something must have been done to remedy this, as I have experienced this issue with all my older Pro Gear demonstrators.

 

15 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

I seriously doubt that will happen.

I am happy to hear you say that, because I otherwise enjoy using this pen a great deal. It is an ergonomic favorite of mine.

Edited August 18, 2022 by 4030

[XYZZY]

I also have a KoP Pro Gear Demonstrator.  I pulled the pen out this morning to look for particles like you describe, but I did not see any.  I did not pull out the loupe to check--if they're too small for the naked eye then I will not care about them.

[EricTheRed]

I would leave well enough alone.  You have a great, world class, well functioning pen.  Enjoy it and it’s uniqueness!

[4030]

1 minute ago, EricTheRed said:

I would leave well enough alone.  You have a great, world class, well functioning pen.  Enjoy it and it’s uniqueness!

I agree. Thank you for your input.

[Number99]

Hello.

 

 Leaving aside the topic of disassembling the cap, please let me know as you have not mentioned the situation where the warranty is void.

 Is the pen's warranty already expired?

 

[4030]

3 hours ago, Number99 said:

Hello.

 

 Leaving aside the topic of disassembling the cap, please let me know as you have not mentioned the situation where the warranty is void.

 Is the pen's warranty already expired?

 

The warranty has not expired, but would be void if I disassembled it.

[Number99]

1 hour ago, 4030 said:

The warranty has not expired, but would be void if I disassembled it.

Exactly.

 

 I see a lot of fine dust you say.

 And I understand your concern.

 

 I am aware that it is a "flaw" caused by excess plastic left over from manufacturing the pen parts.

 In Japanese, it is called "バリ残り" (burr remaining).

 

 You're not just paying for a pen that simply works, you're also paying a lot for its "aesthetic value."

 I think it should be covered by the warranty because it's a "loss of aesthetics" caused by manufacturing surpluses (surpluses that should have been removed and sold by the manufacturer).

 I think that the opinion of the dealer and the opinion of the manufacturer may differ.

 We recommend that you contact the manufacturer by email.

 It is also possible to send an image if a reply comes.

 With the resolution of this photo, I think it is possible to explain the situation sufficiently to encourage the other party to enlarge it.

 

 This is "バリ残り".

 "burr remaining" is a machine translation, but is it in understandable English?

 😅

I think it's a problem that the manufacturer can easily fix. And I think it makes sense to negotiate.

 

 

[A Smug Dill]

1 minute ago, Number99 said:

This is "バリ残り".

 "burr remaining" is a machine translation, but is it in understandable English?

 😅

 

In English, you'd say it's debris from the manufacturing process.

 

That, however, is not the same thing as what the O.P. is claiming, which is that the plastic inner cap sheds new tiny fragments of plastic into that hollow space between it and the clear, hard exterior shell of the pen cap, because the movement of the inner cap against the metal spring on which it is mounted is causing plastic to be scraped off in the process of screwing the cap onto the barrel.

[Number99]

23 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

In English, you'd say it's debris from the manufacturing process.

 

That, however, is not the same thing as what the O.P. is claiming, which is that the plastic inner cap sheds new tiny fragments of plastic into that hollow space between it and the clear, hard exterior shell of the pen cap, because the movement of the inner cap against the metal spring on which it is mounted is causing plastic to be scraped off in the process of screwing the cap onto the barrel.

Thanks for any help.

 

 Is this phenomenon a normal appearance (specification) of the product?

 

 I think it makes sense to just contact the manufacturer about this phenomenon.

😊

 

[Number99]

Debris is probably loose garbage.

 The "バリ" is like the rim of a waffle, where the surplus is unorganized and joins the parts together as a structure.

 I said that it may have been scraped off by removing the cap.

 

[A Smug Dill]

15 minutes ago, Number99 said:

Debris is probably loose garbage.

 

I thought you were talking about tiny, unsightly specks of plastic that have settled onto the walls of the clear shell of the pen cap, as opposed to uneven, sharp, and/or frayed edges on the translucent plastic inner cap that may get worn smooth with use.

[Number99]

"バリ" refers to abnormal surplus left over illegally.

 

 Also, no such thing is visible on these used caps.

 

 It is up to the manufacturer to determine whether this condition is normal or abnormal.

 

https://glanzaus.blogspot.com/2011/12/kop.html?m=1

 

 

[Number99]

46 minutes ago, Number99 said:

"バリ" refers to abnormal surplus left over illegally.

 

 Also, no such thing is visible on these used caps.

 

 It is up to the manufacturer to determine whether this condition is normal or abnormal.

 

https://glanzaus.blogspot.com/2011/12/kop.html?m=1

 

 

The rim of the waffle is edible.

 It was a bad example.

 

 

Addition.

Although the area is specified, it is a contact point that also serves as a consultation point for warranty repairs.

https://en.sailor.co.jp/contact/

 

Edited August 23, 2022 by Number99

[4030]

12 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

In English, you'd say it's debris from the manufacturing process.

 

That, however, is not the same thing as what the O.P. is claiming, which is that the plastic inner cap sheds new tiny fragments of plastic into that hollow space between it and the clear, hard exterior shell of the pen cap, because the movement of the inner cap against the metal spring on which it is mounted is causing plastic to be scraped off in the process of screwing the cap onto the barrel.

You are exactly right, excellent summary. I have landed on not doing anything about this, it is simply not worth it.

[XYZZY]

13 hours ago, Number99 said:

 

 

 This is "バリ残り".

 "burr remaining" is a machine translation, but is it in understandable English?

 😅

 

 

Since you asked and I apparently had some time... 🙂 

 

I knew exactly what you meant when you wrote "burr".  I would have taken it for granted that in English most people would know what "burr" means, but I spend more time fiddling with tools with my hands and might have more exposure to that.

 

"Burr" is a correct term for what you're talking about, but there are several different definitions of burr and the one we're looking for is not the top definition (probably meaning that it isn't the most common usage).  With no context people might think of this burr: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bur.  (I didn't even know until a Wikipedia search that "bur" was an accepted spelling, I grew up in Texas where we would frequently get into the darned things and they always had two "r"s).

 

"Flashing" or "Flash" is correct for this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_(manufacturing.  However, like with "burr", there are other more common uses of the word "flash", like a flash from a flashing light or flashbulb. 

I think that burr is preferred if the thing comes about as a side effect of machining or manipulating a part.  For example, when sharpening a knife, if you work just one side with your sharpening stone you will eventually get a small super-thin bit of metal along the edge that rolls over to the other side (obviously you then take the stone to the other side and remove that bit).  That bit of metal is a "burr".  Whereas "flash" or "flashing" is preferred when referring to the extra material that oozes from between two parts of a mold when you're casting a part.  We would need some fairly detailed knowledge of how Sailor manufactures the parts to know which is preferred for this particular issue.

[Number99]

10 hours ago, XYZZY said:

 

Since you asked and I apparently had some time... 🙂 

 

I knew exactly what you meant when you wrote "burr".  I would have taken it for granted that in English most people would know what "burr" means, but I spend more time fiddling with tools with my hands and might have more exposure to that.

 

"Burr" is a correct term for what you're talking about, but there are several different definitions of burr and the one we're looking for is not the top definition (probably meaning that it isn't the most common usage).  With no context people might think of this burr: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bur.  (I didn't even know until a Wikipedia search that "bur" was an accepted spelling, I grew up in Texas where we would frequently get into the darned things and they always had two "r"s).

 

"Flashing" or "Flash" is correct for this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_(manufacturing.  However, like with "burr", there are other more common uses of the word "flash", like a flash from a flashing light or flashbulb. 

I think that burr is preferred if the thing comes about as a side effect of machining or manipulating a part.  For example, when sharpening a knife, if you work just one side with your sharpening stone you will eventually get a small super-thin bit of metal along the edge that rolls over to the other side (obviously you then take the stone to the other side and remove that bit).  That bit of metal is a "burr".  Whereas "flash" or "flashing" is preferred when referring to the extra material that oozes from between two parts of a mold when you're casting a part.  We would need some fairly detailed knowledge of how Sailor manufactures the parts to know which is preferred for this particular issue.

Hello.

 

Since "バリ" "ba-ri" sounded similar to "burr", I wondered if Google Translate recognized "ba-ri" as an onomatopoeia.

 After listening to your explanation, I think that the etymology of "ba-ri" may be "burr".

😊

 I also think that only the manufacturer can determine the cause.

 

It is OP who decides whether to use the guarantee or not.

 

 

[4030]

I broke my promise to myself and ended up going for it: I soaked the cap in hot hot warm water, tied a rubber band around the finnial and screwed it off. The inner cap was easily removeable from the spring housing and it is easy to put back in. This seems to be a virtually risk free endevour, as the entire screw-in part of the finial is made of solid metal. I did not need to remove the plastic anchor part from the metal screw assembly. I ended up keeping the inner cap off, to see if the pen stays nice and wet without the inner cap (I suspect it does, as Sailor caps are relatively air tight to begin with). As you can see in my poor photographs, the inner cap problem is visible once disassembled.

 

Thank you to  @Number99@A Smug Dill@gerigo@EricTheRed@XYZZY for your great input.