The Cost Of 'Fake' Arco

[Uncial]

The Omas 'Arco' celluloid material was beautiful; no doubt about it. Some companies bought some and still trickle it out at exorbitant prices. These practices aren't the ones that I'm targeting here - that's a whole other topic. I'm being a grumpy old man about the 'fake' arco that other pen producers make; such as Leonardo and Pineider, to name but two. They are essentially a slightly pearlescent and striped plastic, but it irritates the life out of me that they first of all limit something that doesn't actually need to be limited, and secondly they charge a massive mark up (compared to their own other models) on the basis that this fake arco is really special and they went through extraordinary feats and great lengths to make it. For the most part they look nothing like arco and in some instances not even close to arco (looking at you Pineider). That isn't to say they aren't attractive, but are they worth such a huge mark up from the standard range? Maye I need educated and these attempts at arco do in fact require a trip up the Ganges to learn the secret from the celluloid Sadhu and some rare earth plastics

[A Smug Dill]

8 minutes ago, Uncial said:

They are essentially a slightly pearlescent and striped plastic, but it irritates the life out of me that they first of all limit something that doesn't actually need to be limited,

 

I don't follow/understand what you're asserting there, sorry. What exactly are they limiting? The degree of pearlescence? The number of units of some product that could possibly be made and sold, if the consumer base is prepared to pay for it??

 

 

 

[JulieParadise]

Maybe Arco Precious Resin is as special as you mentioned (ironically), so I'd chime in be willing to learn what these attempts are all about. (Looks like I'll hang on to my little OMAS Dama in Arco Bronze Celluloid and give it some love whenever I see such "fake" Arcos.)

 

[JulieParadise]

4 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

I don't follow/understand what you're asserting there, sorry. What exactly are they limiting? The degree of pearlescence? The number of units of some product that could possibly be made and sold, if the consumer base is prepared to pay for it??

 

While the original  OMAS Arco material is indeed scarce now, the resin Arco stuff is not, not at all, so acting like the imitation of something very special and rare is as special and rare as the original is ... hmmm ... a bold claim. Of course, in the end it all comes down to how does it look (for itself, even without the reference) and if there are enough people willing to pay, but the marketing claims around the Arco Homage are weird.

 

Insofar I do understand the initial question. 

[A Smug Dill]

@JulieParadise Thank you for chiming in, but I still don't understand who is being (unduly?) limited in what way, by the (rational?) decisions of the aforementioned manufacturers.

[LoveBigPensAndCannotLie]

Do you mean this type of "arco" that Pineider makes? I guess my biggest issue would be if they're misrepresenting it as "real" arco, otherwise it doesn't bother me too much. The material is certainly very pretty but it's not arco celluloid.

 

In regards to the price, is this so different from Montblanc's "precious" resin which is just garden variety plastic? These luxury pen companies always try to find ways to make their pens feel special and worth the price that they charge for them, it's all marketing. I'd personally never buy them because it's not worth so much to me but for some people it is.

[Strega]

Most limited and special editions of most products aren’t made of lunar rocks or anything that they really run out of. A company that usually makes a product in black, decides to use blue for a week, and they have a limited edition, because they limited it.

[JulieParadise]

2 hours ago, A Smug Dill said:

@JulieParadise Thank you for chiming in, but I still don't understand who is being (unduly?) limited in what way, by the (rational?) decisions of the aforementioned manufacturers.

This is answered by this:

2 hours ago, Strega said:

Most limited and special editions of most products aren’t made of lunar rocks or anything that they really run out of. A company that usually makes a product in black, decides to use blue for a week, and they have a limited edition, because they limited it.

 

Essentially, what they're doing is limiting a material that could be made in abundance and is the copy of a material that is truly scarce, then claiming their limited edition is as rare = precious as the original and then being happy manufacturers. This is, in itself, not bad or unduly, but still one might scratch their head asking "who is going to fall for that!?", as @Uncial did. 😉 

[Paul-in-SF]

Certainly people are falling for the tactic, whether for resin "arco" or for any pen version that isn't available every day for the foreseeable future. That's why the tactic continues to be used, because it works. If I'm not interested in these "limited" or "special" editions or materials, it doesn't hurt me if someone else buys them. 

 

In fact, I think it is the collectors who do buy these things that prop up a lot of the fountain pen companies who also make other products that the rest of us sometimes want to buy. 

[Carrau]

Is it not the pursuit of the original pens made of the Arco materials that in fact drives this proliferation of spin-off and wannabe materials and pens?  The current manufacturers produce the new materials and pens because they recognize the profitability of hanging onto the coat-tails of the originals, whose prices are driven by the appearance of being special and of limited availability (among other things like aesthetics, nib quality).  How many pens were made of the original Arco materials?  Perhaps more than those currently being produced as “limited editions.”  And who really knows how much of the original material still exists?  If OMAS was still manufacturing them, wouldn’t they charge what the market would bear (prices even more exorbitant than the wannabes)?  As Uncial pointed out, modern versions in Arco material keep popping up fairly regularly on sites like Leonardo and  St. Johns Pens, easily commanding as much as the originals (in some cases the prices of these new Arco pens have increased 150-200% in the last 18 months, from what I’ve seen, and most are listed as “Sold out” rather quickly).  
 

The newer materials and pens might have generated the same aesthetic interest were the originals never made and available for comparison with a cult-like following.  I can admire the beauty of some of these old materials, but even as an owner of OMAS products, the Arco materials hold no special attraction for me (beauty in the eye…., and so on).  Who knows what beautiful materials are yet to come?  They are likely more durable and potentially useful than the originals made of celluloid (we’ve read the tragic stories here).  If it is only the wonderful nibs in the originals that people want, they are surely available in much less expensive editions by the original makers.  As with anything else, production and the search for replica materials will go on as long as the market finds interest and willingness to spend for them.    

[Uncial]

Does anyone with the manufacturing knowledge know if these fake arcos are considerably more expensive to make than the regular fancy resins? Or is the huge mark up just a gouge?

[Uncial]

6 hours ago, JulieParadise said:

Maybe Arco Precious Resin is as special as you mentioned (ironically), so I'd chime in be willing to learn what these attempts are all about. (Looks like I'll hang on to my little OMAS Dama in Arco Bronze Celluloid and give it some love whenever I see such "fake" Arcos.)

 

 

I would definitely hold on to that.  It's quite a beauty. I was fortunate to buy an Omas Ogiva arco when the company was still going. Paid half of what Visconti was asking for one of their mid range pens I was also looking at at the time. I made the right choice. 

[Aether]

I am in a minority here as I don't like the arco material at all.  It is too reminiscent of diffraction patterns to be comfortable for me to look at.

[mauckcg]

7 hours ago, Uncial said:

The Omas 'Arco' celluloid material was beautiful; no doubt about it. Some companies bought some and still trickle it out at exorbitant prices. These practices aren't the ones that I'm targeting here - that's a whole other topic. I'm being a grumpy old man about the 'fake' arco that other pen producers make; such as Leonardo and Pineider, to name but two. They are essentially a slightly pearlescent and striped plastic, but it irritates the life out of me that they first of all limit something that doesn't actually need to be limited, and secondly they charge a massive mark up (compared to their own other models) on the basis that this fake arco is really special and they went through extraordinary feats and great lengths to make it. For the most part they look nothing like arco and in some instances not even close to arco (looking at you Pineider). That isn't to say they aren't attractive, but are they worth such a huge mark up from the standard range? Maye I need educated and these attempts at arco do in fact require a trip up the Ganges to learn the secret from the celluloid Sadhu and some rare earth plastics

The only one I am aware of from Leonardo is an "Arco Grey."  It is a celluloid.  It's also in line with their other non Omas celluloid offerings.

[A Smug Dill]

8 hours ago, JulieParadise said:

Essentially, what they're doing is limiting a material that could be made in abundance and is the copy of a material that is truly scarce, then claiming their limited edition is as rare = precious as the original and then being happy manufacturers. This is, in itself, not bad or unduly, but still one might scratch their head asking "who is going to fall for that!?", as @Uncial did. 😉 

 

Oh, that issue again at heart.

 

All production is finite. It does not make sense to me, as an observer, for whoever controls production and effectively has monopoly on supply, to decide by default that it will produce as many units within its means as possible to satisfy consumer demand, if the primary effects are making the good in question more accessible and push down prices in the supply-and-demand equation, without the net effect being that the producer will be more profitable for it.

 

If the demand for the good is elastic, if the profit margin even at lower prices is considered high enough from the business' point of view, and/or if there's a priority in gaining market share instead of letting revenue fall to competitors' products (or dissimilar goods on which consumers can spend their money instead of pens), then those are good reasons for a producer to make plenty of units such that the product is always available on the spot, to capture spending from users who from time to time just need another good pen with which to write. That's what the plain black (or maroon, or blue) variants of ‘signature’ and/or ‘flagship’ models are all about; that's the battleground for being everyman's reliable (and perhaps respectable) workhorse writing instrument is fought. Collectors who are driven by the looks of a product, more so than its functional capability and performance, to buy yet another unit of a particular pen model can (and, in my opinion, should) be squeezed by whatever marketing and business tactics for more discretionary spending; they're the ones who are prepared to pony up the extra dollars to assuage their FOMO and/or make themselves “happy” with possessions.

 

Why bother making prettier models that are priced the same as plainer models that do exactly the same thing just as well in the hand of a user, when presumably physical beauty would make the owner more satisfied overall, if it is not also treated as an opportunity to take more money from such would-be buyers who would otherwise choose not to spend that money with the particular producer?

 

Leaving more money in the buyers' pockets to deal with other needs and wants in life, without putting them in a position to have to compromise on overall satisfaction, is not “the common good” that the industry and/or everyone “in his/her right mind” would endeavour to support. We aren't talking about life's essentials such as food and medicine here, that denying someone economical access could be unconscionably damaging.

[Uncial]

10 hours ago, mauckcg said:

The only one I am aware of from Leonardo is an "Arco Grey."  It is a celluloid.  It's also in line with their other non Omas celluloid offerings.

 

They did both, did they not? I thought they had secured some genuine old stock Arco celluloid from Omas and sold it as pens for about €1,300 or thereabouts if memory serves. Then they introduced a plastic version (Arco 'magic' or something like that?). It was very pretty and cost less (I think about €600 for the steel nibbed version).

 

Pineider released an 'Arco' version of their pen quite a while ago. It was a kind of shimmery brown plastic. Very pretty, but with a hefty price hike just because it bore the name 'Arco' yet looking absolutely nothing like Arco celluloid. 

 

Not very long ago, another Italian manufacturer - who I can't remember - released a set of pens in green, red and blue (I think) in a material that looked to all intents and purposes exactly like the Pineider material. Again, very pretty, no claims to being Arco and sold at a very reasonable price. 

[MarcoA63]

Just my two cents here. If you want an original 'arco' pen by vintage and don't fall for new LE / SE editions made today that state they are 'arco'.

Leonardo wasn't even an idea when Omas developed the 'arco' and the same for Pineider. They are all hoaxes 🙂

 

[Strega]

I was recently introduced to Sailor pens (primarily as a quick way of getting an actually extra fine nib while waiting for a nibmeister to narrow-down a Pelikan EF.)  Let’s see, I could have a Sailor 1911S in black for $180, or some fancier “North America” colors for $220, or a really fancy “cranberry sparkle” “color of the year” for $280.  Or…. I could pop over to a Japanese ebay vendor, where a Sparkly Red Profit Light is a regular edition, and pay.. oh… $75.  Probably not the exact same red and they have different trim colors, less fancy box, etc. – which is to say Sailor’s marketers are not idiots.  

 

Then again, I have a bunch of Pelikan city series pens which are (mostly) regular Pelikans in different plastics, and I notice that when I look on ebay, I see them being sold for 2-3 times what I paid, so I don’t feel too bad for paying extra for some fancy colors that I like.

 

In short: whatever floats your boat.  In Pineder’s case, they’re hoping that one will float about 888 boats.  Apparently not yours or mine, but that’s OK.

 

[OMASsimo]

What you observe there seems to me just normal marketing. This is particularly common in the luxury sector. The price difference of the raw materials is certainly not a big factor, difference in labour cost could be more if it’s celluloid but I doubt that it would warrant a too big price difference. But if the price is high enough that most people wouldn’t be willing to pay it, then you are in the luxury segment and people might buy it just because most others would consider it ridiculously overpriced. What makes it so exquisit is just the high price. If the price is high enough, then making it a limited edition or such even wouldn’t be necessary. So, in my opinion those LEs/SEs are an attempt to make items “exquisit” fishing for those who need a justification for a maybe unreasonably high price. That means they are probably on the low end of the luxury scale. Real luxury is, if you don’t need any reason to pay a ridiculous price.

[mauckcg]

12 hours ago, Uncial said:

 

They did both, did they not? I thought they had secured some genuine old stock Arco celluloid from Omas and sold it as pens for about €1,300 or thereabouts if memory serves. Then they introduced a plastic version (Arco 'magic' or something like that?). It was very pretty and cost less (I think about €600 for the steel nibbed version).

 

Pineider released an 'Arco' version of their pen quite a while ago. It was a kind of shimmery brown plastic. Very pretty, but with a hefty price hike just because it bore the name 'Arco' yet looking absolutely nothing like Arco celluloid. 

 

Not very long ago, another Italian manufacturer - who I can't remember - released a set of pens in green, red and blue (I think) in a material that looked to all intents and purposes exactly like the Pineider material. Again, very pretty, no claims to being Arco and sold at a very reasonable price. 

I know what your referring to.  Cuspide they were called.  Named for the Lance Cusp, the pointy bit of a spear it seems.  I think Arco was mentioned but i don't see any of the promotional stuff saying it is arco like they did with the Grey Arco.  It was made from stacked layers of acrylic and it was a limited model, hence the price.