Nib Grinding

[surprise123]

Simple question: Should I have my flex Waterman 502/Commando nib ground at the DC Pen Supershow? (Traded it for my L2K). It looks like it writes fine in the pictures, but I want a little more... dramatic flair. Medium to broad? Come on. XXF to broad? That's more like it. I want to have it ground down to an XXF to emphasize line variation (it's a semi flex) and also because semi flexers are great everyday carriers. How much should I expect to pay?

 

Yes, some people are going to be asking where my wet noodle Duofold is. I sold it. Think about this. I'm a 14 year-old schoolkid who barely has hit his growth spurts. I don't need a flexy wet noodle nib to write an English essay. What I DO need is a reliable, semiflex nib that will provide me a cushiony writing experience that will prevent me from having to lift my pen up every few sentences to catch my breath (I still kind of struggle with writing cursive neatly and quickly). Plus, the Parker 51 has showed me that vintage nibs are magnificent if used for their specific purposes. A wet noodle celluloid fragile pen does not suit my needs.

[Tweel]

If you narrow the tipping that much, wouldn't you end up with a nib that goes from XXF to XF? That is, the tines apparently spread just enough to go up one size.

Edited May 27, 2018 by Tweel

[ReadyFireAim]

Ranga 3CS5 w/ Creaper nib & KWZ Gummiberry

https://www.gouletpens.com/noodler-s-nib-creaper-2-steel-nib-flex/p/N18090

[surprise123]

If you narrow the tipping that much, wouldn't you end up with a nib that goes from XXF to XF? That is, the tines apparently spread just enough to go up one size.

I don't think that's how flex nibs work... the tipping size does not affect the flexibility of the nib. My friend DIY'd a Noodler's Creaper to write like the picture posted by Nail-Bender, however hers was much more scratchy than I liked.

[Buzz_130]

You will find nibmeisters ready to repair or grind a nib at the DC Supershow. You can expect to pay somewhere in the vicinity of $25 for the 15-20 minute window with the expert.

 

However, you should make sure you have realistic expectations. Complex operations like adding flex to a nib may not be possible at the show. Some will tell you to send the pen to them back to their office to put the right amount of time in. I’ve had people do some repairs on vintage pens with the warning that it may have to go home with them.

 

I’m also not sure if a “semi-flex” truly goes from a XXF to medium. You are getting into the full flex realm.

 

Enjoy the show, and take time to talk to the experts around the room.

 

Buzz

[jmnav]

I don't think that's how flex nibs work... the tipping size does not affect the flexibility of the nib. My friend DIY'd a Noodler's Creaper to write like the picture posted by Nail-Bender, however hers was much more scratchy than I liked.

 

In fact I'd say... yes, and no.

 

If you are comfortable with a given nib opening tines, let's say, up to 1mm and the nib's point is, say, a BBB which already produces a 1mm line when unflexed, then what you have is a line variation from 1mm to 2mm (2x variation). If you then regrind that nib so it produces a 0,1mm line unflexed, then it'll produce 1,1mm line when flexed (a 11x variation). Obviuosly, 1.1mm is much less than the original 2mm but still the variation appearance will be greatly enhanced.

 

But then, you are right in that the finer the nib's point, the smaller its "sweet spot" so the scratchier and difficult to use it'll become, specially when flexed (the geometry of the part touching the paper will greatly vary, and will be less forgiving). Another associated problem is that it will be more prone to false starts/railroading (because the "ink cushion" against the paper will be shorter and, thus, easier to break)

 

I own two quite flexible "big" nibs (one from a Waterman's Hundred Year, the other from a Matador Garant 996) but, being both of them XF to XXF, while they produce quite an impressive line variation when I seek it, "just" writing cursive, the semiflexes from a Pelikan 400 or a Montblanc 146g I also own, are much more expresive and gratifying to use on a daily basis just because, while a bit less flexible than the other two, they happen to have M nib points which makes them easier/more comfortable to use.

[ReadyFireAim]

...My friend DIY'd a Noodler's Creaper to write like the picture posted by Nail-Bender, however hers was much more scratchy than I liked.

Ranga / Creaper & KWZ Gummiberry

[surprise123]

I use cheap copy paper on a daily basis, so extra fine nibs are a must. The line variation emphasis is more of what I am looking for, instead of the amount of line variation given as a whole, i.e. extra fine to a medium semi-flex nib instead of a wet noodle BBB stub. The Waterman 502 I'm getting is only a semi-flex.

 

Recently, my school transitioned from W.B Mason paper to a no-name brand. I want to see what a vintage nib, ground down to XXF, will do to that paper. Plus, my writing is teensy tiny anyways, so a good way to get the teeny tiny letters is to spend money on a good gold nib (not prejudicing against steel nibs here!) that is on a pen I can rely on for everyday usage. Previously, W.B. Mason paper liked my XF Parker 51. The new paper does not. I don't have pictures right now, but the EF '51 nib feathers a bit on the new paper (partly because I flossed the tines to get some more ink flow before the paper switch).

 

Semiflexers are easily my favorite types of flex nibs because you can use them on a daily basis (as long as they're not fragile pen bodies). They put a larger, but not necessarily wetter, cushion underneath your writing. The main reason I want to grind down a semi-flex nib to an extra fine point is that it provides me with the best of both worlds. You get an extra extra fine point when written lightly, and you get character in your writing when desired. The Duofold, with its firehose medium and wet noodle nib, just was too much for my school paper to handle. I have made holes in the paper from when I bubble in a blank too much, and the ink oversaturates the paper and just tears it apart.

 

And no, I don't want my nib to become any more flexible. Semiflexers are not meant for intended line variation. They are meant just to give your writing some... characteristic. A signature with a specific type of ink with a specific character in its lines and shading is much more difficult to forge than a... ugh... ballpoint.

[surprise123]

You will find nibmeisters ready to repair or grind a nib at the DC Supershow. You can expect to pay somewhere in the vicinity of $25 for the 15-20 minute window with the expert.

 

However, you should make sure you have realistic expectations. Complex operations like adding flex to a nib may not be possible at the show. Some will tell you to send the pen to them back to their office to put the right amount of time in. I’ve had people do some repairs on vintage pens with the warning that it may have to go home with them.

 

I’m also not sure if a “semi-flex” truly goes from a XXF to medium. You are getting into the full flex realm.

 

Enjoy the show, and take time to talk to the experts around the room.

 

Buzz

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Waterman-502-Lever-Fill-Fountain-Pen-Ca-1930s-Beautiful-Flexible-Nib-/123060543877?hash=item1ca6fae185%3Ag%3AVZAAAOSwiYRaxkHf&nma=true&si=y3mBDwI%252FFdesmUrDrd6%252BVSRkCjc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&afsrc=1&rmvSB=true

 

Scroll down and see if it's plausible.

[Bo Bo Olson]

There is no universal nib. (I do like semi-flex, 27, have 16 maxi's also.) They are not good on PP paper.

 

If I was going write microscopic, I'd not worry abut anyone's M, even the Japanese. You have to push the nib too much, too hard, to often...and it will spring sooner or later. Read Richard Bender's article on metal fatigue.

 

Go Japanese....some of the Pilot pens with half moons ground out like an Ahab should be semi-flex.

Go XF Japanese = XXF western...might with work go out to Japanese M, western F.

XXF-EF, F, would be it.....and it will be a wet nib, due to ease of tine spread..........not what you want on PP paper.

 

Dry ink helps....Noodlers is a very wet ink, Pelikan 4001 is a dry ink. That can take the width of the line down a size.

 

Someone mentioned a 15-20 minute window at a pen show...they know more than me. I do know making a regular flex much less making a nail requires much thinning the body, shoulders ...in a quite room, more than likely. I think you would have to leave the pen.........and cost.........well you can get a semi-flex Geha 790 off of German Ebay if you Hunt for E60 (if they take paypal or mail outside of German...many won't and don't.)....finding it in EF will be harder.

 

If making a nail to a semi-flex or even a regular flex to a semi-flex was easy; everyone would be doing it. Binder had done it...I know with semi-nail...modern 400/600.

 

What flex rate has that Waterman pen, I've never heard of? The only modern Waterman I had; a Graduate was a nail.

 

Vintage German '50-60's EF is a half size narrower than modern...and is a 'true' EF....EF-F- pushing the hell out of the nib constantly will edge for springing it, will be M....3X is the Max....not the norm.

 

Yes, can be used for descenders once you have learned how to draw them....but not every letter or even a letter in every word; if you want to stay on the same page as your teacher.

Semi-flex will give you that old fashioned fountain pen flair, with out doing anything....but not on PP paper.

 

Semi-flex is always a wetter nib....due to the tine spread.

I actually think a nice springy regular flex is more your school need, in they are dryer or even a super dry nail would be better for your school paper.

You could buy your own paper......store it with your teachers for tests!!!

 

Spreading a semi-flex nib to Max....ends up work...once one is no longer Ham Fisted.

 

Half the reason to get such a nib, is it's a stub, so you get the best of both worlds.

XXF will have no stub left. ..............just a fat writing XXF nib.

 

Should think of being able to expand your hand writing.

Take two sheets of paper, fold in half. In the first half write as large as you can, in each half on each side smaller, until the 8th side is down to your 'tiny' script.

 

If I was a teacher, having too tiny a script would be a minus grade.

 

Are you a printer? Then defiantly go Japanese, in those nibs were designed around a tiny printed script.

Western nibs around the wider and more flowing cursive.

[surprise123]

I have a Pilot Metropolitan that I use for teeny tiny wee small margin notes. I also use it for math constructions and equations.

 

I found that being around the Lamy 2000 has suited me well for maintaining a steady grip on my nib angle. The 2K is moving to a new home, and the Waterman is moving in.