Do Some Inks Cause A Broader Line In Your Pens?

[brandonsandy]

I recently inked up my Lamy 2000 EF with Noodlers Liberty's Elysium and I noticed that the line seemed to be broader than when I use my other inks. My question is if this sort of thing has happened to any of you? Maybe it's just because this ink is pretty wet, but I wanted some feedback to see if this has happened to other people. This is my first post to FPN, and I'm excited to get more in touch with the community!

[View from the Loft]

Welcome.

 

In short, yes. There are three factors in play: the nib, the ink and the paper. We know the nib hasn't changed and that the ink has, so assuming that the paper has not changed, it will be the ink that has made the difference.

[ac12]

 

Welcome.

 

In short, yes. There are three factors in play: the nib, the ink and the paper. We know the nib hasn't changed and that the ink has, so assuming that the paper has not changed, it will be the ink that has made the difference.

 

 

+1

Some inks are worse than others. Besides making the ink line wider, they bleed through the paper.

You need to adjust the nib to slow down the ink flow, if you want to control these wetter inks.

[haruka337]

Welcome to the forums, brandonsandy!

Differing inks will lay down varying line widths. Wet or lubricant ink will oft create a thicker line than, say, a dry ink. Though, this is also dependent on a nib's ink flow and paper quality of the paper in use.

[AndyYNWA]

Welcome!

 

The line width can vary slightly between different inks, but usually it's not that much you will care.

However, Kyo-no-oto Aonibi gives me about one size broader line, and that bothers me quite a lot. It's just too much. But I like the colour...

[brandonsandy]

Welcome!

 

The line width can vary slightly between different inks, but usually it's not that much you will care.

However, Kyo-no-oto Aonibi gives me about one size broader line, and that bothers me quite a lot. It's just too much. But I like the colour...

Yeah, the increase in line width when using Liberty's Elysium isn't drastic but it's enough to be noticeable. I thank all for your input! Just wanted to see if it was something that others experience.

[ENewton]

Whether the width is noticeable also depends to some degree on the narrowness of the nib. I often use a Pilot Prera fine point, and the difference in line width is dramatic depending on whether I use a drier ink (e.g., Montblanc Lavender Purple) or a wetter ink (e.g., Poussiere de Lune).

[Noihvo]

If it bothers you a lot, Noodler's is a very concentrated (or as we say, saturated) ink, and can be diluted somewhat with (possibly distilled) water, to (ironically) make it drier and not spread as much. Try diluting a small batch, a few millilitres, separately, and start with just 10% and work your way up until you are satisfied.

[Chrissy]

Welcome.

 

In short, yes. There are three factors in play: the nib, the ink and the paper. We know the nib hasn't changed and that the ink has, so assuming that the paper has not changed, it will be the ink that has made the difference.

 

+1 for this.

[cellmatrix]

That's why I don't like Liberty Elysium or the other Noodler inks I've tried, the line is too wide. It interferes with my writing and instead I gravitate towards drier inks which give thinner lines.

[Arkanabar]

Well, I get a broader (and more feathered) line from Borealis Black in my fine M200 than I get from somewhat dilute Red-Black, so it's likely to be the ink.

 

eta: cellmatrix, you might benefit from diluting Noodler's inks you're getting the spreading and feathering from. I know it remedies smudging and slow dry times for me.

Edited July 28, 2016 by Arkanabar

[Sandy1]

Hi,

 

Yes.

 

I very mush agree with prior Replies, so I have little to add ...

 

Of the ink types, the iron-gall and nano particle inks are the least likely to show line-width gain (spread).

 

Some of the wetter / free flowing and high dye-load simple aniline dye inks are prone to deliver a slightly plump line.

 

I haven't sampled a lot of the cellulose-reactive inks, but it seems they vary quite bit.

 

Also consider the manner of writing. For example, I write with a brisk light hand, which puts down less ink than a ponderous heavy hand, so I am less likely to encounter significant spread, but when I do, it is clear the pen+paper+ink performance profile was breached. Sometimes that is accompanied by bleed- show-through and loss of line quality.

 

At home my prefered work around is to switch to a harder/coated writing paper, such as Rhoda. At the office, esp. if I'm doing a bit of form filling on naughty_word paper, I invert the nib (feed upper-most) to deliver a dry narrow line.

 

Bye,

S1

Edited July 29, 2016 by Sandy1

[KKay]

Yes, some inks will make a more bold line width, than other inks, using the very same pen and paper. I have inks on the wet side, and dry side. I put the wet ink in pens that need a boost, such as the Prera F. Some pens are finicky about what ink they like to run with. I found a Western Broad nib is too broad for me. So I put a more dry ink in that pen, to counteract the wider line width. So it all works out in the end. A Japanese fine is a little too fine. So I like to use a pen somewhere between those two extremes. However I dearly love an italic pen, and that must be my favorite of all.

[dcwaites]

Yes, it's called spreading.

Depending on the ink and the paper, ink can move in three ways - evenly sideways, called spreading; out along paper fibres to give a spiky edge, called feathering; and down through the paper till it comes out the other side, called bleeding.

 

There are substances in the ink called wetting agents (really a form of soap) that helps the ink flow through the pen. These substances make the bleeding and spreading worse if there is too much.

 

Some inks tend not to bleed or spread, especially the nano-particle pigmented inks and the iron-gall containing inks. Of the bulletproof inks, Noodler's Black also doesn't bleed or spread.

 

Saturated inks like the Private Reserve inks, the dye-based Noodler's inks, the Diamine inks and the like tend to have more wetting agent to help with the high dye load. These inks will all bleed and spread more than less saturated inks like Pelikan 4001 Blue and Sheaffer Skrip Blue.

 

Some papers combat spreading and bleeding very well, such as Double-A, Rhodia and Clairefontaine, and Japanese papers like Koyoko Campus, Apica and Nakabayashi. The ultimate in ink-controlling papers is Tomoe River.

[Kenlowe]

Good comprehesive set of comments, thank you David.

[ian1964]

Yes, it's called spreading.

Depending on the ink and the paper, ink can move in three ways - evenly sideways, called spreading; out along paper fibres to give a spiky edge, called feathering; and down through the paper till it comes out the other side, called bleeding.

 

There are substances in the ink called wetting agents (really a form of soap) that helps the ink flow through the pen. These substances make the bleeding and spreading worse if there is too much.

 

Some inks tend not to bleed or spread, especially the nano-particle pigmented inks and the iron-gall containing inks. Of the bulletproof inks, Noodler's Black also doesn't bleed or spread.

 

Saturated inks like the Private Reserve inks, the dye-based Noodler's inks, the Diamine inks and the like tend to have more wetting agent to help with the high dye load. These inks will all bleed and spread more than less saturated inks like Pelikan 4001 Blue and Sheaffer Skrip Blue.

 

Some papers combat spreading and bleeding very well, such as Double-A, Rhodia and Clairefontaine, and Japanese papers like Koyoko Campus, Apica and Nakabayashi. The ultimate in ink-controlling papers is Tomoe River.

Wow, I never knew all this. Thank you.

[Jebus]

Interesting! I have never thought of it this way...

[cellmatrix]

Well, I get a broader (and more feathered) line from Borealis Black in my fine M200 than I get from somewhat dilute Red-Black, so it's likely to be the ink.

 

eta: cellmatrix, you might benefit from diluting Noodler's inks you're getting the spreading and feathering from. I know it remedies smudging and slow dry times for me.

Thanks for the suggestion Arkanbar. But I no longer have any Noodlers inks. I stopped using them long ago in favor of other inks I like better.

[AndyYNWA]

Just because an ink is wet, doesn't mean it spreads.