Kaweco Modern Nibs - Which Nibs Are Less Likely To Need Adjustment?

[OakIris]

I will be buying either a Kaweco Liliput Fire Blue or a Kaweco Brass Sport fountain pen in the near future. (Possibly both pens if I am foolhardy with my money – which I often am. ) The pen, or pens, will be a “tax return” gift for me for making it through another year. I would like to get some advice about which nib to get, primarily in terms of which nib is least likely to need a whole lot of work to get it writing properly.

 

I have not heard about problems with Kaweco’s 14K gold nibs. The gold nibs are out of my price range, however, so I am “stuck” with buying the steel nibs, and Kaweco's steel nibs seem to be a different story. I have read a lot of comments and posts that indicate that, more likely than not, the steel nibs (made by Bock, or so I have been told) on current production Kaweco pens will need to have some adjustments made to them before the pen will write properly. The major problem seems to be that the nibs are very dry writers; another oft-mentioned problem, at least with the broader nibs, is that they seem to be prone to have the “baby-bottom” problem.

 

I realize that folks are more likely to post things when they have complaints about a nib than when they love it – sad but true – so perhaps my impression has little to do with reality, but it would seem that the probability of getting a “bum” nib right out of the box seems pretty high. I don’t mind making some adjustments, though the thought of having to hack the feed or grind the nib on a brand new nib gives me pause, but are there some Kaweco-Bock nib sizes that are LESS likely to have problems? Or is it all luck of the draw, you "gets what you gets" no matter the nib size?

 

(On a side note, since the 1990’s, Kaweco has collaborated with a company in Japan that makes their pen components for them. I have no idea what Japanese company that is, but, considering the high quality of their nibs (And components in general,) I sure wish that Pilot was the company Kaweco worked with and that Pilot supplied the nibs, not Bock. Even inexpensive Pilot Metropolitan pens have wonderful nibs on them; why can’t Kaweco/Bock produce equally decent nibs for their relatively MUCH more expensive pens?!?)

 

Of course, I am hoping to luck out and have a pen that writes first time and every time just as I like, but, just in case....

 

Holly

Edited February 16, 2016 by OakIris

[wascallyrabbit]

i have two kaweco sports with ef nibs and both write fine right out the boxes with no adjustments necessary. generally i carry one of the sports as a back up to my main edc pen in my pocket.

i though the sport and liliput used the same nibs.

[kong]

Hi OakIris, while I am not the best resource in this matter, I own two Kaweco pens with differing nibs. One is a BrassSport with an EF and the other is a Copper Liliput with a BB (they actually arrived the other way around but I swapped the nibs as they are interchangable). The EF is, what I think to be, somewhat a dry writer although I don't have enough experience to know what is termed on average a 'dry writer'. It is a very reliable nib though and always consistently writes, even when left uncapped for a while. It is also in no way scratchy - I say this in comparison to the Lamy EF that I have. The BB nib that I have has 'hard starts'. It takes one or two (or several) passes sometimes before the ink starts flowing but once it does, the nib is amazing. It is super smooth and seriously enjoyable. While in my exploration of fountain pens I realised I don't really like XF nibs, therefore I enjoy the BB more. I guess I'm going through the phase of trying to find line variation and to make my writing more interesting. Unfortunately, my experience with Kaweco nibs is only on opposite ends of the nib size spectrum and on a limited basis of only two pens. Hopefully others' inputs would help you out more.

[OakIris]

Encouraging to read about your positive experience with the nibs on both of your Kaweco pens, wascallyrabbit; I can only hope to have the same good experiences.

 

The Sport (except for the Classic Sport, I think) and the Liliput do use the same nibs, which is quite cool. It is likely that I will get both pens - I apparently have no will power when it comes to shiny new (or shiny old) fountain pens. Each pen will have a differently sized nib on it - unless the consensus is that only the EF nibs will do and all the others need to be sent back to the factory, lol - along with a spare gold-plated steel nib of a different size, just to give me options. Perhaps only one of them will need adjustment!

 

@kong - thank you for your response as well. Another relatively good experience with an EF nib. From your description of its behavior, it almost sounds as if your broad nib may be suffering from baby bottom. Kind of what I am expecting, too - I definitely like broader nibs and was hoping to get a double broad. Hopefully just some work with some micromesh will "fix" the problem, but still disappointing that you have to deal with it!

 

Holly

Edited February 16, 2016 by OakIris

[Jamerelbe]

I bought several Kawecos a couple of years ago, when they changed distributors in Australia (the prices doubled overnight with most suppliers, but I managed to find someone with a stockpile). I found that a few of them were a little drier than was desirable (for me), while others wrote just fine out of the box. In all cases, though, I found it was reasonably straightforward to get the flow going:

 

Remove nib and feed, wash and rinse thoroughly in soapy water, then again to get rid of the detergent;

 

Maybe give the feed channel a bit of a 'scraping' (I used the tip of a brass sheet, but the tip of a fine knife, drawn backwards along the channel so it doesn't dig in, would work to), then reassemble;

 

If ink flow is still a little sub-par, work on widening the opening between the tines.

 

In my experience, EF nibs and B nibs are more problematic; the M nibs seem to write OK straight out of the box in most instances. That said, I really like my EF nibs, so I was happy to work on them to get the flow right!

[OakIris]

I bought several Kawecos a couple of years ago, when they changed distributors in Australia (the prices doubled overnight with most suppliers, but I managed to find someone with a stockpile). I found that a few of them were a little drier than was desirable (for me), while others wrote just fine out of the box. In all cases, though, I found it was reasonably straightforward to get the flow going:

 

Remove nib and feed, wash and rinse thoroughly in soapy water, then again to get rid of the detergent;

 

Maybe give the feed channel a bit of a 'scraping' (I used the tip of a brass sheet, but the tip of a fine knife, drawn backwards along the channel so it doesn't dig in, would work to), then reassemble;

 

If ink flow is still a little sub-par, work on widening the opening between the tines.

 

In my experience, EF nibs and B nibs are more problematic; the M nibs seem to write OK straight out of the box in most instances. That said, I really like my EF nibs, so I was happy to work on them to get the flow right!

Very nice that you got your pens at a good price and that you were able to fix any flow problems so easily, Jamerelbe. Your explanation of how to improve the flow is very helpful. I knew you weren't supposed to take a knife to the feed, but I admit I was imagining something a bit more invasive. I am going to read up a bit on how to fix baby bottom problems to see what needs to be done should I get a broad or double broad nib.

 

I have heard very positive things about Kaweco pens in general - great build quality, good materials used, and definitely a long and respected history of making quality pens. And there are many, many happy current owners. So, I think I am fretting about something before it is a problem, so I am going to stop. There is enough real stuff to worry about, right?!?

 

When I finally order the pen (pens) I will let you know what nibs I finally decide upon. Thank you all for your responses; always good to get feedback from the community.

 

Holly

[Barkingpig]

I bought my first Kaweco Sport almost two years ago with the BB steel nib & enjoyed it so much I added five others with the same nib & have found them to be quite satisfactory. I admit they are NOT gushers like my Omas BUT they have all been "good starters no matter how long since use." This year I treated myself to the gold nib after receiving an unexpected Birthday discount from Fontoplumo. (Yes, I realise it was a sales enticement BUT still a pleasant one!) Between the deletion of VAT, discount & his shipping (more reasonable than any US retailer) it was more affordable than I expected. I also purchased this gold nib in a BB & it is equally pleasant for flow besides being a "true" BB compared to the steel ones I had experienced.

 

Perhaps I have "been lucky" BUT with six pens in the same model, each purchased @ different times & from different retailers I think you also might be spared disappointment. I sincerely hope this is the case. Enjoy whatever you decide upon.

[OakIris]

I bought my first Kaweco Sport almost two years ago with the BB steel nib & enjoyed it so much I added five others with the same nib & have found them to be quite satisfactory. I admit they are NOT gushers like my Omas BUT they have all been "good starters no matter how long since use." This year I treated myself to the gold nib after receiving an unexpected Birthday discount from Fontoplumo. (Yes, I realise it was a sales enticement BUT still a pleasant one!) Between the deletion of VAT, discount & his shipping (more reasonable than any US retailer) it was more affordable than I expected. I also purchased this gold nib in a BB & it is equally pleasant for flow besides being a "true" BB compared to the steel ones I had experienced.

 

Perhaps I have "been lucky" BUT with six pens in the same model, each purchased @ different times & from different retailers I think you also might be spared disappointment. I sincerely hope this is the case. Enjoy whatever you decide upon.

More encouragement! (Or, given the site we are on, more enabling!)

 

You have had some experience with various of the steel nibs; do you think the gold nib is worth the price premium? I realize you got yours at a discount - that must have been very nice indeed - but current pricing (looking at Fontoplumo's prices) shows that the gold nib is slightly more than $100 than a replacement steel nib. I know it is hard to put a price on how nice it is to write with a good fountain pen, but is there really that much improvement in performance?

 

Holly

[Barkingpig]

More encouragement! (Or, given the site we are on, more enabling!)

 

You have had some experience with various of the steel nibs; do you think the gold nib is worth the price premium? I realize you got yours at a discount - that must have been very nice indeed - but current pricing (looking at Fontoplumo's prices) shows that the gold nib is slightly more than $100 than a replacement steel nib. I know it is hard to put a price on how nice it is to write with a good fountain pen, but is there really that much improvement in performance?

 

Holly

I wouldn't say the gold nib is $102.00 (Total cost I paid including the shipping) better than a steel nib but as I had first purchased the plastic Sport (3 times, one is a dark brown exclusive to CULT PENS), then moved to the raw aluminum, brass & finally an ART sport, I really didn't want any MORE Kaweco Sports. I just wanted to try the gold nib & since I had six pens I could switch it between, I felt the expense was justified.

BUT I used the steel nibs for almost two years before I felt like purchasing the gold one. Since you cannot buy a Sport WITHOUT a nib, I would think you can easily give the steel one a try for awhile & always replace it if you aren't happy. I really like the pens; they are scattered about my house & always "ready to write when called upon."

[erpe]

My small collection of KaWeCo's consists of classic sport, AL-sport, Student, All-rounder and Dia2 and they all have the same Bock nibs. Only difference is that the classic sport uses a slightly different nib/feed/collar assembly so it can not be exchanged with the others. For the rest, they are all swapable. In my experience, the nibs are indeed a bit dry but that has an advantage (for me that is): combined with a somewhat dryer ink like R&K or Pelikan, they work on almost any paper without feathering or bleeding, even in the dreaded Moleskines. Another thing I noticed is that the gold plated nibs are a bit softer writers than the chrome steel nibs.I have no technical explanation for this, it's just the feeling.
The assemblies are remarkably friendly in price, about € 10 a piece for the steels, so if a nib wouldn't perform adequately, I would just replace it in stead of trying to fix it. So far however, I had no need to do so.
Bottom line, I always carry the classic in my pocket with a Pelikan blueblack cartridge.

[OakIris]

Your journey to the Kaweco gold nib sounds like the right way to go, Barkingpig. I will try my luck with the steel nibs - and one of the gold plated steel nibs - first. Need to make sure I enjoy writing with the pen, after all, before I think of "decking it out in finery!"

 

Sounds as if you are a happy Kaweco pen owner, too, erpe, and I can see why a dry writer would be an advantage for you. I don't have a need for a dry writer, don't like the feel of a pen's nib dragging across the paper because there is too little lubrication (exaggeration, but you know what I mean) so I will need to adjust the flow should I get such a nib.

 

I don't know how many Kaweco's might be in my future, but I really hope that I will be able to get one of Kaweco's vintage piston-filling pens at some point; supposed to have lovely gold nibs on them, too.

 

Holly

[erpe]

I don't know how many Kaweco's might be in my future, but I really hope that I will be able to get one of Kaweco's vintage piston-filling pens at some point; supposed to have lovely gold nibs on them, too.

 

I am indeed a happy KaWeCo user ;-) There have been rumors for quite some time about the resurrection of a piston filed Sport. If you have Facebook, follow them there. They are pretty active with news.I would really like a piston filled Dia 3 ;-)

I own two V1 piston fillers from the late 50's. They have nice gold nibs but not as springy as one might expect for gold. There are good offers on the German E-bay sometimes.

Edited February 17, 2016 by erpe

[OakIris]

 

I am indeed a happy KaWeCo user ;-) There have been rumors for quite some time about the resurrection of a piston filed Sport. If you have Facebook, follow them there. They are pretty active with news.I would really like a piston filled Dia 3 ;-)

I own two V1 piston fillers from the late 50's. They have nice gold nibs but not as springy as one might expect for gold. There are good offers on the German E-bay sometimes.

 

I had read about the possibility that a modern piston filling Sport would be developed. There was an interview of Michael Gutberlet several years ago (2012, Jet Pens: http://www.jetpens.com/blog/exclusive-interview-michael-gutberlet-of-kaweco/pt/90#c3756289657529752121) where he mentioned that he would like to design the sport with a piston filler again. That was four years ago and haven't heard anything about it since. (Perhaps there is hope, though. In this same interview, the interviewer asked if a converter for the Sport would ever be produced; Michael's response - which included his comment about a piston filling Sport - was that they hadn't yet figured out how to design one, but since then they have indeed designed and produced one. I bought one a year or so ago - wanted it for another small pen; it didn't fit but I still have the converter. So, maybe there is still hope for a piston-filling Sport, though I have a feeling it might be a bit pricey.

 

So YOU have my vintage Kaweco's! lol - someday maybe I will have one. I do check German eBay from time to time; once I decide it is time to get a vintage Kaweco, I will get more serious about looking for it.

 

Holly

[cleosmama]

I have several Kaweco Sport and Art pens (Music, Black, Amethyst, Royal, Metallic Purple). Only one wrote well out of the box, but it may be my choice of nibs, which is F or EF. The one that wrote well had a M nib.

Edited February 17, 2016 by cleosmama

[OakIris]

I have several Kaweco Sport and Art pens (Music, Black, Amethyst, Royal, Metallic Purple). Only one wrote well out of the box, but it may be my choice of nibs, which is F or EF. The one that wrote well had a M nib.

Still, despite all the nib problems, you couldn't resist buying another Kaweco so that says something about the quality of the pens and the quality of the writing experience - once you fixed the problems - so that is very encouraging. I hope to find out about the Kaweco "magic" for myself in a month or so.

 

Holly

[dk76]

I got two Sports as my first pens.

 

Pen 1: Grey, fine steel nib.

This pen had flow issues. It drove me nuts. Hard starting all the time. The occasional skip. But the hard starting. I flushed it, scrubbed it, but I didn't floss the tines. This thing was too dry a writer to my liking. I then followed SBRE Brown's video where I pushed the nib against my nail a few times. And now it's a wet writer. This thing is now a Medium, if not a Broad writer. When I get around to it, I may look at getting a replacement nib (they're fairly inexpensive).

 

Pen 2: Black, fine steel nib.

This one worked better. Still a little dry. A little tweak, much less effort than pen 1.

 

Overall, I'm ok with these pens. I've branched off to other brands. And so far, the other pens have required less effort to get to my liking. I would still recommend the Sport's given their price point and compact size.

[Jamerelbe]

My current collection, from top to bottom:

 

Black AL-Sport (with 1.1mm calligraphy nib, swapped in for the original B nib)

Blue Classic Sport (with EF nib, swapped in for original M)

White Classic Sport (with M nib - was a ballpoint pen, but calligraphy nib came with white grip section)

Clear Classic Sport (with EF nib, swapped in for original F)

 

 

I also had a blue-and-clear ICE Sport - but lost it soon after I bought it

 

Much as I like these pens, I usually only have one or two inked up at a time - right now it's the AL-Sport (Noodler's Blue Steel).

[sakayume]

I'm glad to hear other people have had good experiences with their Kawecos and that the nibs in the middle of the spectrum are less problematic, because I have a Mint Skyline with a Broad nib that hasn't been a pleasant experience. I bought an italic nib at the same time, and both nibs had hard starting issues and are generally rather dry. I dislike dry pens but worse, the ink flow is poor and the broad nib tends to run dryer as I write (I haven't used the italic nib since), regardless of whether I use the converter or a cartridge. I tried the methods mentioned for increasing flow, but perhaps I didn't do it correctly. I bought one after reading glowing reviews on the internet, but mine has been a disappointment. It's a pity as I think Kaweco has attractive products and I really liked the Lilliput.

 

I also have a piston filler Sport, a 12 from the 1950s, but I don't get on with the oblique nib at all. It's also a very firm nib, not at all like the soft, springy/flexy nibs that seem to get mentioned a lot when the subject of German pens from the '50s comes up.

[Jamerelbe]

I'm glad to hear other people have had good experiences with their Kawecos and that the nibs in the middle of the spectrum are less problematic, because I have a Mint Skyline with a Broad nib that hasn't been a pleasant experience. I bought an italic nib at the same time, and both nibs had hard starting issues and are generally rather dry. I dislike dry pens but worse, the ink flow is poor and the broad nib tends to run dryer as I write (I haven't used the italic nib since), regardless of whether I use the converter or a cartridge. I tried the methods mentioned for increasing flow, but perhaps I didn't do it correctly. I bought one after reading glowing reviews on the internet, but mine has been a disappointment. It's a pity as I think Kaweco has attractive products and I really liked the Lilliput.

 

I also have a piston filler Sport, a 12 from the 1950s, but I don't get on with the oblique nib at all. It's also a very firm nib, not at all like the soft, springy/flexy nibs that seem to get mentioned a lot when the subject of German pens from the '50s comes up.

 

My AL-Sport came with a B nib installed, but (like your Skyline, I suspect?) it didn't write like a Broad - in fact, it was little different from the M and even the F nibs I had on other (Classic) Sport pens. Big chunk nib tip - such a disappointment I couldn't get it to lay a nice juicy line. Thankfully, the italic (1.1mm) nib I bought from JetPens was a lot wetter - I think I may have swapped the feed in as well?

[sakayume]

Yup, my Skyline writes a line as wide as my Pel M400 F (which is very wet). My italic nib was also a dry writer. I've thought of getting another nib (probably an M, after reading the comments here), but two poor nibs in a row doesn't exactly inspire confidence. At least the nib units are relatively inexpensive.