Overpriced

[prf5]

Opps, I think I'm in the wrong place. I may want that $1,500 MB, or the $3000 Montegrappa, but my Social Security check tells me "No." This is a case of the "cans & can nots", the "have and have nots". In my short time as a FP enthusiast, I have discovered we purchase pens for many, many diverse reasons. For some, even if the pen is not "really" worth what they are asking, that is not the point. "I can, I will and I've earned it'". In the world we live, an extravagant pen says "I am" and represents our perceived "worth", just as much as a Gucci, Hermes or Prada bag. Though finances limit what I can do, I want the best pen for my budget ($50-$250/grail pen). The most expensive pen in my very limited collection cost me $125+. When I pull it out of my purse, someone will want to "look" at it. Usually they remark about it being a costly item, and wonder why would I spend so much money on just a "pen." This is where each of us has our reasons for our purchases, and sometimes the reasons go beyond loyalty, customer service, company history, habits, preference, etc, etc, etc. I often wonder do we really know our "deep emotional needs" and why we are willing to spend inordinate amounts of money on our beautiful, breathtaking, functional or eye catching FPs.

 

I think you are in the right place, Helen. Oftentimes, we discover our desires and interests in the course of acquiring, having, and using. There is no exhaustive list of the reasons that people overpay. The key is that we do, sometimes for very expensive items, pens included. We also overpay for less expensive items. I've found it a bit strange that some folks here are so reluctant to admit that they have overpaid for their fountain pens and the reasons they have done it.

[Cryptos]

Actually, blade runner, I was condensing what I thought the preceding post was saying. I didn't think it needed to be qualified.

Edited October 20, 2014 by Cryptos

[Blade Runner]

 

 

I wonder if you agree with these points as well:

1) What Cryptos said is right if his statement is qualified: Sometimes, people overpay to say, in effect, that they are better than someone else or a member of select group because of their collection of XYZ pens.

Of course, as I stated, there are people who have petty motives., but there are many who have wholesome reasons.

2) There are examples of what Cryptos calls one-upmanship on this thread.

Haven't read the whole thread, but as others have mentioned, there are many more instances of people with anti-snobbery hubris comments/threads than snobbery ones in this forum.

3) Some of the talk about 'reverse snobbery' or the like on this thread has been what you call dogmatic,

Yes, I stand by dogmatic statements against anti-snobbery hubris, a form of snobbery, just as I will make dogmatic statements against intolerance in general.

Edited October 20, 2014 by Blade Runner

[de_pen_dent]

 

For three guys on this thread, what drives their claims about the pens they own (or want us to believe they own) is the hope that the other two will say, I like you, you're just like me. They are overpaying for friendship and approval, just as others overpay for status and credibility. Overpaying can be rational; it usually is. Overpaying for convenience or curiosity is rational. it would also be rational if they are lying about the pens they say they own.

 

Wow, you are able to decipher the motives of others based on what pens they use?

 

Someone else is buying an expensive pen/car/suit to impress the world at large? I personally dont care. I am secure enough in my own skin to not give a rat's rear one way or the other. For all the protestations to the contrary, some people here really seem a little too involved in other people's motives, especially over something as irrelevant as a pen and over a dollar amount that is relatively minor, in the grand scheme of things.

 

My general suggestion to everyone who doesnt like MB or Zegna or Ferragamo or whatever: focus on enjoying what you like and not so much on making up and dissecting theories about what drivers others. It sounds like a depressingly miserable life where one needs to knock down the motives of others in order to feel better about one's own beliefs.

 

Off this line of argument, until something something different and better-thought-out comes along.

[de_pen_dent]

 

I've found it a bit strange that some folks here are so reluctant to admit that they have overpaid for their fountain pens and the reasons they have done it.

 

Nice strawman. Farmboy, doesnt this seem to come from the Losers Debating Manual?

 

Strangely enough, I dont care one bit about how much you have spent on your pens or whether you think you have overpaid or not. However, since it seems a confession would make you feel better, here goes (not pen related but i hope it helps):

 

I overspent on my race bicycle (an S-Works Shiv with Di2, if you care). I blew $9,000 on it earlier this year in order to gain about 0.5 seconds per kilometer, and have only raced it twice this year, for a total of about 50 miles. I am going to spend another $4000 on new wheels (Lightweights) and $600 on 2 tires and a spare (FMBs) for it this December, when they go on sale and they will save me some fractions of a second that I probably cant even measure.

 

I hope you feel better or more validated now.

Edited October 20, 2014 by de_pen_dent

[prf5]

 

 

 

I wonder if you agree with these points as well:

1) What Cryptos said is right if his statement is qualified: Sometimes, people overpay to say, in effect, that they are better than someone else or a member of select group because of their collection of XYZ pens.

Of course, as I stated, there are people who have petty motives., but there are many who don't.

2) There are examples of what Cryptos calls one-upmanship on this thread.

Haven't read the whole thread, but as others have mentioned, there are many more instances of people with anti-snobbery hubris comments/threads than snobbery ones in this forum.

3) Some of the talk about 'reverse snobbery' or the like on this thread has been what you call dogmatic,

Yes, I stand by dogmatic statements against anti-snobbery hubris, a form of snobbery, just as I will make dogmatic statements against intolerance in general.

 

 

Your intentions may be good, but you are either playing the fool or all tied up in knots -- tolerance against intolerance that's intolerant to intolerance, or vice-versa; your dogma against their dogma against yours against theirs. On and on. Gertrude Stein said it well in speaking about her hometown of Oakland: there's no there there. In your case, a lot of words are thrown about, but they fold back on themselves and not much gets said.

[Blade Runner]

 

I've found it a bit strange that some folks here are so reluctant to admit that they have overpaid for their fountain pens and the reasons they have done it.

I recommend removing "over" in over pay when it comes to talking about anyone but yourself. My reason for buying pens is because I like pens.

 

 

 

Your intentions may be good, but you are either playing the fool or all tied up in knots -- tolerance against intolerance that's intolerant to intolerance, or vice-versa; your dogma against their dogma against yours against theirs. On and on. Gertrude Stein said it well in speaking about her hometown of Oakland: there's no there there. In your case, a lot of words are thrown about, but they fold back on themselves and not much gets said.

I have no idea what you are trying to say.

Edited October 20, 2014 by Blade Runner

[kazoolaw]

 

 

 

I overspent on my race bicycle (an S-Works Shiv with Di2, if you care). I blew $9,000 on it earlier this year in order to gain about 0.5 seconds per kilometer, and have only raced it twice this year, for a total of about 50 miles. I am going to spend another $4000 on new wheels (Lightweights) and $600 on 2 tires and a spare (FMBs) for it this December, when they go on sale and they will save me some fractions of a second that I probably cant even measure.

 

 

 

Not to pry, but wouldn't Lance Armstrong autographed drugs have been cheaper?

 

gary

[lsmith42]

My latest favorite:

 

"I drive a MINI... what are YOU compensating for?"

[FarmBoy]

My latest favorite:

 

"I drive a MINI... what are YOU compensating for?"

I drive a Scion...you overpaid.

[FarmBoy]

 

Nice strawman. Farmboy, doesnt this seem to come from the Losers Debating Manual?

 

There is an entire chapter....

[lsmith42]

I drive a Scion...you overpaid.

Indeed... I wanted to impress people on FPN with my extravagance... thus, apparently, subjecting my decision to the scrutiny of FPN.

[Blade Runner]

 

 

 

some people here really seem a little too involved in other people's motives, especially over something as irrelevant as a pen and over a dollar amount that is relatively minor, in the grand scheme of things.

 

My general suggestion to everyone who doesnt like MB or Zegna or Ferragamo or whatever: focus on enjoying what you like and not so much on making up and dissecting theories about what drivers others. It sounds like a depressingly miserable life where one needs to knock down the motives of others in order to feel better about one's own beliefs.

 

 

Agree. Folks who are in a good place (and that is not dependent on the amount in your savings), aren't critical or concerned over other people's choices, say they overpaid, bought largely to impress.

Edited October 20, 2014 by Blade Runner

[bleair]

I'd venture that most people coming to this board are doing it on their own free time, or at least not as their day job - as in they come here because they enjoy or are interested in fountain pens. Among the styles of discourse that come up on the interwebs you'll sometimes see this - where someone wants to nudge other people to get them to notice the humor in just how deep we've gone down into minutia of what is being debated Some other people even like to taunt to try a get a rise out of other people.

btw, What's a scion? Is it a piston filler? Does it come with a Bock nib, or do they make their own? :)

 

I drive a Scion...you overpaid.

 

 

<tongue firmly in cheek>

You like chocolate ice cream/gelato/sherbet/parfait/vegan-soy-blended-frozen-dessert?!?!? Obviously no one has ever told you this, so allow me to help you here on the Interwebs. Everyone knows vanilla ice cream is superior to all others. If you ever bought chocolate you overpaid / did it to impress someone / are insecure about your ice cream feelings / bought it because of peer pressure.

</tongue>

 

On the interwebs it appears some people want validation that the X they've chosen is better / cheaper / cooler stronger than what other people choose. They can use any and all sorts of criteria to make their argument. The worst examples of this type of rancor come up when people talk about video game consoles or politics - as in "ra ra, my team / dad can beat up your team / dad.".

 

Those debates are about as useful and effective in convincing people as the ice cream "debate".

 

If you think Montblanc, Wearever, Noodlers, Twsbi, or any other high-end/ or low-end pen maker holds no appeal and you want to convince everyone else of the poor value and questionable judgement of anyone who would chose to buy pen X you're going to have as much success as convincing someone their favorite ice cream (or car) is wrong.

 

Irony = this is a forum is made up of people who enjoy and see the merit / and "value" of fountain pens. Meanwhile nearly every gel and disposable pen out there is cheaper than any fountain pen you can buy. This and the related threads are just too funny.

Edited October 21, 2014 by bleair

[lsmith42]

We aim to please... However we refuse to "please hold still" while the scrutineers aim...

[FarmBoy]

We aim to please... However we refuse to "please hold still" while the scrutineers aim...

I have one sign in the toilet. It hangs directly above the Ferguson. Written upon it is:

 

We aim to please,

You aim too, please.

 

Unfortunately 6 year old boys can't read so well and of course, I get blamed. So as of now, I have overpaid for that sign.

[flipper_gv]

On the current subject:
People like shiny things, and they like to show off their shiny things. There is nothing wrong with this. If it's a strong enough incentive for someone to buy pens and they can pay the price without gaining financial risk, I don't see an issue with that, at all. Problem is (and this is true for all hobbies) when people start judging you because they think it's useless to pay for a boutique pen (1k range for example) when you get an extremely similar feeling pen for 400$. And they start saying how dumb you are for thinking it was worth the 1k price tag. It's just like on talkbass when people argue if a 10 000$ Fodera bass is worth it or not when you can have a really good quality US Fender for 1000$ that will do the job for any gig.

On the original subject:
If the price is about how much rare metal is used on something else than the nib and/or the amount of gems on it, that is what I consider overpriced. That is, because you pay for something else than the writing experience. I do appreciate nice visual design, I'm just not interested in a full gold body for example.

[prf5]

de_pen_dent, on 20 Oct 2014 - 14:15, said:

some people here really seem a little too involved in other people's motives, especially over something as irrelevant as a pen and over a dollar amount that is relatively minor, in the grand scheme of things.

Agree. Folks who are in a good place (and that is not dependent on the amount in your savings), aren't critical or concerned over other people's choices, say they overpaid, bought largely to impress.

some people here really seem a little too involved in other people's motives, especially over something as irrelevant as a pen and over a dollar amount that is relatively minor, in the grand scheme of things.

 

 

Let's pass these children a tissue.

[Blade Runner]

 

 

Let's pass these children a tissue.

 

Name calling? I suggest you read the Montblanc forum rules. https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/forum-69/announcement-9-montblanc-forum-rules/

They generally apply to FPN.

Edited October 21, 2014 by Blade Runner

[Redbarchettayyz]

People who like different pens than the ones I like have suspicious motives and are of dubious character.

 

Or is it the other way around? I can never remember.