Inks That Flow Well In Pilot Pens

[arcadeflow]

I was wondering if your Pilot fans out there could share some ink knowledge with me. I am kind of a Pilot guy now, since I ordered 3 more 78G's and I am thinking about getting a Custom Heritage 91. I have been using them with some Pilot black cartridges and the flow was nice, but now I am kind of suspecting that my Sheaffer Skrip flow a bit drier in them. I am wondering if anybody notice something like that with Sheaffer Skrip. Also I am curious about which inks you would consider to flow very well in Pilots. I am more concerned about the 78G style nibs, like the ones in Preras, Metropolitans, Plumix, Penmanship, etc. In my country, Sheaffer Skrip is the cheapest I can find, the price is less than the $9 it usually cost in the US. I can also find Parker Quink, Cross, Pilot non-Iroshizuku (blue is even available in a 500cc bottle!), Pelikan 4001, Pelikan Edelstein (horribly expensive, about $45 a bottle), sometimes Koh-I-Noor (I don't know anything about this brand), Lamy and the local Compactor brand (their fountain pens are rebranded German Schneider ones). Other brands usually have to be imported or bought from people that resell what they import themselves. I myself will eventually import some Iroshizuku to match the first "luxury" pen that I am going to buy, but until then I wanted to pick up some basic black, blue and blue-black that flow nicely in those 78G style nibs.

 

So, question is, which brands do you believe that flow really well on Pilot pens? I am thinking about a fine Prera and some medium 78g's. Is there a brand you tried and you believe it made your pen dry or skip? Recommendations of regular inks and fancy inks would both be nice, so I can find some that I can buy locally and import the others when I can. I am also curious if anybody has a positive or negative experience with Sheaffer Skrip. I believe both Brown and Turquoise did not flow as good as Pilot black. I also had a problem with Diamine Crimson on the Prera, it dried out on the feed, but it could be because I stored it inked for a couple months. Thank you.

Edited August 20, 2014 by arcadeflow

[rutherfordr]

The Pilot blue ink is perfect for a regular everyday writing ink.

[arcadeflow]

The Pilot blue ink is perfect for a regular everyday writing ink.

 

Thanks for the recommendation. I was thinking about buying a 30cc bottle of this ink because I found it for a great price at a small stationery shop, but I am receiving 6 cartridges of it along with a new 78G so I decided to wait and try the cartridges before, but I believe any Pilot ink will work great since my pens are not faulty. But I am also curious if there is another ink brand that will work "better" on those pens.

[77kath]

I've never found them to be picky. One of mine is doing fine with Sailor Jentle Miruai.

[KBeezie]

The Pilot blue ink is perfect for a regular everyday writing ink.

 

The pilot blue cartridge I had with my Pilot Metropolitan and Fine nib kept clogging up and being a hard starter, it was kind of a pain to use as it didn't take long to dry up. (Also Pilot Blue always had a strong, almost like cleaning fluid type of smell to it whenever I uncapped it, similar to the smell of Pilot black but much stronger)

 

Pilot Black however, starts right up and good flow.

 

In my Metropolitans ones that seemed to flow well were :

Pilot Black

Iroshizuku Tsuki-yo

Waterman Intense Black

Iroshizuku Tsutuji

 

I haven't tried much else in my Metropolitans (F and M nib) aside from those, but I know the ones that did not flow well for me in either pens were:

Diamine Syrah (great flow once started, but dries quickly in the nib)

Diamine Saddle Brown

Diamine Imperial Blue (ok-ish, prone to drying but not as bad as the others)

Pilot Blue (of the ones I've tried, probably the worst).

 

Also in my Petit1 which I've exclusively used Pilot Blue-Black in, the flow is very good and never has a problem being a hard starter, but I don't know if that's specifically because of the pen or what.

 

In my Pilot Falcon with a Soft Fine, I've tried:

- Noodler's Texas Blue Steel, good flow and wetness, but probably bordered a little bit on 'too wet' as was prone to bleeding on flex.

- R&K Salix (Iron Gall), in my attempt to find a dryer ink, it worked, didn't dry up but did railroad a little on me, and not crazy about puting Iron Gall in one of my my expensive pens in the long run.

- Iroshizuku Tsuki-yo, very well behaved, not too wet, tiny bit of railroading, wasn't quite as wet as blue steel

- Noodler's Apache Sunset, very good flow, however it's like writing on plastic sometimes, the ink doesn't immediately absorb to the paper (especially Rhodia), as such stroking down on a line causes a shorter line because most of the ink flows towards the bottom and doesn't leave a mark where the stroke started. So it's a little annoying with Apache Sunset depending on how smooth or absorbent the paper is.

- Pilot Blue, unlike the Metropolitan with the Fine Nib, Pilot blue was very wet and good flow in the Falcon's soft fine, however it was a bit too wet as it took forever to dry completely.

 

In my Pilot Elite Mini from 70s with a 18K Soft Fine Nib:

- Noodler's Blue-Black, VERY VERY VERY Wet, took forever to dry even on absorbent paper, flow was excellent of course, but you didn't want to try to flex anything or you'd get immediate bleed/feathering.

- Noodler's Liberty's Elysium : the ideal ink I've found for this particular pen, flow is great, starts up every time, dries pretty quickly even on Rhodia and doesn't railroad on flex.

 

In my Pilot Elite "Big Cap" (the korean made version with a steel extra-fine nib from the 70s):

- Noodler's Black Eel , initially flow was good, but started being a hard starter after about a week of being inked and required a bit of cleaning.

- Akkerman Laan Van Nieuw Oost-Indigo : very good flow, starts right up, goes down wet enough to be visible but dry enough that it dries pretty quickly.

* I haven't tried very many inks in this one until I sold it after getting the Elite Mini.

 

I've also had nearly identical results as the Big Cap above in my Platinum PTL-5000 with a 14K EF Nib, which is now currently inked with Iroshizuku Tsutsuji which flows very nicely, and would have to go without usage for a good while (3-4 weeks) before it's a hard starter. Though I'm considering deinking that one as I haven't been using it that much.

 

The only other similar Japanese pen I have is the Platinum Century 3776 with a Soft Fine.

- Akkerman #5 Shocking Blue, I don't think I've ever had a hard starting problem with this one, flow is decent, not too wet

- Noodler's Texas Pecan decent once the flow is started, but doesn't take to dry up. Also while it's dry running, it takes a tiny bit longer to dry completely on the page.

- Noodler's Texas Live Oak very good flow, very wet. The odd thing about this combination is that it goes down wet (prone to bleeding/feathering at the start and end of stroke) but dries almost instantly that you can't smear it even on rhodia after just 1 or 2 seconds. The problem is, like Pecan it does eventually dry to be a hard starter, but not nearly as bad. (a write sample of that on Rhodia and Mead 5-star) It would be great if it *always* started right up, because it's one of the few inks I have that goes down wet, and is completely waterproof.

- Noodler's Texas Blue Steel, the current ink in this pen, not too wet, decent flow, has just the right amount of flow to keep the writing smooth and dries in a decent amount of time on paper.

Edited August 20, 2014 by KBeezie

[arcadeflow]

 

The pilot blue cartridge I had with my Pilot Metropolitan and Fine nib kept clogging up and being a hard starter, it was kind of a pain to use as it didn't take long to dry up. (Also Pilot Blue always had a strong, almost like cleaning fluid type of smell to it whenever I uncapped it, similar to the smell of Pilot black but much stronger)

 

Pilot Black however, starts right up and good flow.

 

In my Metropolitans ones that seemed to flow well were :

Pilot Black

Iroshizuku Tsuki-yo

Waterman Intense Black

Iroshizuku Tsutuji

 

I haven't tried much else in my Metropolitans (F and M nib) aside from those, but I know the ones that did not flow well for me in either pens were:

Diamine Syrah (great flow once started, but dries quickly in the nib)

Diamine Saddle Brown

Diamine Imperial Blue (ok-ish, prone to drying but not as bad as the others)

Pilot Blue (of the ones I've tried, probably the worst).

 

Also in my Petit1 which I've exclusively used Pilot Blue-Black in, the flow is very good and never has a problem being a hard starter, but I don't know if that's specifically because of the pen or what.

 

In my Pilot Falcon with a Soft Fine, I've tried:

- Noodler's Texas Blue Steel, good flow and wetness, but probably bordered a little bit on 'too wet' as was prone to bleeding on flex.

- R&K Salix (Iron Gall), in my attempt to find a dryer ink, it worked, didn't dry up but did railroad a little on me, and not crazy about puting Iron Gall in one of my my expensive pens in the long run.

- Iroshizuku Tsuki-yo, very well behaved, not too wet, tiny bit of railroading, wasn't quite as wet as blue steel

- Noodler's Apache Sunset, very good flow, however it's like writing on plastic sometimes, the ink doesn't immediately absorb to the paper (especially Rhodia), as such stroking down on a line causes a shorter line because most of the ink flows towards the bottom and doesn't leave a mark where the stroke started. So it's a little annoying with Apache Sunset depending on how smooth or absorbent the paper is.

- Pilot Blue, unlike the Metropolitan with the Fine Nib, Pilot blue was very wet and good flow in the Falcon's soft fine, however it was a bit too wet as it took forever to dry completely.

 

In my Pilot Elite Mini from 70s with a 18K Soft Fine Nib:

- Noodler's Blue-Black, VERY VERY VERY Wet, took forever to dry even on absorbent paper, flow was excellent of course, but you didn't want to try to flex anything or you'd get immediate bleed/feathering.

- Noodler's Liberty's Elysium : the ideal ink I've found for this particular pen, flow is great, starts up every time, dries pretty quickly even on Rhodia and doesn't railroad on flex.

 

In my Pilot Elite "Big Cap" (the korean made version with a steel extra-fine nib from the 70s):

- Noodler's Black Eel , initially flow was good, but started being a hard starter after about a week of being inked and required a bit of cleaning.

- Akkerman Laan Van Nieuw Oost-Indigo : very good flow, starts right up, goes down wet enough to be visible but dry enough that it dries pretty quickly.

* I haven't tried very many inks in this one until I sold it after getting the Elite Mini.

 

I've also had nearly identical results as the Big Cap above in my Platinum PTL-5000 with a 14K EF Nib, which is now currently inked with Iroshizuku Tsutsuji which flows very nicely, and would have to go without usage for a good while (3-4 weeks) before it's a hard starter. Though I'm considering deinking that one as I haven't been using it that much.

 

The only other similar Japanese pen I have is the Platinum Century 3776 with a Soft Fine.

- Akkerman #5 Shocking Blue, I don't think I've ever had a hard starting problem with this one, flow is decent, not too wet

- Noodler's Texas Pecan decent once the flow is started, but doesn't take to dry up. Also while it's dry running, it takes a tiny bit longer to dry completely on the page.

- Noodler's Texas Live Oak very good flow, very wet. The odd thing about this combination is that it goes down wet (prone to bleeding/feathering at the start and end of stroke) but dries almost instantly that you can't smear it even on rhodia after just 1 or 2 seconds. The problem is, like Pecan it does eventually dry to be a hard starter, but not nearly as bad. (a write sample of that on Rhodia and Mead 5-star) It would be great if it *always* started right up, because it's one of the few inks I have that goes down wet, and is completely waterproof.

- Noodler's Texas Blue Steel, the current ink in this pen, not too wet, decent flow, has just the right amount of flow to keep the writing smooth and dries in a decent amount of time on paper.

 

Thanks for the extensive contribution. Most inks on this list are hard for me to get, but I plan on importing Tsuki-yo someday, and Pilot Black is not that hard for me to find locally, but I am kind of bored by it so I got Sheaffer Skrip black instead, it is a bigger bottle and was cheaper. I haven't tried it with these pens yet.

[Graebel]

I can't speak for any nib but the VP (I regularly use 3: XF, F, and 0.4mm CI)

 

Pilot Iroshizuku ink is great. I'm addicted to Take-sumi and Fuyu-gaki but they all seem well behaved, perfect really.

 

I also have used J. Herbin's Poussiere de Lune, Montblanc Oyster Grey, and Pelikan Topaz with great success.

 

Unhappy combos are anything Noodlers, anything Private Reserve, Rohrer & Klingner Alt-goldgrun (although it lives happily in my Twsibi), and Organic Studios (too dry for the fine nibs).

[arcadeflow]

I can't speak for any nib but the VP (I regularly use 3: XF, F, and 0.4mm CI)

 

Pilot Iroshizuku ink is great. I'm addicted to Take-sumi and Fuyu-gaki but they all seem well behaved, perfect really.

 

I also have used J. Herbin's Poussiere de Lune, Montblanc Oyster Grey, and Pelikan Topaz with great success.

 

Unhappy combos are anything Noodlers, anything Private Reserve, Rohrer & Klingner Alt-goldgrun (although it lives happily in my Twsibi), and Organic Studios (too dry for the fine nibs).

 

What was particularly bad about Noodler's in a VP? I see people prefer a lot of the more expensive brands, and I don't doubt that they can have great qualities like free flowing, but I also wonder why cheaper brands are not remembered more often. Maybe people are bored by them and don't want to waste time trying their flowing capabilities?

[dspeers58]

Iroshizuku inks, Pilot/Namiki Inks, Sailor inks are ok, but I just tried Yama Dori and it does not flow as well as Iroshizuku. Waterman inks.

[dothgrin]

J. Herbin Violette Pensee has been fantastic for me in my 78G and Metros.

Others I have enjoyed:

De Atramentis Giuseppe Blue and Jane Austen

Noodler's Air Corp

Diamine Ancient Copper

Diamine Delamere Green

Noodler's Navajo Turquoise have also been great for me.

I generally flush the original Pilot ink from the cartridges, as I do not like the feathering (The Iroshizuku inks are great, but better if one is using a medium and Italic nib).

[KBeezie]

 

What was particularly bad about Noodler's in a VP? I see people prefer a lot of the more expensive brands, and I don't doubt that they can have great qualities like free flowing, but I also wonder why cheaper brands are not remembered more often. Maybe people are bored by them and don't want to waste time trying their flowing capabilities?

 

I'm curious as to the answer as well, but I've seen some people simply blindly hating Noodler's (especially if they also mention Private Reserve) based on the blog entries of Greg Minuskin ( example : http://gregminuskin.com/?p=3383 ) who blames noodler's and private reserve alike for melted sacs, feeds and nibs and never specifies exactly which Noodler's or PR inks were the culprit or provides any additional information. Rather he just simply blasts them as being 100% bad and claims to refuse to repair any pens that were inked with either Noodler's or PR. (In regards to melted sacs, Nathan mentioned this was because a batch of latex sacs used by restoration experts was defective and more prone to being reactive to inks like Baystate blue, which is just a small percentage of all the inks offered by Noodler's)

 

The only commonality I can see especially with very fine nibs is that some of the Noodler's inks with Bulletproof properties can potentially cause flow problems when the sediments that give the ink bulletproof properties starts to settle and clog the feed and nib, which can be rinsed thru but can be annoying if you're having to get the flow going every so often. I've had that happen in a Platinum PTL-5000 and a Pilot (Korean) Elite "Big Cap" both of which are extra-fine nibs when I was using Black Eel, they'd flow at first but eventually they'd just be a little hard to start. Where as my Montblanc 225 with an inset nib has been using Noodler's Black Eel since I got it, and it has a finer nib than either of my Japanese pens with an EF, and the flow is just great, not too wet and doesn't clog.

 

But not every Noodler's offerings are the same, some can be incredibly dry or stubborn (such as Noodler's Kung Te-Cheng or Tchaikovsky) or extremely wet and prone to bleeding/feathering (Noodler's Bad Green Gator, etc) depending on the nib.

 

Here's a list of most of Noodler's inks and their properties: http://noodlersink.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/103012_noodlers-ink-properties.pdf

 

Likewise Private Reserve, Diamine, R&K, etc are going to have different types of inks, some more suited than others for specific pens. For example R&K Does have two Iron Gall inks (Salix and Scabiosa), but not all their inks are Iron Gall. Or some may be lubricated and act too wet or takes too long to dry.

 

One of those Mileage may vary, but I tend to take criticism with a grain of salt when they target the entire brand of inks.

Edited August 21, 2014 by KBeezie

[Blue_Moon]

I only use Iroshizuku ink in my Pilot pens.

[Sasha Royale]

to whatever they load into the Varsity.

[arcadeflow]

Iroshizuku inks, Pilot/Namiki Inks, Sailor inks are ok, but I just tried Yama Dori and it does not flow as well as Iroshizuku. Waterman inks.

 

I see a lot of people mentioning Waterman in threads about inks with great flow, I will see if I can grab one.

[Algester]

I use Iroshizuku on my CH91 but I would suggest if your going to top the ante and get a CH912 with falcon use Sailor Inks I'm not sure what they did but Sailor Inks fare better as flex inks or thats from what I have noticed with Tokiwa-Matsu, Souten, and Shigure

[Graebel]

 

What was particularly bad about Noodler's in a VP? I see people prefer a lot of the more expensive brands, and I don't doubt that they can have great qualities like free flowing, but I also wonder why cheaper brands are not remembered more often. Maybe people are bored by them and don't want to waste time trying their flowing capabilities?

 

I actually quite like Noodlers, just not in my fine nibs. It seems to run very wet for me and I have narrow writing. I load it in my generalists when they're in rotation (Twsibi, Sheaffer, Esterbrook). Organics has the opposite problem for me, its too dry in the XF but a great ink in my other pens.

 

No intention of bashing any ink. I think most ink problems are just finding the right pen to use them in.

[KBeezie]

No intention of bashing any ink. I think most ink problems are just finding the right pen to use them in.

 

I definitely find that to be true, there's a small sense of euphoria once you seem to have found the perfect match of nib + ink and paper, even if one of them may be 'cheap', if they work together seamlessly, it's bliss.

[arcadeflow]

Today I made an eyedropper out of a Pilot Petit1 (first eyedropper conversion I tried) and I used Sheaffer Skrip Turquoise. It is flowing pretty nicely, better than the Sheaffer Skrip Black I put in a refilled cartridge in another Petit1. But it could be because I washed a lot this one before I converted it to eyedropper, because in other Pilot pens, Turquoise didn't seem to flow any better than Black, both flow worse than Pilot Black. Probably the feeds in the Petit1's are more forgiving. I only used them with the original carts, one had Pilot Blue Black and the other some light orange ink exclusive to the Petit1 lineup. The Blue Black had nice flow, probably as good as Skrip Turquoise, but the orange one was pretty dry, too light, I really dislike the non Pilot standard colors found in the Petit1 pens, I've seen green in another Petit1 and it was too light and horrible too.

 

I read a bit about ink flow and lubrication, and I found out that water does not make an ink flow better, but the lubricating agent that is added to it. That means that feeds and nibs will take advantage of a preferred amount of this agent, and we can never know unless we try them in the pen, so, I believe it is useful to share information of which inks show better lubrication (and thus, flow) in each feed/nib.

[KBeezie]

Today I made an eyedropper out of a Pilot Petit1 (first eyedropper conversion I tried) and I used Sheaffer Skrip Turquoise. It is flowing pretty nicely, better than the Sheaffer Skrip Black I put in a refilled cartridge in another Petit1. But it could be because I washed a lot this one before I converted it to eyedropper, because in other Pilot pens, Turquoise didn't seem to flow any better than Black, both flow worse than Pilot Black. Probably the feeds in the Petit1's are more forgiving. I only used them with the original carts, one had Pilot Blue Black and the other some light orange ink exclusive to the Petit1 lineup. The Blue Black had nice flow, probably as good as Skrip Turquoise, but the orange one was pretty dry, too light, I really dislike the non Pilot standard colors found in the Petit1 pens, I've seen green in another Petit1 and it was too light and horrible too.

 

I read a bit about ink flow and lubrication, and I found out that water does not make an ink flow better, but the lubricating agent that is added to it. That means that feeds and nibs will take advantage of a preferred amount of this agent, and we can never know unless we try them in the pen, so, I believe it is useful to share information of which inks show better lubrication (and thus, flow) in each feed/nib.

 

I can't remember where she got it, but the sample of Private Reserve Spearmint I got a while back from Amberlea had a 'wetting' agent in it to improve the flow.

 

I checked my messages, she uses "Organics Studio Flo+".

 

I used Organics Studio Flo+ the new one. Others adore PhotoFlo. OS told me theirs would be pH neutral (BTW, it is not). I had a little problem with some of the VMail inks.

Anyway, despite everyone saying I should just dab in a toothpick's worth.... I added a lot. On a full TWSBI, I have a bout 1/6-1/5 filled with Flo+.

 

 

Whatever she did ratio wise with the sample she sent me worked very well.

Edited August 23, 2014 by KBeezie

[ajoffe]

Pilot Blue is currently my favorite blue. The color is rich and it behaves wonderfully.