Waterman And International Cartridges

[maxgroebel]

There seems to have been a great deal of rather confused, and confusing, discussion about Waterman vs international cartridges over the years. I hope that someone can clarify the situation.

As I understand it, Waterman first had some propriatory cartridges in the 60's which are not made any more. Then the Waterman pens were compatible with international cartridges for some time, at least the short (Pelikan) version.

Then, at some point, they came upon the old idea of making the barrel a tad narrower so that international cartridges could not be used on the Waterman pens, while their own cartridges could be used on other pens.

Is this correct? If so, when did it happen? Which are the Waterman pens that do not accept international cartridges? Was it only pens with brass barrel? (Don't think so having had trouble with translucent one, probably Phileas.) Or have have they made any (low end?) pens after that date, which still accept international cartridges?

Edited April 1, 2014 by maxgroebel

[maxgroebel]

Sorry, stupid typing error. It should be:

"so that international cartridges could not be used on the Waterman pens, while their own cartridges could be used on other pens"

[RMN]

You can use the "edit" button to change the text in your post, no need to make a new post for that.

 

I do not have all types of modern Watermans, but of the ones I have, most will accept the small international even riding piggyback.

 

Edson, Carene, Charleston (only just), Harley, l'Etalon. Ici-et-la only accepts short (not the Waterman long) and only the narrower versions, There is a difference in the base diameter in several brands. Herbin will only just fit in the Ici-et-la. My Expert 2 will accept a narrow cart, but no piggyback.

 

Other types may give problems, I can't check that.

 

DO note that the Waterman nipple is ALMOST but not quite the same as the international size. And the converters are different in the mouth. I just read someone has used a standard Schmidt K5 in a Kultur. Actually I have not tried as I am not that fond of converters.

 

 

Others may add info about the other Waterman type pens.

 

D.ick

[esteroids]

Usually where Waterman added the brass liner the narrower, proprietary cart/converter is needed. So Kultur (that translucent one) takes anything, Phileas takes Waterman. Some models are very close, such as the Charleston and Laureat, and will take some international converters but not others.

 

If you're using generic converters length can be an issue. Waterman is usually careful to build in a stop at the nether regions of the barrel, so that the converter doesn't have room to wiggle loose. A converter that is too long won't fit, one that is too short won't have that protection.

 

In any case, modern Waterman converters aren't much more costly than a Schmidt, and will work in any full size modern Waterman. You can keep both styles and use the proprietaries as needed. I wouldn't let converter style stop you from enjoying Waterman pens.

 

The models that take the harder to find converters are:

C/F and Directeur General (C/F or Lady type)

Lady series and Concord small size (Lady type - a bit shorter than C/F)

These accept many brands of international short carts - the ones with the narrower nipple end

 

A question for you all: I remember Schmidt making several other sizes - K-7, K-4, K-8, etc. I know one of those sizes was Waterman (K7 I think), but I haven't seen them in a while. I never bought any because they were the same price as Waterman.

Does anyone know if they are still available?

Edited April 1, 2014 by esteroids

[RMN]

Usually where Waterman added the brass liner the narrower, proprietary cart/converter is needed. So Kultur (that translucent one) takes anything, Phileas takes Waterman. Some models are very close, such as the Charleston and Laureat, and will take some international converters but not others.

 

If you're using generic converters length can be an issue. Waterman is usually careful to build in a stop at the nether regions of the barrel, so that the converter doesn't have room to wiggle loose. A converter that is too long won't fit, one that is too short won't have that protection.

 

In any case, modern Waterman converters aren't much more costly than a Schmidt, and will work in any full size modern Waterman. You can keep both styles and use the proprietaries as needed. I wouldn't let converter style stop you from enjoying Waterman pens.

 

The models that take the harder to find converters are:

C/F and Directeur General (C/F or Lady type)

Lady series and Concord small size (Lady type - a bit shorter than C/F)

These accept many brands of international short carts - the ones with the narrower nipple end

 

A question for you all: I remember Schmidt making several other sizes - K-7, K-4, K-8, etc. I know one of those sizes was Waterman (K7 I think), but I haven't seen them in a while. I never bought any because they were the same price as Waterman.

Does anyone know if they are still available?

Current catalogue lists K1, K2, K5 and K6

 

 

D.ick

[GreenMountain]

What is your advice on cartridges for a Waterman Concord pen? Not the Lady shorter version, the full size version, please?