Anti-Bacterial Pens

[farmerjohn]

 

I disagree. Silver metal ionizes naturally in the presence of water, tissue fluids and other solutions. Sweat from your hands should theoretically ionize small amounts of silver with normal use. This is why silver instruments were historically used in surgery. We don't use them today due to cost and modern sterilization techniques but the benefit has never (at least to my knowledge) been invalidated. I personally don't think there is much antimicrobial benefit to using any of these metals on a writing instrument but I sure think they're gorgeous and look forward to owning a YOL one day. I'd recommend a bit of hand sanitizer before and after using a pen.... but that's just me.

I think you meant to say oxidize.

Ionization deals with the transfer of energy and kicking out /transfer of electrons

not will a small amount of silver exposed to water become a silver oxide of some form or a sulfate

[sitnstew]

I think you meant to say oxidize.

Ionization deals with the transfer of energy and kicking out /transfer of electrons

not will a small amount of silver exposed to water become a silver oxide of some form or a sulfate

 

I understand what ionization means and that's what I intended to say. However, I won't claim to know enough about chemistry to give a thorough argument but this peer reviewed journal seems to agree with me: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16766878

 

Also, I think it's important to note that an ionic compound is different than free ions of an element. Sterling silver has ionic bonds but that is not the same as saying it is free ions. The ionic bond must be broken for the silver to be bioactive which is why I stated what I did above. This is at least the way I understand it.... but admittedly it's been a while since I sat in a chemistry class. I'm open to being educated if I'm wrong.

[Gloucesterman]

Don't know if anyone has said this and, "When it comes to sharing pens, that's why cheap ball points were invented"!

 

My recommendation: Go out and buy a gross of ball points (probably less then $10.00 on eBay) and when someone wants to borrow a pen, give it to them!

 

Simply, easy, no "getting it back issues".

 

Also, a simply solution to passing on airborne germs - Inhale more, exhale less! A two to one ratio is best... ;) ;)

[sitnstew]

Some more info stated better than I did: http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php/Silver_as_an_Antimicrobial_Agent#Ionized_silver

[sitnstew]

Don't know if anyone has said this and, "When it comes to sharing pens, that's why cheap ball points were invented"!

 

My recommendation: Go out and buy a gross of ball points (probably less then $10.00 on eBay) and when someone wants to borrow a pen, give it to them!

 

Simply, easy, no "getting it back issues".

 

Also, a simply solution to passing on airborne germs - Inhale more, exhale less! A two to one ratio is best... ;) ;)

 

+1

[Inkling13]

silver by its very nature of its bond is IONIC

 

most people falsely believe that silver has to be in special forms to be effective (ie the colodial silver BS people buy into) and to be colloidal means its 1-100 nanometers in size so your $8 dollar bottles got practically nothing in it.

and regardless of wether or not you have a single atom of silver or a bar (lots of silver atoms) it will still do the exact same thing because it is the same thing regardless of scale

Not quite so. Silver oxide, is in a charged ion form. Metallic silver has no charge being by definition of its elemental form, and has no charge.

[farmerjohn]

 

I understand what ionization means and that's what I intended to say. However, I won't claim to know enough about chemistry to give a thorough argument but this peer reviewed journal seems to agree with me: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16766878

 

Also, I think it's important to note that an ionic compound is different than free ions of an element. Sterling silver has ionic bonds but that is not the same as saying it is free ions. The ionic bond must be broken for the silver to be bioactive which is why I stated what I did above. This is at least the way I understand it.... but admittedly it's been a while since I sat in a chemistry class. I'm open to being educated if I'm wrong.

looks like reading that abstract that when it is oxidizing it becomes a sulfite

my guess that it is acting like a natural sulfa drug and act bacteriostatically and do not kill microbes so much as prevent there replication effectively allowing them to die out quickly

[85AKbN]

a marine and a sailor were at the urinal. the sailor flushed and was walking out and the marine said they always taught us to wash our hands after taking a (bleep). the sailor said, they always taught us not to pee on our fingers.

[Dillo]

Some more info stated better than I did: http://microbewiki.kenyon.edu/index.php/Silver_as_an_Antimicrobial_Agent#Ionized_silver

 

"Silver in its non-ionized form is inert (Guggenbichler et al., 1999), but contact with moisture leads to the release of silver ions (Radheshkumar and Munstedt, 2005). Thus, all forms of silver or silver containing compounds with observed antimicrobial properties are in one way or another sources of silver ions"

 

Hands release plenty of moisture, so does contact with the moisture in the air.

 

Dillon

[sitnstew]

 

"Silver in its non-ionized form is inert (Guggenbichler et al., 1999), but contact with moisture leads to the release of silver ions (Radheshkumar and Munstedt, 2005). Thus, all forms of silver or silver containing compounds with observed antimicrobial properties are in one way or another sources of silver ions"

 

Hands release plenty of moisture, so does contact with the moisture in the air.

 

Dillon

 

Exactly the point I was making.

[sitnstew]

looks like reading that abstract that when it is oxidizing it becomes a sulfite

my guess that it is acting like a natural sulfa drug and act bacteriostatically and do not kill microbes so much as prevent there replication effectively allowing them to die out quickly

 

I'm fairly sure that's not correct. Why would Silver become a sulfite? Sulfites (SO₃^{2− )} are not the same as sulfa drugs (-S(=O)₂-NH₂).... and neither are related to silver or their action in the body.

 

Silver actually has both bactericidal and bacteriostatic properties. I recommend checking out numerous articles on Google Scholar that will show the biological action of silver ions.

 

However, since I don't really think these details are overly important to the original questions asked, I think it is sufficient to say that no pen is going to protect your hands from germs completely.

[farmerjohn]

 

I'm fairly sure that's not correct. Why would Silver become a sulfite? Sulfites (SO₃^{2− )} are not the same as sulfa drugs (-S(=O)₂-NH₂).... and neither are related to silver or their action in the body.

 

Silver actually has both bactericidal and bacteriostatic properties. I recommend checking out numerous articles on Google Scholar that will show the biological action of silver ions.

 

However, since I don't really think these details are overly important to the original questions asked, I think it is sufficient to say that no pen is going to protect your hands from germs completely.

im a idiot its what I get skimming the article while doing math HW the sulfides are in context of turning blue by the metal binding to cells in the dermus and other organs not its antibacterial properties

[sitnstew]

im a idiot its what I get skimming the article while doing math HW the sulfides are in context of turning blue by the metal binding to cells in the dermus and other organs not its antibacterial properties

 

No worries. If it makes you feel any better, I don't really know that much about the biochemistry of this stuff either.

[BeWitz]

hahah thats unreal

[farmerjohn]

 

No worries. If it makes you feel any better, I don't really know that much about the biochemistry of this stuff either.

I should its my major lol, well biology is

[inkstainedruth]

a marine and a sailor were at the urinal. the sailor flushed and was walking out and the marine said they always taught us to wash our hands after taking a (bleep). the sailor said, they always taught us not to pee on our fingers.

Of course I heard that joke as Harvard Law and Yale, IIRC.

As for this thread in general, I probably have more germs on my laptop keyboard, than on my pens....

About 8 years ago I had to take a sanitation course, in order to get a food handler's certificate (I'm estimating the time, because since then I've taken the refresher course twice, most recently just over a year ago; the certificate is good for 5 years -- EXCEPT in Allegheny County, PA, where it's only good for 3 years...). As part of the initial (2 day, IIRC a week apart) course, the instructor did a swab of items to send to a lab for culturing, just to show us what sort of germs are out there, including my nylon watchband. And we're not talking your average cold virus, but really nasty pathogens that will give your customers food poisoning. (Ironically, though, there wasn't actually a lot of stuff *growing* on my watchband, which surprised even me.) It's just one of those food-borne illness things that food service workers have to pay very strict attention to prevent, along with rules like people handling food *never* also handling money (at least not without strict hand-washing first), which has all *sorts* of gross stuff on it, including cocaine....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[autopsy]

Germs aren't all harmless or else infections wouldn't be a worry. If you are a healthcare professional, being germ free is incredibly important. There is a reason there are hand sanitizers outside every patient room, and if someone reports you for not using them, you get in trouble. There's also been studies on the white coat and ties doctors wear because they can transmit infections patient to patient. Most people still get extremely resistant bugs like MRSA and XDR-TB not from living in the world but by hospital stays and weakened immune systems.

 

That said, I have no idea if that pen is legit or just marketing BS.

[Ink Stained Wretch]

This anti-microbial marble pen made me laugh:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/H44-Hero-2199-18K-Antimicrobial-Man-made-Marble-FP-/160831490812?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25724dcafc

 

Regards,

 

Richard

 

Wow! And at an asking price of US $439.00 for a Hero fountain pen I'm .

[Inkling13]

Germs aren't all harmless or else infections wouldn't be a worry. If you are a healthcare professional, being germ free is incredibly important. There is a reason there are hand sanitizers outside every patient room, and if someone reports you for not using them, you get in trouble. There's also been studies on the white coat and ties doctors wear because they can transmit infections patient to patient. Most people still get extremely resistant bugs like MRSA and XDR-TB not from living in the world but by hospital stays and weakened immune systems.

 

That said, I have no idea if that pen is legit or just marketing BS.

There is NO way that physicians or healthcare professionals can be free of microbes. The only thing that hand santitizer does is reduce the number of microbes, preventing transmission of one patient's microbes to another patient. Many people can carry MRSA without knowing it and without being harmed, because staphylococcus aureus can actually live in the nasal passages transiently. I have heard of cases of MRSA being transmitted not from any hospital stay, but actually in the nasal passages of the family cat. Hand sanitizers are effective against MRSA on the hands, but for microbes like Clostridium difficile, it does absolutely nothing. As for XDR-TB, you can thank the individuals who are noncompliant with their treatments for breeding such a beastie.

 

In the end of the day, the best defense we have against anything, is to wash our hands with warm soapy water frequently.

[pokermon]

Not sure if this has been posted, but one of Silver's properties is that it kills germs/bacteria. This is how the, "saying of born with a silver spoon in the mouth" came into existence. Babies were fed with a silver spoon for health bonuses, but majority of folks that have heard the saying have been led to believe it to equate to being born with wealth which is not the case since back then everyday average joe was using silver as money. I would assume all silver or silver plated pens to carry the property.