First Urushi Pen - Danitrio Vs Nakaya Vs Namiki

[ArchiMark]

So, I find myself contemplating getting a Japanese urushi fountain pen....

 

Only previous Japanese fountain pens I've had before are 2 old style Namiki VPs and 1 Sailor Pro Gear...

Nice pens, but various reasons sold them some time ago....

 

Lately, I've been intrigued by the urushi finish pens....from pics seem to have very unique character to them...

 

Started reading posts and reviews about some of these pens....

 

My pen preferences are for larger, chunkier (wide barrel), simple design pens, with great nibs of course...

A bit of give to nib when you write is good, don't need real flexy nib....bit of tooth preferred over glassy smooth nibs....

 

As of now, thinking about the following pens and would like your thoughts and comments about them please. Also, if you think I've overlooked a good candidate, please let me know!

 

 

- Danitrio

- Densho

 

- Takumi

 

- Mikado

 

- Nakaya

- Portable Writer

 

- Namiki

 

- Yukari Royale

 

- Emperor Vermilion (might be too big?...)

 

 

Thanks in advance for your input!

 

Mark

[MYU]

Mark, you really can't go wrong with any of those Japanese pen companies you've listed. As for the nibs, it sounds to me like you'd prefer a Platinum nib [see nib page], which is what Nakaya uses in all of their pens. If you get an extra fine or super fine, you'll find it precise and a little toothy (plus Nakaya can make adjustments for you to your specifications). The only trouble with Nakaya is that if you want a custom one, it'll cost some serious money and a rather long wait. Sadly, the real sweet spot on Nakaya pricing was about 2 years ago. However, if you don't mind a basic design Nakaya has a number of models already made and ready to ship. Check out their website for more details.

 

From what I recall, Danitrio and Namiki tend to make rather wet and very smooth nibs, which is why I suggested Nakaya. However, it is certainly possible to have a nib reground to your liking by a nib meister. That's another thing to consider. Also, it may be possible to request a custom nib from Danitrio (not Namiki though).

 

Good luck with the search!

Edited February 15, 2013 by MYU

[TrinityTam]

If I may be so bold as to add two pens for your consideration. My two daily users are a Danitrio Short Octagon in ki-dame and a Nakaya Naka-ai in kuro-tamenuri. The faceting of the Danitrio really highlights the beauty of tamenuri urushi making it, possibly, my best-looking pen. The Naka-ai just feels so well-balanced in hand and is, hands down, my best writing pen.

[ArchiMark]

Mark, you really can't go wrong with any of those Japanese pen companies you've listed.

 

As for the nibs, it sounds to me like you'd prefer a Platinum nib [see nib page], which is what Nakaya uses in all of their pens. If you get an extra fine or super fine, you'll find it precise and a little toothy (plus Nakaya can make adjustments for you to your specifications). The only trouble with Nakaya is that if you want a custom one, it'll cost some serious money and a rather long wait. Sadly, the real sweet spot on Nakaya pricing was about 2 years ago. However, if you don't mind a basic design Nakaya has a number of models already made and ready to ship. Check out their website for more details.

 

From what I recall, Danitrio and Namiki tend to make rather wet and very smooth nibs, which is why I suggested Nakaya. However, it is certainly possible to have a nib reground to your liking by a nib meister. That's another thing to consider. Also, it may be possible to request a custom nib from Danitrio (not Namiki though).

 

Good luck with the search!

 

Thanks, MYU, for all your feedback...very helpful!

 

Forgot to write in original post, that I tend towards M or B width nibs...and almost all now are cursive italics...usually ground by one of the nibmeisters around....so, can get flow adjusted to my liking at same time, if I go that route...

 

Also, as I want a simple looking design, ie, either black or black with some other color showing at the edges, or maybe a reddish color pen, I won't be after a custom design pen and as you say will save cost and time.....

 

 

If I may be so bold as to add two pens for your consideration. My two daily users are a Danitrio Short Octagon in ki-dame and a Nakaya Naka-ai in kuro-tamenuri. The faceting of the Danitrio really highlights the beauty of tamenuri urushi making it, possibly, my best-looking pen. The Naka-ai just feels so well-balanced in hand and is, hands down, my best writing pen.

 

Thank you, TrinityTam, for your thoughts....appreciate it....

 

I've debated about round vs faceted shape design....have been leaning towards round, but will give it some more thought.....

[Soot]

Hi Mark--

 

I don't have any Nakaya or Namiki urushi in my collection of pens so I can't give you any opinions on them. Danitrio, however-- I do have a few.

 

All of my Danitrios are Takumi sized (a little bigger than the 149), which is pretty comfortable to hold for long term writing sessions. The nibs on the Takumi are pretty good, not too smooth and with some feedback. The flow however, tend to run on the dry side. That doesn't bother me though because I do some tweaking of my own on the feed to make them wet...

 

Also, unlike Nakaya-- nibs on the Danitrio Takumi can be easily swapped without much hassle.

 

 

-- Bob

[JustinJ]

If you like chunky pens then the Nakaya Dorsal Fin should be on your list. It is a bigger pen than the portable Nakaya pen. You could have it done in another color, if you do not like the red. I think it is the biggest pen as far as girth of the Nakaya pen models.

 

Nakaya Dorsal Fin

 

Nakaya Dorsal Fin Review FPN

[geoduc]

Hi Mark,

 

Of the pens you mention, I own a couple of Danitrio Takumis and a Nakaya Portable Writer. I have tried a Namiki Emperor but don't actually own any Namiki pens.

 

The Namiki Emperor is a huge pen. It's surprisingly nice to write with given its size and certainly makes a statement. Not very practical if you plan to carry the pen around, though.

 

As far as the Takumi vs the Portable Writer, the Takumi is a bit larger in diameter and has a larger section than the Portable Writer. I find the Takumi more comfortable in the hand, mainly due to the section (I prefer large pens as well). The section on the Portable Writer is shorter and about 1 mm smaller in diameter than the Dani - it's enough to be noticeable.

 

If you want a larger diameter Nakaya, consider a Dorsal Fin or a 17mm Portable. The 17mm Portable is not a standard item, but can be special ordered - here's a link to the review on mine: http://www.fountainp...portable-cigar/. These models give you a larger girth with a long, large diameter section that I find very comfortable. The potential drawback is that you don't get a clip and you may have to wait several months to have the pen made.

 

When it comes to the nibs, I prefer Nakaya. They have a nice bit of springiness and feedback that make them the favorite nibs of all the brands I own. Danitrio nibs are nice, but they feel too smooth and a bit lifeless in comparison to Nakaya. That's strictly my personal opinion, though.

 

As MYU says, it's hard to go wrong with any of the pens you mention. If at all possible, I'd recommend trying some in person to see what you like best. Are you close enough to SF to attend a Pen Posse? I'll bet that most of the pens you're considering are in the collections of the various members.

[ArchiMark]

Hi Mark--

 

I don't have any Nakaya or Namiki urushi in my collection of pens so I can't give you any opinions on them. Danitrio, however-- I do have a few.

 

All of my Danitrios are Takumi sized (a little bigger than the 149), which is pretty comfortable to hold for long term writing sessions. The nibs on the Takumi are pretty good, not too smooth and with some feedback. The flow however, tend to run on the dry side. That doesn't bother me though because I do some tweaking of my own on the feed to make them wet...

 

Also, unlike Nakaya-- nibs on the Danitrio Takumi can be easily swapped without much hassle.

 

 

-- Bob

 

Thank you, Bob, for all your helpful input.....

 

Appreciate the size comparison with 149, as I've had a few of them....and it's a comfortable size pen for me....as for the dryness, as long as it doesn't skip or have hard starting issues, not a problem and can adjust if needed...

 

Also, good to know about ease of nib swaps with Danitrio....

 

 

 

If you like chunky pens then the Nakaya Dorsal Fin should be on your list. It is a bigger pen than the portable Nakaya pen. You could have it done in another color, if you do not like the red. I think it is the biggest pen as far as girth of the Nakaya pen models.

 

Nakaya Dorsal Fin

 

Nakaya Dorsal Fin Review FPN

 

OK, Justin, thanks for your suggestion....will check it out.....

[ArchiMark]

Hi Mark,

 

Of the pens you mention, I own a couple of Danitrio Takumis and a Nakaya Portable Writer. I have tried a Namiki Emperor but don't actually own any Namiki pens.

 

The Namiki Emperor is a huge pen. It's surprisingly nice to write with given its size and certainly makes a statement. Not very practical if you plan to carry the pen around, though.

 

As far as the Takumi vs the Portable Writer, the Takumi is a bit larger in diameter and has a larger section than the Portable Writer. I find the Takumi more comfortable in the hand, mainly due to the section (I prefer large pens as well). The section on the Portable Writer is shorter and about 1 mm smaller in diameter than the Dani - it's enough to be noticeable.

 

If you want a larger diameter Nakaya, consider a Dorsal Fin or a 17mm Portable. The 17mm Portable is not a standard item, but can be special ordered - here's a link to the review on mine: http://www.fountainp...portable-cigar/. These models give you a larger girth with a long, large diameter section that I find very comfortable. The potential drawback is that you don't get a clip and you may have to wait several months to have the pen made.

 

When it comes to the nibs, I prefer Nakaya. They have a nice bit of springiness and feedback that make them the favorite nibs of all the brands I own. Danitrio nibs are nice, but they feel too smooth and a bit lifeless in comparison to Nakaya. That's strictly my personal opinion, though.

 

As MYU says, it's hard to go wrong with any of the pens you mention. If at all possible, I'd recommend trying some in person to see what you like best. Are you close enough to SF to attend a Pen Posse? I'll bet that most of the pens you're considering are in the collections of the various members.

 

Thank you, geoduc, for all your great input....

 

Yes, that Emperor does seem like a big bat....

 

Helpful comparison info on the Takumi vs Portable Writer....

 

As noted above, will check out the Dorsal.....as for the custom Portable, as noted before, want to avoid custom order pen if possible due to cost and time...

 

Appreciate the comparison on Danitrio and Nakaya nibs...very important to know their characteristics to make a decision about pen....

 

Would be great to try these pens out in person, but Pen Posse meets at times I'm not available unfortunately....

[geoduc]

Here's a quick comparison photo so that you can get a feel for relative sizes. Top to bottom: Pelikan M800, Danitrio Takumi, Nakaya Portable Writer, Nakaya 17mm Portable Cigar.

 

[Soot]

Thank you, Bob, for all your helpful input.....

 

Appreciate the size comparison with 149, as I've had a few of them....and it's a comfortable size pen for me....as for the dryness, as long as it doesn't skip or have hard starting issues, not a problem and can adjust if needed...

 

Also, good to know about ease of nib swaps with Danitrio....

Quick note-- Dani nibs at times can be a hit-and-miss, they don't always work out of the box. If you're getting it from nibs.com however, render the statement moot. The one size nib that I had problems with was the Stiff Stub; they had a starting problem and often skipped when I wrote too fast-- but then again, I don't know whether the cause of the problem is due to the dry flow.

 

The regular F/M/B size nibs that I tried had no problems.

 

Here's the swap on my Negoro-nuri. :-)

 

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8251/8476492557_01229bb8a6_z.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8387/8476492675_8426c328cc_z.jpg

For me, nib swaps is part of the fun and unfortunately that can't be done on Nakayas...at least not that DIY-friendly.

[MYU]

Thanks, MYU, for all your feedback...very helpful!

 

Forgot to write in original post, that I tend towards M or B width nibs...and almost all now are cursive italics...usually ground by one of the nibmeisters around....so, can get flow adjusted to my liking at same time, if I go that route...

 

Also, as I want a simple looking design, ie, either black or black with some other color showing at the edges, or maybe a reddish color pen, I won't be after a custom design pen and as you say will save cost and time.....

You're welcome, glad to help. Ah, when you said "toothy" I assumed the effect of a very fine nib. I see that you really meant the kind of friction you get with cursive italic. As you can see on the Nakaya site, they don't list cursive italic as an option. While they do accommodate nib customization, I don't know to what extent that is. If they're not accustomed to grinding a cursive italic, then it may just be best to get a broad nib and have someone stateside do the customizing for you.

 

Ah, good point by Bob about the nib swap. I'd forgotten that some Danitrio models have user removable nibs (I think they are friction fit, unlike Pelikan nibs that screw-in). That's a really nice advantage if you're one to like doing that sort of thing. Anyway... lots of good advice here now. Hopefully enough to help you decide.

 

[Edited: corrected error about Danitrio nib units]

Edited February 16, 2013 by MYU

[ArchiMark]

Here's a quick comparison photo so that you can get a feel for relative sizes. Top to bottom: Pelikan M800, Danitrio Takumi, Nakaya Portable Writer, Nakaya 17mm Portable Cigar.

 

 

THANKS, for the comparison photo! That is very helpful....these pens have required chunkiness I like...

 

see what you mean about the longer section on the Cigar....

 

 

Quick note-- Dani nibs at times can be a hit-and-miss, they don't always work out of the box. If you're getting it from nibs.com however, render the statement moot. The one size nib that I had problems with was the Stiff Stub; they had a starting problem and often skipped when I wrote too fast-- but then again, I don't know whether the cause of the problem is due to the dry flow.

 

The regular F/M/B size nibs that I tried had no problems.

 

Here's the swap on my Negoro-nuri. :-)

 

For me, nib swaps is part of the fun and unfortunately that can't be done on Nakayas...at least not that DIY-friendly.

 

THANKS, for your added input and photos! Again, very helpful to see....

 

Yes, definitely thinking about nibs.com for the reason you refer to plus ability to get nib ground at same time...

 

I like what appears to be a darker red color on the Negoro-nuri as opposed to some of the pics I see of brighter red colored pens...am I correct in interpreting this correctly?

[ArchiMark]

You're welcome, glad to help. Ah, when you said "toothy" I assumed the effect of a very fine nib. I see that you really meant the kind of friction you get with cursive italic. As you can see on the Nakaya site, they don't list cursive italic as an option. While they do accommodate nib customization, I don't know to what extent that is. If they're not accustomed to grinding a cursive italic, then it may just be best to get a broad nib and have someone stateside do the customizing for you.

 

Ah, good point by Bob about the nib swap. I'd forgotten that some Danitrio models have user removable nibs (I think they unscrew, much like Pelikan nibs). That's a really nice advantage if you're one to like doing that sort of thing. Anyway... lots of good advice here now. Hopefully enough to help you decide.

 

Yes, exactly, a bit of resistance on the paper as opposed to that glassy gliding across the page feeling (like a car out of control driving on ice...)....

 

If I buy from nibs.com (have bought a few pens from them before...), I can get nib adjusted/ground the way I want before it ships to me...

 

Don't usually swap nibs, but it's nice to know that it's easy to do on the Danitrio's, just in case....

 

Yes, lots of good info, although it's still a bit tough to decide....will mull it over this weekend I think, but look at the photos online again, etc...

 

 

Urushi Finishes

Do have one more question about types of urushi finishes, if someone can please advise...

 

I've seen online the description and pics of the Rioro-migaki finish. However, from the pics I've seen so far, it's hard for me to understand how this finish differs looks-wise from other urushi finishes. Get the impression that it's a more dulled looking finish compared to some of the other ones that have a bit more gloss and translucency to them. Is this correct or ?

 

Thanks again for everyone's input!

 

[Soot]

I like what appears to be a darker red color on the Negoro-nuri as opposed to some of the pics I see of brighter red colored pens...am I correct in interpreting this correctly?

Negoro-nuri is not anymore darker than the tamenuri, so I really think it's a lighting issue. Unfortunately, I don't have a tamenuri in my collection to verify that.

 

Lastly, the Dani nib and feed is friction fit, NOT like that of Pelikan screw-out unit.

[ArchiMark]

I like what appears to be a darker red color on the Negoro-nuri as opposed to some of the pics I see of brighter red colored pens...am I correct in interpreting this correctly?

Negoro-nuri is not anymore darker than the tamenuri, so I really think it's a lighting issue. Unfortunately, I don't have a tamenuri in my collection to verify that.

 

Lastly, the Dani nib and feed is friction fit, NOT like that of Pelikan screw-out unit.

 

 

Got it, Soot.....but it's not a bright red color, right?

 

And thanks for the nib/feed fit clarification.....

 

[Soot]

Nope, not bright red. Quite the opposite, more like a dark dark cherry color.

[ArchiMark]

Nope, not bright red. Quite the opposite, more like a dark dark cherry color.

 

Thanks for confirming....seems like a very nice color...

[Painterspal]

 

Do have one more question about types of urushi finishes, if someone can please advise...

 

I've seen online the description and pics of the Rioro-migaki finish. However, from the pics I've seen so far, it's hard for me to understand how this finish differs looks-wise from other urushi finishes.

 

 

I think Rioro-migaki is a general term for the highly polished, relatively solid colour finishes. It refers to the techniques used to create that shiny gloss look. Others -please chime in if I'm wrong.

 

I own most of the pens on your list and I agree with the comments above. I don't have an Emperor and think it's probably too large for general use. I have a long Piccolo rather than the portable writer, but the key measurements are similar. I briefly reviewed the Yukari Royal urushi and compared it to a Danitrio Densho here. I think the Namiki is a fabulous pen and still own it, but overall I prefer ebonite pens.

 

I think the weak points (if you can say such a thing) of the Nakaya are the section and the clip. I really don't like having my thumb partly on the cap threads but the gripping area just isn't long enough (I don't have large hands). In this respect the Danitrios are much better as the sections are all exactly right. I think the Nakaya clip looks a bit cheap but it's functional and durable, so perhaps it's just a matter of taste.

 

If I'm honest I find the Danis a bit more shapely too. The Nakaya is basically a cylinder with curved ends and a little more utilitarian. However, as others have said, the Nakaya nibs, particularly those tuned by JM are simply great. All mine are fantastic writers. I don't have a problem with Dani nibs but find they have less star quality, except perhaps for the larger Mikado size. Mine is sublime and Nakaya has nothing comparable.

 

I'd also put in a vote for the faceted pens. They show the urushi off beautifully and they don't need a clip!

Edited February 16, 2013 by Painterspal

[jde]

I'd also put in a vote for the faceted pens. They show the urushi off beautifully and they don't need a clip!

 

+1

 

Great stuff in these posts. It is always difficult to ask "which" as we all chime in with our favs, yet folks have done a pretty good job detailing differences here.

 

I've 3 short octagon Danitrios, so of course I'm biased there. I've had one Nakaya Piccolo, beautifully done & with, of course, the magnificent nib. Yet I prefer the finish of the Danitrios for some reason. My short octagons have great depth in their deceptively simple finish. Plus I can ED them which I really like a lot.

 

For the nibs: I've 2 EEF flex which I don't exercise as flex pens. They give me the occasional flourish when I'm writing. I've one hard fine that I had Michael Masuyama grind down further to a .2mm fine. (He also fixed one of the EEFs that a well-meaning fountain pen aficionado sprung.) All those nibs are sublime. I've had a disappointment or two with "out of the box" Danitrio nibs, but they were easily rectified. If you are buying from Mottishaw not much to worry about in terms of the out of the box disappointment of a Danitrio nib.

 

Just yadda yadda being repetitious here, really. Appreciating this thread!