Grocery Bag? Lunch Bag? Nib smoothing?

[ViolinWriter]

I recently purchased a lovely pen to be gifted to someone this next (2007) Christmas. This being a far in the future gift requirement, I decided to test the pen just to be safe.

 

Riiight. And I'm not using any of those new nifty colors in the converter either. Nope, not me....NEVER!!! [Would someone please let Gepetto know my nose needs shortening? Again.]

 

Anyway, the nib is a bit scratchy. Not a real, wake you from a slumber, or even sounding like metal on sandpaper, but enough of a scratch to be noticeable. Granted, I have the hearing of a fruit bat, but it's louder than any of my other pens. I'm not so sure about the intended recipient still having the ears we all were blessed with in youth, but still and all, it seems it shouldn't be quite so noticeable.

 

The thing is, I've tried searching on the repair section here, and cannot find any discussion regarding the advice I was given to, "use a brown paper bag". Apparently there is some trick with a brown paper bag that does the sort of scritchiness-tone-down the pen deserves. Or that my ears deserve, as at present the pen is growing on me, and may never make it to the "wrapped and ready for someone's Christmas stocking" stash.

 

Soooo...these are my questions:

 

What type of brown paper bag should you use? The big, heavyweight brown grocery bags that easily hold a few pounds of beans, rice, a few oranges, a few veggies, a carton of milk and a loaf of bread? (That would be food for a week on my recovering from injury budget.)

 

Or, is the brown paper bag of the lunch bag variety better?

 

Are there vintages or grocery chain bags that are preferred for this, as one might have vintages for fine wine? [No, that wasn't serious. I've finished a three week project and am getting punchy here, and without even having a glass of wine.]

 

I even have some still lighter weight brown bakery bags. I'm pretty sure those aren't what is intended. They're just like regular notebook paper, only brown.

 

I don't want to use something that will end up damaging the tip, as once that happens there is more of a serious problem to deal with. Or even replacing the nib, which would really make me guilty about having test-written with the pen.

 

It seems the big heavy bags are made of really coarse paper than the lunch packing variety of brown paper bag. Would the difference be too much with the heavier paper? Does it even matter?

 

When I do apply the pen to the paper, what sort of motion is best? Do I do the right circle, then left circles or alternating big round circles on the paper as if I'm back in third grade learning "Cursed Crusive"? Should I do back and forth and/or up and down strokes? Is there an optimal angle for the tip to be applied to the paper? Do I rub the paper against the bag? Long or short strokes if I do the back and forth in lines? Ditto up and down.

 

Am I asking too many stupid questions? Be kind. I'm new at this, having never even thought of needing to smooth a nib for any reason. If nibs are scratchy, I usually don't buy the pen they're attached to, but this was mail order.

 

The pen in question has an 18kt gold plated two-tone nib with the word Iridium stamped on the nib. The nib is made in Germany.

 

All comments about my compulsion to act with such care should remember I have to be perfect on the violin regularly. Such compulsiveness does creep into other areas of my life, but not to the point where I am currently consuming psychotropic drugs. Although, maybe I should be speaking to Uncle Sigmund?

 

I live and breathe the wisdom that every movement I make should be musical. Plus, and this may be a shock to some, but I am a good violist. That is ordinarily in the class of "jumbo shrimp" oxymorons, but it all stems from the same precision of playing motions, such as would be used with a canoe paddle that's not too big. Which the cello is, even in a pinch.

 

I suppose I should ask if I'm supposed to pop a bit of Vivaldi into the music machine or if the Stones would be better. But I won't.

Edited January 20, 2007 by ViolinWriter

[sheafferkid]

Hi! I was reading a while back about nib smoothing and I heard to use very very fine grit sandpaper (1500 grit and above), putting a drop of water on it, then write circles in that wet area changing nib angles so it rounds the nib off and makes it smooth. I have not tried this method, but I have only heard about it. It sounds plausible though. Hope that might help.

 

Evan

[amh210]

Yes, you can use brown paper bags for smoothing. After all, given enough time, nibs will wear down on any kind of paper.

 

You should eliminate the other possiblities that contribute to scratchiness before you spend time smoothing. Tine alignment is a likely suspect.

 

If everything else is well, just ink the pen and lightly draw whatever you like all over the bag. I favor figure 8's but you can do circles, zig zags, hash marks, whatever.

 

I've never thought about it, but if you have a variety of bags start with the coarsest and work your way up to the smoothest. Take a break every few minutes and write on a piece of nice paper. At some point, everything else being equal, your nib should be noticibly smoother. Keep at it until you feel you are done.

 

There are more efficient nib-smoothing strategies, but at least you can't do much damage writing with a FP on a brown paper bag. Doesn't take much investment or special supplies, either.

 

Next, you want to post a question about using a copper penny "USA vintage Lincoln 1 cent" for nib smoothing. :)9

 

Enjoy!

 

Andy

[Maja]

Here is the original brown paper bag nib smoothing post by OldGriz (Tom):

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/in...?showtopic=5118

 

In his 3rd post in that thread, he mentions "brown craft paper"(same as brown paper bags, according to Griz), so perhaps this is what you were looking for, ViolinWriter (you asked some good questions, by the way! ) Personally, I draw "figure 8s" on Micromesh or Mylar, and I make sure I wet the nib with water or ink before I start moving the nib on the smoothing surface...

[ViolinWriter]

Thank you all for your advice.

 

I did try the brown paper bag, starting with the lighter weight/less coarse textured (lunch bag type) and then went to the coarser big grocery bag.

 

Then I reversed the process, going from the heavier (coarser?) to the lighter weight, smoother brown bag.

 

Still not quite there after three attempts. On to another small variation.

 

I put a large grocery bag into another bag, inside another bag. I then stomped, stepped on, ground my foot around a bit and otherwise 'distressed' the bags, thinking the original pristine quality of the paper in the bag might have been a little non-responsive to the pen going round and round on the surface.

 

When the stiffness was out of the brown paper, and using the inside surface only of the "distressed" bag, after another two tries--SUCCESS!!!

 

Thanks again. Pure genius in your suggestions were the key to triumph.

 

So, now that I have this pen working so well, what am I going to get my sister for her birthday or Christmas? This pen is such a sweet writer, I'm tempted not to give it away at all.

 

With this nib smoothing success, could someone please tell me how to smooth out that cadenza from the Turkish Concerto (Mozart, 5th for Violin)?

 

Perhaps I should play with a paper bag over my head?

 

Hanging from each ear? They do put handles on them after all...

[superfly]

I used the brown wrapping paper from Ikea on my pal's Pelikan M200. It worked just fine, after some A4 size paper filled with circles...

 

Nenad

[Nihontochicken]

Well, I guess now is as good a time as ever to admit to my failures at "nib smoothing". I particularly remember a 12K nib from a Hero 132 that was scratchy. I used, in succession, 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 and 2000 grit sandpaper. No go. Though the outside edges were smoothed, the problem seemed to be in the nib split, which was sharp. The nib appeared to be scraping paper and forcing it up through the nib split. I imagine it is NOT just a question of smoothing the OUTSIDE nib edges, but also putting a bit of a round to the INSIDE edges at the nib split where it contacts the paper, a much more delicate consideration. Any confirmations or denials???

[Maja]

Well, I guess now is as good a time as ever to admit to my failures at "nib smoothing". I particularly remember a 12K nib from a Hero 132 that was scratchy. I used, in succession, 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 and 2000 grit sandpaper. No go. Though the outside edges were smoothed, the problem seemed to be in the nib split, which was sharp. The nib appeared to be scraping paper and forcing it up through the nib split. I imagine it is NOT just a question of smoothing the OUTSIDE nib edges, but also putting a bit of a round to the INSIDE edges at the nib split where it contacts the paper, a much more delicate consideration. Any confirmations or denials???

It might be....Check out the section of Wim's article on nib smoothing where he uses lapping film to smooth the inner nib slits:

http://fp.vandebilt.net/html/ngFPNv102.html

It's about half way down the page....

[chupie]

Why the water on the nib when smoothing? I hadn't read this before? You can see my latest attempt at smoothing. :blush:Not pretty but I have to say, it writes very smoothly now.

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/in...ndpost&p=215901

[Gerry]

Yes, it is quite common to have to smooth the inside of the tines as well as the outside, although certainly not to the same extent. Too much curvature there may result in a baby bottom effect, where the ink can't wick down to the surface of the paper, and you get hard starting problems.

 

Just ease the sharp edge a little.

 

Regards,

 

Gerry

[Gerry]

You use water or ink to lubricate the nib and help avoid loading of the abrasive papers used. I think ultimately you'll get the same result on the nib, with or without water, but you will find the paper/film wearing out or becoming clogged much faster without a fluid. Same goes for a stone, if you use one.

 

I know a person who swears by using a very light oil as it doesn't dry out as quickly as water and he doesn't have to replenish as often.

 

Others use ink - so they can test write during the smoothing process without much interruption.

 

Regards,

 

Gerry

[psfred]

I have been using my finest waterstone for nib smoothing. It's fine enough to polish steel to a near mirror finish, so I don't think I'll take too much material off.

 

I would not use any abrasive more aggressive than brown paper without examining the nib for alignment at condition first, as you can remove the tipping material and never get a crooked nib smooth.

 

I have a Hero 616, brand new, with an off-center slit (and a Parker 45 XF nib just as bad) that, when I got the actuall writing surface correctly aligned, writes as smooth as anything else I have without more that a single wipe on the stone.

 

Tip alignment is the most important thing here, even an overly sharp inner edge and rough tips should give you a decent, if narrow, sweet spot with minimal work. Misaligned, you won't get it smooth, and it may in fact get worse as you grind away, taking the radius off the tipping inner edges.

 

Remember that the contact point is around 50 degrees from the axis of the pen, not the "bottom" of the tipping material. Hold the pen as you normally do, and note where the nib touches the paper, then examine that spot for alignment and smoothness. Likely you will find some roughness at the sides of the contact area causing the noise.

 

Occasionally you will find a nib with a defect in the tipping material -- I have a Sheaffer Admiral with a rough spot on one time in the contact area that I cannot get quiet. It's smooth enough, but there is a crater in the contact point, so I'm leaving it alone. I don't think there would be enough material left if I ground it out! If this is the case, you can usually get it smooth enough to use with light pressure, but it may never be quiet. Mine is a fine nib, too, so there isn't all that much to work with in the first place.

 

Peter