Snob Appeal/anti-Snob Appeal Pens

[Mickey]

I think MB counterparts in today's culture are Bose.

 

 

Interesting. I don't entirely discount your idea, but where then do you place products like Krell or Futterman (possibly the Waterman wet-noodle of amplifiers), let alone professional equipment (Meyer Sound, BagEnd, Genelec, etc.?)

 

BTW, I think your grouping of MB with Bose, slights MB, which is a bit more of a Klipsch sort of company: solid traditional equipment (the K-Horn thru Heresy corresponding to the 149, etc.) mixed in with some quasi-hi-tech blingy stuff (corresponding to the LE pens).

Edited December 26, 2011 by Mickey

[brwolff]

How can I be a fountain pen snob when I drive a 1997 Saturn!

[Redbarchettayyz]

So, in the context of this discussion, what do you call someone who owns and uses a pen with high snob-appeal but refuses to take it out of his home because he doesn't want to be seen with it?

 

An anti-snob snob, clearly

[Bullwinkle]

am I a snob because I like to spend a little money on luxury items? I still drive a 96 Honda Accord Station Wagon I bought new. I buy $15 Wranglers at Wally's and most my chino's and casual stuff at Target. I spent a little $$$ at Saddleback recently for a Leather ID Wallet $28 and $60 for a med Moleskine Cover. Which is much less than the same items elsewhere but because they have a Saddleback logo I get comments. I bought a Sheaffer Legacy and a Sailor 1911 recently during the Pen City sale. Was I a snob or smart for getting almost a 2 for 1 deal? Trust me if I ever run across a 40% sale on Montblanc FPs I'll be the biggest snob I can be. I just wish I had bought 2 Sheaffer's instead of the Sailor. I don't drink much beer or whiskey but I buy the good stuff same with pipes and tobacco. I rather have mid range (300=/-) pipes from Peterson and Tinsky than a pile of drug store pipes. I know guys with huge houses that can't afford to furnish them. I know guys with $$$ sports cars who live in (bleep) houses. I'll spend my $$$$ however I like and enjoy it and you can spend your money on whatever floats your boat.

[JeanManuel]

Okay, I give up... what is a 'non-pen fan? Somebody who loves 'no pens'??

 

http://i654.photobucket.com/albums/uu264/peli46/-xSick.png <== Mike about to give up

 

You can cool the air with it but it won't write?

[Fabienne]

I find myself hopelessly in love with several cheap pens which have elements I dearly love. The Pilor 78g is lightweight and writes perfectly with a stub point. The TWSBI writes perfectly and has the right heft and is see through. The Pelikano Jr. writes perfectly and is cute as a duce. The Sheaffer I got as a consolation prize in a purchase has become my little Bay State Blue go-to pen and with a few twirls on the micro mesh it's smooth as water. . There are so many roaringly good inexpensive pens out there, I am loosing my zest for acquiring a Mont Blanc...I would feel guilty for not using it. I guess I am just a low class woman.

[kazoolaw]

Anyone who is serious about writing knows that taken purely as a functional instrument, MB ranks below several other brands.

 

I am serious, deadly.

 

To which brands do you refer?

 

Or do you refer to models within brands?

 

Do you refer to modern or vintage?

 

Standard or LE?

 

My 59 year old 246 works very well "purely as a functional instrument", as does a 20th century 149. They put ink on paper dependably. Perhaps they would attain your standard if they had their stars removed .

 

Prompting one to ask, "Who is the snob?"

 

gary

[Brian K]

Anyone who is serious about writing knows that taken purely as a functional instrument, MB ranks below several other brands.

 

I am serious, deadly.

 

To which brands do you refer?

 

Or do you refer to models within brands?

 

Do you refer to modern or vintage?

 

Standard or LE?

 

My 59 year old 246 works very well "purely as a functional instrument", as does a 20th century 149. They put ink on paper dependably. Perhaps they would attain your standard if they had their stars removed .

 

Prompting one to ask, "Who is the snob?"

 

gary

 

I, too, have been a little surprised at the negative comments I hear about MB pens at FPN on occasion. I bought my 149 about 25 years ago not because of snob appeal (I didn't, and still don't, work where anyone would care) but because I had heard so many positive things about it. This was before they moved big time into accessories and were still mainly making writing tools.

 

The 149 has been my go to pen for all that time and I have not treated it like precious jewelry. I have taken it all sorts of places and it has never let me down. It needs service right now because the pink sealant in the nib assembly has come loose, but that's the first problem with it in all that time. How many other daily use items with moving parts can we say that about? The last time I used it it wrote as smoothly as when it was new. It was my third MB and I only got rid of the other two because I was using the 149 to the exclusion of everything everything else.

 

In my (admittedly limited) experience, MB pens are fine instruments and not deserving of the snide remarks I see here.

 

YMMV,

 

Brian

[pajaro]

As far as the general public in the USA is concerned, Montblanc is the snob pen, because it's what they know about. If they see you with a fountain pen, the comments I hear are "Nice rollerball!" or "A fountain pen! ChhChh!" Unless it's a Montblanc, it doesn't register as deserving respect.

 

Among fountain pen users, reactions to everything are all over the map.

 

 

[Garageboy]

Anti snobbery is just as bad as snobbery, IMHO

"I refuse to buy (insert high end pen here) because bankers and the 1% use them...)

[dascoyne]

When I hear "snob-appeal" I think of pens that rely heavily on their brand. I think of Cartier, Ferrari, Jaguar, and Porsche Designs.

[hbquikcomjamesl]

I would also put Pelikan in the "Major Covering Every Escape Hatch" category. Sure, they have a few major snob appeal pens, but they also put out workhorses like the M200, and student pens like the Pelikano.

[Postscript]

When I hear "snob-appeal" I think of pens that rely heavily on their brand. I think of Cartier, Ferrari, Jaguar, and Porsche Designs.

 

Don't know about the snob appeal but I really love my Porsche pen. It is comfortable and is a great and consistent writer for me. Never thought about its alleged snob appeal though.

 

Post Script

[Pendragon]

As far as the general public in the USA is concerned, Montblanc is the snob pen, because it's what they know about.

Most Americans don't know the difference between a Mont Blanc and any other pen. It is mostly pen enthusiasts and the status-symbol-aware who recognize any pen as being expensive, unique or coveted.

 

Those who use black Moleskine-style notebooks with an elastic band are apparently also seen as stuck up. Sounds to me like the snob watchers have way too much time on their hands. If someone acts like a conceited ass, call them on it. Otherwise, why waste the time and energy on snob patrol? Stereotypes are often just rumor or suspicion with a measure of ignorance added for good effect.

[Brian K]

As far as the general public in the USA is concerned, Montblanc is the snob pen, because it's what they know about.

Most Americans don't know the difference between a Mont Blanc and any other pen. It is mostly pen enthusiasts and the status-symbol-aware who recognize any pen as being expensive, unique or coveted.

 

Those who use black Moleskine-style notebooks with an elastic band are apparently also seen as stuck up. Sounds to me like the snob watchers have way too much time on their hands. If someone acts like a conceited ass, call them on it. Otherwise, why waste the time and energy on snob patrol? Stereotypes are often just rumor or suspicion with a measure of ignorance added for good effect.

 

Some people assume that someone who decides that they're willing to pay for quality are snobs. What they fail to see is that there can be small snobberies as well as grand ones. We all insist on a particular brand, style or type of something above all others. It might be something as pedestrian as the mayonnaise, ketchup or mustard that graces our tables. It might the brand of jeans we wear. It could be what we drive or where we vacation, but we all have certain things we rate as better than all others of its type and, as much as we can, we remain loyal to it.

 

Sometimes, however, what others see as "snob appeal" is actually a type of frugality. I bought my 149 about 25 years ago for about $279 which works out to about $10 or $11 a year plus the cost of ink. Most people I know, lose more than that value of pens each year...AND the longer I own it the lower the cost per year. I am reminded of a guy who wrote of growing up poor and his mother scrimped and saved to buy the best shoes and clothing for him and his siblings and they all wore them for years. His mother always said they were too poor to wear cheap clothes that needed constant replacement.

 

YMMV,

 

Brian

[georges zaslavsky]

 

Interestingly, MB has become such a status symbol that even the plain black is one of the most high-rated in terms of snob appeal. Indeed, I have three such pens, in different sizes, that were gifts from people who told me it would "suit your status". Anyone who is serious about writing knows that taken purely as a functional instrument, MB ranks below several other brands.

I own several vintage 149s and 146s, one of my daily users is a 1979 MB 149 which has a flexible nib and which is always ready for use even though I don't use it every day. It is an extremely reliable and proven instrument that I rank higher than other writing instruments from certain brands.

Edited December 28, 2011 by georges zaslavsky

[Mickey]

Regarding MB

 

Are MB's products generally of high quality? Absolutely. Are they over-priced? Almost surely. Similar functionality, reliability, and fit and finish are available for considerably less money. (Imagine what the folks at TWSBI could turn out for half the price.) Snob appeal almost surely accounts for most of this price delta. Is this MB's fault? Not entirely. Do they court their market position? Almost surely. It would be foolish not to.

 

MB 'suffers' for having successfully attracted (along with sensible users) a large body of folks who see a 149 as the ultimate piece of pocket jewelry, a merit badge of sorts (seldom earned). The unfortunate consequence of this pathetic display behavior is the inflation of what is already an inflated price, an inflation which has probably spilled over on to other high quality pens. Again, don't blame MB. Blame the Bozos who believe fountain pens are solely fashion accessories.

 

Just a random thought, but it somehow ties in, at least it does in my warped mind: Next time you have to speak in front of a large group of people, don't imagine your audience in their underwear. Instead, imagine them with BICs clipped to their shirt pockets.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Mickey

[JeanManuel]

As far as the general public in the USA is concerned, Montblanc is the snob pen, because it's what they know about.

Most Americans don't know the difference between a Mont Blanc and any other pen. It is mostly pen enthusiasts and the status-symbol-aware who recognize any pen as being expensive, unique or coveted.

 

Those who use black Moleskine-style notebooks with an elastic band are apparently also seen as stuck up. Sounds to me like the snob watchers have way too much time on their hands. If someone acts like a conceited ass, call them on it. Otherwise, why waste the time and energy on snob patrol? Stereotypes are often just rumor or suspicion with a measure of ignorance added for good effect.

 

Some people assume that someone who decides that they're willing to pay for quality are snobs. What they fail to see is that there can be small snobberies as well as grand ones. We all insist on a particular brand, style or type of something above all others. It might be something as pedestrian as the mayonnaise, ketchup or mustard that graces our tables. It might the brand of jeans we wear. It could be what we drive or where we vacation, but we all have certain things we rate as better than all others of its type and, as much as we can, we remain loyal to it.

 

Sometimes, however, what others see as "snob appeal" is actually a type of frugality. I bought my 149 about 25 years ago for about $279 which works out to about $10 or $11 a year plus the cost of ink. Most people I know, lose more than that value of pens each year...AND the longer I own it the lower the cost per year. I am reminded of a guy who wrote of growing up poor and his mother scrimped and saved to buy the best shoes and clothing for him and his siblings and they all wore them for years. His mother always said they were too poor to wear cheap clothes that needed constant replacement.

 

YMMV,

 

Brian

 

You're right about the quality which ends up cheaper on the long term. Also perhaps the MB snob-appeal overtax was not yet in effect back then. What we mean by snob-appeal is a commonplace value of prestige for snobs, which will compel them to :

1) spend more to get that particular brand, in order to display the label.

2) Get that brand rather than another, because others are less recognized.

Snobs are looking for recognition/legitimization/superiority, a way to distinguish themselves from others. Just like punks or other subcultures, but based on expensive brandnames, initially of high quality, but which their consumption at any price makes usually decay.

Edited December 28, 2011 by JeanManuel

[wspohn]

You have good pens and you have good pens that are also snob material. Montblanc is the prime example. It is one of the best known, and the factory advertising is aimed at instilling the thought that it is the best of the best, even if that is not the case.

 

Montblanc make very good pens and many are bought and used by pen fans and appreciated for their writing quality. Many others are bought by the snob faction who care as much or more about what other people think of the things they own as they do about how those items actually work. I once met a guy with a Montblanc 149 in his pocket. When I asked if I could borrow it to take a note, he said he never used it - in fact he'd never inked it. He just carried it around as a badge of successful yuppiedom (my words, not his).

 

Takes all kinds. In watch terms, Rolex is an exact analogue - good watches, more expensive than others of comparable quality because of reputation, and attracts a huge snob contingent in addition to the people that just like them as good timekeepers..

[stefanv]

Perhaps the perfect indicator of the snobbishness of a pen (or watch) is whether or not there's a large market for fakes.