The difference between 14K and 21K of Sailor's FP

[VincentChou]

I am now searching my second workhorse.

My first one is Lamy Safari with F nib.

One of the candidates is Sailor 1911.

A Sailor's FP with 21K nib is much more expensive than the one with 14K nib.

And it's too hard for me to try a Sailor 1911 full size,

I think I need some suggestions or recommendations.

What is the differences between a 14K nib and a 21K nib (I am interested in a MF nib)?

21K nib is intuitively more soft, how about the smoothness??

Thanks a lot.

[jigesh]

...What is the differences between a 14K nib and a 21K nib (I am interested in a MF nib)?

21K nib is intuitively more soft, how about the smoothness??....

 

In my experience, none.

[Toulouse]

I have a number of Sailors and can't honestly tell the difference between the 14K and the 21K nibs. They all write smooth as silk and seem to be equally soft. Both are softer than the steel Lamy nibs.

[RLTodd]

Sailor tends to make stiff nibs, because that is what MOST (not everybody) people want these days..

 

 

 

Some people want more gold in the nib, some don't care.

 

The 1911 is a thicker bodied pen than the 1911M and the hold is therefore a little different.

 

Functionally there is no difference between one and the other.

 

Since, with proper care, the pen will last the owners life it is important to choose the one that feels most comfortable in the hand.

 

Myself, I readily adapted to the 1911M, but have not yet attained a comfortable hold on the 1911 (which MAY someday go on the block if I don't adapt to it or a relative doesn't want it.)

[dwong]

I remember reading a review here that somebody could not tell the difference when writing between the 1911m with 14kt nib and the Procolor 500 which uses a titanium nib and has the same body and dimensions as the 1911m, but at a fraction of the price. Has anyone experienced both the Procolor and the 21kt nibs...if there's no difference in writing feel between those two then the Procolor is definitely a great value for a pen.

[RLTodd]

I remember reading a review here that somebody could not tell the difference when writing between the 1911m with 14kt nib and the Procolor 500 which uses a titanium nib and has the same body and dimensions as the 1911m, but at a fraction of the price. Has anyone experienced both the Procolor and the 21kt nibs...if there's no difference in writing feel between those two then the Procolor is definitely a great value for a pen.

 

I would be supprised if a person would feel a difference between a 1911m and a Procolor as long as the same tech ground the tipping material. I would imagine the company would design the pens for the same degree of stiffness and flow. Compared to the 1911 the difference in hold should be noticed by most people.

 

I thought the Procolors were Stainless Steel nibs and limited to the Medium grind?

[Joe in Seattle]

No difference between the Sailor nibs; they're uniformly excellent

[Margana]

My experience with Sailor pens is limited to one 1911 and three Sapporos. The 1911 with the 21K fine nib gives very slightly. It isn't really flexible but soft. The Sapporo 14K nibs (EF, F, MF) are quite rigid in comparison. All are very smooth and well made.

 

The pen sizes are different though. The 1911 has a larger nib and barrel and works perfectly for me without posting. The Sapporo is slightly smaller in nib and barrel and is a bit undersized for my comfort. I have to adjust my grip but it's worth the effort to use the excellent nib.

[Phthalo]

I have more than a dozen Pro Gears, and I can't tell a difference. Pro Gears, regardless of nib alloy, are all perfectly rigid. All are stamped with a "H-" prefix, Sailor's code for "Hard" (H-F, H-MF etc.)

[Bruno Taut]

I must disagree.

 

In the Japanese market 14 K nibs come in one single size, what they call "Junior". 21 K gold nibs come in two sizes: "Junior" and "Senior".

 

The big 21 K nib is quite springy. In my testing, the M nib expanded from 0.40 to 1.10 mm. The MF, from 0.35 to 0.85 mm.

 

On the contrary, the Junior nib is indeed rigid: from 0.30 to 0.50 for the MF nib.

 

I have no data for the 14 K nibs. Nor of the differences in size between Junior and Senior. I only own a Junior 21 K.

 

The prices in Japan change accordingly: JPN Y12600 for the 14 K, JPN Y15750 for the Junior 21 K, and JPN Y21000 for the Senior 21 K. All for the 1911 model.

 

Size matters.

 

Iosepus

[gary-c]

I read somewhere that

 

H- means high quality nib

N- means Naginata Togi nib

[tanalasta]

I haven't tried the KoP nib.

 

However, the difference between the 14k and 21k in the standard line of Sailors are like splitting hairs. Both are smooth. Reasonably rigid although my 21k does have a bit of spring held at the write angle. The 21k has the more ornate nib engravings.

 

The main difference is that the pen with the 21k nib costs more than the 14k one! Both nibs are smooth and amongst the best nibs currently on the market that how you feel they are is quite subjective. I have more experience with the 21k and have only dip tested the 14k, although on several occasions and in different widths to get a feel of it.

[RLTodd]

I must disagree.

 

In the Japanese market 14 K nibs come in one single size, what they call "Junior". 21 K gold nibs come in two sizes: "Junior" and "Senior".

 

The big 21 K nib is quite springy. In my testing, the M nib expanded from 0.40 to 1.10 mm. The MF, from 0.35 to 0.85 mm.

 

On the contrary, the Junior nib is indeed rigid: from 0.30 to 0.50 for the MF nib.

 

I have no data for the 14 K nibs. Nor of the differences in size between Junior and Senior. I only own a Junior 21 K.

 

The prices in Japan change accordingly: JPN Y12600 for the 14 K, JPN Y15750 for the Junior 21 K, and JPN Y21000 for the Senior 21 K. All for the 1911 model.

 

Size matters.

 

Iosepus

 

I have heard they make many more models for the home market than they choose to import into the States. Since they ain't here I know nothing about them and it doesn't make much difference as I can't buy them. Not sure if that is important or not. If we never get to have it, we never know if we are missing someting or not.

 

I don't believe Sailor intended that anywhere near that amount of pressure for tine expansion be put on their nibs. There is a point of no return when flexing and I have a suspicion that the amount of pressure inferred, from those line widths, would void any waranty. My position untell someone official from Sailor speaks up on the issue. With the amount of pressure I put on both my 21k 1911 and 14k 1911m I get NO line width variation.

 

The price point issue may be why they don't import them into the States. Could ruin their market strategy.

[Bruno Taut]

I must disagree.

 

In the Japanese market 14 K nibs come in one single size, what they call "Junior". 21 K gold nibs come in two sizes: "Junior" and "Senior".

 

The big 21 K nib is quite springy. In my testing, the M nib expanded from 0.40 to 1.10 mm. The MF, from 0.35 to 0.85 mm.

 

On the contrary, the Junior nib is indeed rigid: from 0.30 to 0.50 for the MF nib.

 

I have no data for the 14 K nibs. Nor of the differences in size between Junior and Senior. I only own a Junior 21 K.

 

The prices in Japan change accordingly: JPN Y12600 for the 14 K, JPN Y15750 for the Junior 21 K, and JPN Y21000 for the Senior 21 K. All for the 1911 model.

 

Size matters.

 

Iosepus

 

I have heard they make many more models for the home market than they choose to import into the States. Since they ain't here I know nothing about them and it doesn't make much difference as I can't buy them. Not sure if that is important or not. If we never get to have it, we never know if we are missing someting or not.

 

I don't believe Sailor intended that anywhere near that amount of pressure for tine expansion be put on their nibs. There is a point of no return when flexing and I have a suspicion that the amount of pressure inferred, from those line widths, would void any waranty. My position untell someone official from Sailor speaks up on the issue. With the amount of pressure I put on both my 21k 1911 and 14k 1911m I get NO line width variation.

 

The price point issue may be why they don't import them into the States. Could ruin their market strategy.

 

It is perfectly natural to press that Senior 21 K nib. It is indeed springy and wet. The Senior nib is about 3 millimeters longer than the Junior nib (21 or 14 K).

 

Those are the catalog prices. You can find those pens for 20% to 30% less--in Tokyo.

 

Iosepus

[nicholasyeo]

Trust me, I feel that the Saporro's 14K is smoother than my Pro Gear's 21K.