"PdAG"?

[tknechtel]

On David Isaacson's site, some nibs on Snorkels are described as "PdAG." Does anyone know what this means? Thanks!

Tom

[bardharlock]

Palladium Silver.

[tknechtel]

Thanks!

 

[Pepin]

Thanks!

 

Silver core, palladium coated. Palladium is more expensive than gold. PdAg nibs were priced lower than the solid 14k nibs IIRC within the snorkel lineup.

[Roger W.]

Pepin;

 

Not quite sure where you get that...

 

Palladium is trading at $243 an once (are you thinking Platinum?). Also, the Sheaffer liturature says that the nib is Palladium, Silver and 14K gold. I believe it is an alloy as a silver core with a palladium plating doesn't make any sense.

 

Roger W.

[publius]

Silver core, palladium coated. Palladium is more expensive than gold. PdAg nibs were priced lower than the solid 14k nibs IIRC within the snorkel lineup.

No, an alloy of palladium & silver. Palladium only rose in price with the introduction of the automotive catalytic converter in the 1970s ; before that (&, indeed, now), it was generally substantially less costly than either platinum or gold. Today Pd is in the neighbourhood of $240, with gold at $925 & platinum at $1130.

The Sheaffer liturature says that the nib is Palladium, Silver and 14K gold.

Are you certain? This sounds like an error — perhaps the intent was that their nibs are made from palladium & silver & (others from) 14K gold. You could make 14K white gold with Pd & Ag as the alloys, but you wouldn't mark it palladium-silver, & it wouldn't be less expensive than the usual Au-Ag-Cu alloy family. Alloying something with 14K gold doesn't make any sense at all (like saying you've alloyed something with stainless steel — you might have added iron, chromium, & nickel in approximately the proportions 74-18-8, but that's all you've done). Edited July 8, 2009 by publius

[SincerelySpicy]

Silver core, palladium coated. Palladium is more expensive than gold....

 

You sure about that? Richard Binder's website states this:

 

"palladium silver ( abbreviated PdAg) A class of silver-colored binary alloys of palladium and silver, used to manufacture nibs from the 1940s to the 1970s as a less costly alternative to gold. As with gold, a higher silver content (up to about 40%) yields a softer alloy. See also palladium, silver."

 

Palladium Silver Alloys are not only used for fountain pen nibs and typically they will have a content of a maximum of 40% silver because with any more silver, the tarnish resistant properties would be lost.

Edited July 8, 2009 by SJM1123

[Tweel]

The Sheaffer liturature says that the nib is Palladium, Silver and 14K gold.

Are you certain? This sounds like an error — perhaps the intent was that their nibs are made from palladium & silver & (others from) 14K gold.

Maybe he's referring to their 2-tone nibs?

 

-- Brian

 

[Possum Hill]

Silver core, palladium coated. Palladium is more expensive than gold. PdAg nibs were priced lower than the solid 14k nibs IIRC within the snorkel lineup.

No, an alloy of palladium & silver. Palladium only rose in price with the introduction of the automotive catalytic converter in the 1970s ; before that (&, indeed, now), it was generally substantially less costly than either platinum or gold. Today Pd is in the neighbourhood of $240, with gold at $925 & platinum at $1130.

The Sheaffer liturature says that the nib is Palladium, Silver and 14K gold.

Are you certain? This sounds like an error — perhaps the intent was that their nibs are made from palladium & silver & (others from) 14K gold. You could make 14K white gold with Pd & Ag as the alloys, but you wouldn't mark it palladium-silver, & it wouldn't be less expensive than the usual Au-Ag-Cu alloy family. Alloying something with 14K gold doesn't make any sense at all (like saying you've alloyed something with stainless steel — you might have added iron, chromium, & nickel in approximately the proportions 74-18-8, but that's all you've done).

Some of Sheaffer's PdAg nibs are partly plated with gold. Perhaps that's the 14k gold Sheaffer ads mentioned.

[Ernst Bitterman]

I suspect that this is a case of mispunctuation. Sheaffer likely said something like "Points available in Palladium-Silver and Gold," meaning you could choose a Palladium-Silver point or a Gold point (a Statesman or a Valiant, in snorkel models). Sometimes the difference between a comma and a hyphen is VERY IMPORTANT.

 

I think the only gold-plated PdAg points were on the Target/Imperial III, and they were pretty quiet about that since you could easily mistake it for their usual two-tone treatment on a 14K point.

Edited July 8, 2009 by Ernst Bitterman

[tknechtel]

As always, the members of this site are an incredible fund of information!

 

[RLTodd]

some thoughts.......

 

1) Up to 1973 gold was fixed at $35/troy oz. AIR, until 1932?-1934? it was fixed at $28/troy oz.

 

2) During WW2 gold became a strategic material. I believe that was the start of the use of the PdAg alloy in nibs, which was continued on by Sheaffer for some time.

 

3) The gold content in the nib is so small that I believe the PdAg nibs were more of a marketing tool to fill a price point by Sheaffer than anything else.

 

4) The only reason gold is used behind the iridium or other alloy point is because it is (relatively) non corrosive and perceived as valuable by the buyer (pens started as a jeweler's product).

 

5) Since the engineers figured out how to make stainless steel non-corrosive enough, PdAg no longer makes marketing sense, and so is gone.

 

 

 

 

[DJJM19951998]

Palladium is an alloy of Platinum. It contains Platinum, mercury, nickel, and other metals. It is much cheaper than Platinum, and still looks nice. Some of my coin sets from the mint contain Palladium Coins.

[Ernst Bitterman]

Palladium is the 46th element on the peroid table, one of the Platinum Group.

 

http://www.chemicool.com/elements/palladium.html

Edited July 8, 2009 by Ernst Bitterman

[DJJM19951998]

Palladium is the 46th element on the peroid table, one of the Platinum Group.

Palladium is not an element.

[rogerb]

Palladium is NOT an 'alloy'....it is a metallic element (Pd) which can be 'mixed' with other metals, such as, in this instance silver, to form 'alloys'.

 

I have a Sheaffer PFM V which has been fitted with a PdAg nib-section, because the restorers couldn't find a gold one in the right colour. It writes just as well as my gold-nibbed PFM V

 

As has been said, Palladium was used instead of Gold in the WWII years due to gold's being of 'strategic value' (or words to that effect!).

[Roger W.]

While Palladium is not an alloy, the nib in question is. For Sheaffer snorkel nibs they are all silver colored and contain Palladium, silver and 14K gold in the mix - still remaining silver in color as white gold does. As far as Palladium being an element it is indeed 46th on the periodic chart. Who would have thunk that this could be controversial?

 

Roger W.

[publius]

Palladium is not an element.

It most assuredly is! Element Atomic Number 46, to be precise. I refer you to the Periodic Table of the Elements, column 10, row 5 ; or to the Chemical Rubber Company manual, or any text on chemistry. The name is taken from the statue of Pallas Athene at Troy, which when removed exposed the city to destruction.

The platinum group is composed of the six elements Ruthenium, Rhodium, Palladium, Osmium, Iridium, & Platinum, which lie in the two rows directly beneath Iron, Nickel, & Cobalt. Ru, Rh, & Pd (average atomic weights 101.07, 102.91, & 106.42) are referred to as "light" series, & Os, Ir, & Pt (190.23, 192.22, & 195.08) as the "heavy" series. The principal source of all is trace impurities in copper & nickel ores, although substantial quantities are produced from a few mines which appear to be of meteoric origin (as is, indeed, the famous nickel deposit at Sudbury).

 

It is certainly not an alloy containing mercury & nickel. Palladium used in coins, like platinum used in coins, is typically 995/1000 fine, with the impurities being mostly the other platinum-group metals, which are very difficult to refine out.

 

 

For Sheaffer snorkel nibs they are all silver colored and contain Palladium, silver and 14K gold in the mix - still remaining silver in color as white gold does.

Reference please! Not only is this metallurgically incomprehensible, it makes no economic sense. Edited July 8, 2009 by publius

[Roger W.]

Publius;

 

Glad to oblige. Taken directly from the 1955 catalogue -

 

http://www.sheafferflattops.com/images/Palladium1.jpg

 

As far as it making sense, Sheaffer had lots of 14K around maybe they felt it made a better alloy.

 

Roger W.

[publius]

OK, what they actually say is "sterling & 14K gold". This convinces me that whoever was writing that ad copy did not know what he was talking about at all. Sterling, after all, is silver alloyed with copper, 37 parts to 3, while 14K gold is usually alloyed with silver & copper. With that composition, you would be looking at a gold-silver-copper-palladium nib, which I suspect would not be suitable for a nib, or much of anything else. In other words, the whole text makes no sense whatsoever.

 

I very much suspect that the flack in charge of composing this particular bit of print, probably on Madison Avenue rather than in Fort Madison, was told that there were "palladium silver" and "14K gold" nibs, conflated the two types, & figured that silver=sterling.