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Conid Bulkfiller System


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#1 adim

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 09:49

Hi all!

 

Although I'm almost sure this has been discussed previously, I couldn't find the exact answer and furthermore, in some reviews I see conflicting claims. Hence I opened this discussion to try and clarify things for myself.

 

The question is: is the bulkfiller system in Conid pens similar to Visconti or other power fillers in what concerns the "secondary ink chamber"? I mean, will the ink flow stop if, when writing, one keeps the rod fully screwed in? Must the user unscrew the knob a little bit to let ink flow, as in the case of Visconti power fillers, eyedroppers and others that have a sealing mechanism? Or is it more similar to a regular piston filling system from this point of view?

 

I am considering ordering a Conid Kingsize and only recently started looking up reviews and I even heard Stephen Brown mentioning "the secondary ink chamber" and the seal the rod creates if fully screwed in.

 

Thank you for your attention! Happy holidays and an excellent 2019 for all!



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#2 eciton

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 10:27

Yes, if you have the top knob fully screwed in, the main ink chamber is sealed off from the nib, feed and secondary ink chamber, just like a Pilot 823 or other vac filler.



#3 Driften

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 18:16

Yes, if you have the top knob fully screwed in, the main ink chamber is sealed off from the nib, feed and secondary ink chamber, just like a Pilot 823 or other vac filler.

 

 

The Kingsize does not seal the main ink chamber from the nib and feed, just the main to the bulk chamber. Also the Conid design is not a vac filler. It's an advanced syringe filler. Look at the picture bellow and you can see the main ink chamber and the rod full screwed down.

 

The Pilot 823, TWSBI Vac's, PenBBS 456, Visconti power filler all seal the ink supply from the feed. The Visconti double power filler is more like the Conid where it has a main and secondary ink area.

Kingsize-CB112-B-1.jpg



#4 sketchstack

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 18:32

 ...I mean, will the ink flow stop if, when writing, one keeps the rod fully screwed in? Must the user unscrew the knob a little bit to let ink flow, as in the case of Visconti power fillers, eyedroppers and others that have a sealing mechanism?...


In short, the answer is “yes”.

1) If the rod is fully screwed in then it’s possible to use up all the ink in the secondary chamber while stil having lots of ink in the main chamber. Then you just unscrew the rod a little bit and allow more ink to fill the secondary chamber.

2) Writing with the knob slightly unscrewed can also encourage a slightly wetter ink flow and eliminates the need for #1.

3) The CAISO system is different, but is also not currently offered by Conid. The CAISO does not seal the secondary chamber when the cap is off. (And conversely re-seals when the cap is on.) So when the user removes the cap then the ink flows directly from the main chamber and into the secondary chamber. Again this is not offered by Conid currently —I’m only mentioning it for educational purposes :-)

The Kingsize is a great pen!

I like to write or make short videos about my fountain pens such as the Conid Bulkfiller or Pilot Urushi 845 BB:

 

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#5 adim

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 19:31

 

 

The Kingsize does not seal the main ink chamber from the nib and feed, just the main to the bulk chamber. Also the Conid design is not a vac filler. It's an advanced syringe filler. Look at the picture bellow and you can see the main ink chamber and the rod full screwed down.

 

The Pilot 823, TWSBI Vac's, PenBBS 456, Visconti power filler all seal the ink supply from the feed. The Visconti double power filler is more like the Conid where it has a main and secondary ink area.

 

Thanks. Maybe I wasn't explicit enough: as far as I can see from your picture and some others I've looked at, the rod fully screwed in does seal the main ink chamber (i.e. the majority of the barrel) to the secondary ink chamber, which is right above the threads of the cap. That's what I was thinking.

 

In short, the answer is “yes”.

1) If the rod is fully screwed in then it’s possible to use up all the ink in the secondary chamber while stil having lots of ink in the main chamber. Then you just unscrew the rod a little bit and allow more ink to fill the secondary chamber.

2) Writing with the knob slightly unscrewed can also encourage a slightly wetter ink flow and eliminates the need for #1.

3) The CAISO system is different, but is also not currently offered by Conid. The CAISO does not seal the secondary chamber when the cap is off. (And conversely re-seals when the cap is on.) So when the user removes the cap then the ink flows directly from the main chamber and into the secondary chamber. Again this is not offered by Conid currently —I’m only mentioning it for educational purposes :-)

The Kingsize is a great pen!

 

Thank you for the reply. I was not aware of the CAISO system, it looks interesting. As for the bulkfiller, I don't quite like it, honestly, to have to screw and unscrew the knob. I am aware of the advantages and the disadvantages of such a system and also that the secondary ink chamber could be big enough for a couple of pages of writing, so one doesn't have to fiddle with the knob literally every time they write, but still don't like the system. It's one of the reasons I haven't bought an Opus 88 or a Visconti powerfiller. I know that the ED and Visconti's system are totally different (between them and with respect to the bulkfiller), but still prefer a regular piston system any day...

 

Thanks for the info, nevertheless! I've learned something, most definitely!



#6 Karmachanic

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 20:35

 

 I don't quite like it, honestly, to have to screw and unscrew the knob.

One can open the knob 1.5mm and leave it that way. No need to close it, unless one is carrying it whilst engaged in vigorous activity, or flying. Works for me for both the Conid and Koloro.


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#7 Driften

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 20:52

 

Thanks. Maybe I wasn't explicit enough: as far as I can see from your picture and some others I've looked at, the rod fully screwed in does seal the main ink chamber (i.e. the majority of the barrel) to the secondary ink chamber, which is right above the threads of the cap. That's what I was thinking.

 

 

Which is a good thing. You have about 20% of a 3ml ink supply for writing. It's like being able to carrying ink refills with the pen. You won't have burping issues of a non-shutoff eyedropper filler, but still have most of an international short cartridge worth of ink to write with a refills a twist of a knob away.

 

To tell the truth having the knob slightly unscrewed on my Vac fillers is no big deal. It's not like you have to constantly unscrew the knob, just leave it backed off like Karmachanic said 99% of the time. The only time mine are screwed tight are for longer term storage, or if I took them for a trip.

 

Neil Gaiman signed about 2 million signatures with a Pilot 823 with a B nib on one tour. Do you think he was constantly screwing it open and shut? He went though bottles of ink. I expect the only time it was shut was on the plane between cities. 



#8 adim

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 07:49

Thank you all for the helpful replies, once again!

 

I'm not saying it's a bad thing and as I mentioned, I do understand the advantages that such as system and the shutoff valve have. But still I wouldn't say I like it, as a matter of preference. It's not that I find it tiresome or cumbersome to screw the knob ever so slightly once in a while. I just don't like it and knowing myself, I'm pretty sure that I will be distracted by the slightly unscrewed knob while writing. Been there, done that; every once in a while I get distracted by the shiny nibs or the ink around the engravings etc. Maybe I have a slight attention deficit or something like that, but I'm sure I won't like it.

 

Perhaps I'll buy an Opus 88 or something cheaper at some point to test myself...



#9 mauckcg

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 15:41

Thank you all for the helpful replies, once again!

 

I'm not saying it's a bad thing and as I mentioned, I do understand the advantages that such as system and the shutoff valve have. But still I wouldn't say I like it, as a matter of preference. It's not that I find it tiresome or cumbersome to screw the knob ever so slightly once in a while. I just don't like it and knowing myself, I'm pretty sure that I will be distracted by the slightly unscrewed knob while writing. Been there, done that; every once in a while I get distracted by the shiny nibs or the ink around the engravings etc. Maybe I have a slight attention deficit or something like that, but I'm sure I won't like it.

 

Perhaps I'll buy an Opus 88 or something cheaper at some point to test myself...

Nothing wrong with being distracted once in awhile.



#10 Driften

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 17:47

Thank you all for the helpful replies, once again!

 

I'm not saying it's a bad thing and as I mentioned, I do understand the advantages that such as system and the shutoff valve have. But still I wouldn't say I like it, as a matter of preference. It's not that I find it tiresome or cumbersome to screw the knob ever so slightly once in a while. I just don't like it and knowing myself, I'm pretty sure that I will be distracted by the slightly unscrewed knob while writing. Been there, done that; every once in a while I get distracted by the shiny nibs or the ink around the engravings etc. Maybe I have a slight attention deficit or something like that, but I'm sure I won't like it.

 

Perhaps I'll buy an Opus 88 or something cheaper at some point to test myself...

 

 

Or buy a PenBBS 355 which also has a bulk filler type of system for about $50. I don't think it has as big of a ink chamber near the nib, but it would give you an idea for less than an Opus 88 which is eyedropper only. Or the PenBBS 456  can be found for $32 is a nice Vac fill model. The 456 does need the knob slightly open to write. 



#11 adim

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 13:59

I have just found out from The Nibsmith that the Pilot Custom 823 has a removable rubber seal at the end of the rod that can be removed so that the seal is gone and you won't have to unscrew the end while writing.

Is this generally valid for most vacuum/bulkfillers/power fillers? Do you know whether it is true for the Visconti and Conid, for example?

See this clip, around 3.55, for reference:



#12 bogiesan

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 17:18

I’d call Conid to satisfy your curiosity. All I know about Conid is the two people I know who own one would never give them back. I doubt either will ever use another pen.
I ride a recumbent, I play go, I use Macintosh so of course I use a fountain pen.

#13 SpecTP

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 18:00

I have the Conid Kingsize Bulkfiller with CAISO. This does not have the 'secondary ink chamber' as you describe it. It's in every way a standard piston filler pen. You don't have to open up the filler in any way to start writing. The CAISO is simply a push rod that seals off the ink chamber when capped. thereby preventing ink from leaking out.



#14 Karmachanic

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 18:22

 All I know about Conid is the two people I know who own one would never give them back. I doubt either will ever use another pen.

 

I'm moving in this direction. If I don't buy any pens/nibs/ink/notebooks for four months I should be able to purchase a second Minimalistica. Those along with two matte black ebonite flat-top pens (one in hand and one on the way). Three Ti and two steel Conid nibs. Penvana!

Understated, a joy to hold and to write with, and calling no attention to themselves. Done.

 

Thanks for the push!


Edited by Karmachanic, 15 January 2019 - 18:23.

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#15 adim

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 20:08

Id call Conid to satisfy your curiosity. All I know about Conid is the two people I know who own one would never give them back. I doubt either will ever use another pen.


Thanks, that's actually a good idea. In fact, the question popped to me while I was randomly looking at various fp reviews and took it as another good thing I've learned, namely about the internals of a vacuum or something similar. Then I thought I've seen this before, in the Visconti 'power filler' and Conid's bulkfiller so I thought I'd ask.

Regarding the CAISO system, that also very interesting and another aspect that drew my attention. I'll be looking closer in ths direction.

#16 Karmachanic

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 20:46

Regarding the CAISO system, that also very interesting and another aspect that drew my attention. I'll be looking closer in ths direction.

 

My understanding is that CAISO is not currently in production. I just looked at the Kingsize product page and saw no mention of it.


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#17 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 21:08

We went through many decades since the cartridge took over with no new inventions.

I don't know when the Pilot 823 came in...or came in here. I can remember when the Visconti power fillier was brand new, and the Twsbi Vac....and the Conid................all (perhaps not the 823) with in the decade........well Richard had a bulb filler that didn't quite take off.

 

The Pilot 823, TWSBI Vac's, PenBBS 456, Visconti power filler, Conid. ...... :crybaby: .and I don't have a single one of them.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

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#18 Driften

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 21:17

We went through many decades since the cartridge took over with no new inventions.

I don't know when the Pilot 823 came in...or came in here. I can remember when the Visconti power fillier was brand new, and the Twsbi Vac....and the Conid................all (perhaps not the 823) with in the decade........well Richard had a bulb filler that didn't quite take off.

 

The Pilot 823, TWSBI Vac's, PenBBS 456, Visconti power filler, Conid. ...... :crybaby: .and I don't have a single one of them.

 

 

I would take the PenBBS 456 over the TWSBI Vac I find it a nicer pen for less money. I don't think it's as nice as my Pilot 823. Don't own a Conid, but have only heard good things about them. My incoming PenBBS 355 will be a cheep test of what a Conid is like, but not as advanced. I really don't know why I have so many high capacity pens when right now. With the amount I write a day it would take me six months to use up the ink in one of them.



#19 Karmachanic

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Posted 15 January 2019 - 21:43

I don't know when the Pilot 823 came in...or came in here. I can remember when the Visconti power fillier was brand new, and the Twsbi Vac....and the Conid................all (perhaps not the 823) with in the decade........well Richard had a bulb filler that didn't quite take off.

 

The Pilot 823, TWSBI Vac's, PenBBS 456, Visconti power filler, Conid. ...... :crybaby: .and I don't have a single one of them.

 

I think you deserve a Conid Minimalistica with a Ti nib! :D


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#20 Mew

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Posted 16 January 2019 - 07:26

We went through many decades since the cartridge took over with no new inventions.
I don't know when the Pilot 823 came in...or came in here. I can remember when the Visconti power fillier was brand new, and the Twsbi Vac....and the Conid................all (perhaps not the 823) with in the decade........well Richard had a bulb filler that didn't quite take off.
 
The Pilot 823, TWSBI Vac's, PenBBS 456, Visconti power filler, Conid. ...... :crybaby: .and I don't have a single one of them.


Pilot Custom 823 was launched 18 years ago. First 2 digits of the model number represent the year of pilot company in which the pen launched I.e 82nd year which was 18 years ago.






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