When asking about pen brands...

[KCat]

has anyone ever said...

 

"I'm looking for a new pen...but I want it to be scratchy."

 

[Leslie J.]

LOL! They seem to have that default though, don't they? I was upset that my Honey M400 came with a scratchy nib and bad flow. That's a first for me from Pelikan. I could have just sent in for a nib exchange, but you know how it is, not wanting your new bird to fly away so soon. I am very happy with it now that it has a Binderized nib.

[KCat]

in particular i get a giggle whenever someone starts asking for suggestions for a new pen and points out that they want it to be a smooth writer.

 

 

i dunno - sorta like saying "I want a new car - can you recommend a brand that has tires that spin?"

[Titivillus]

in particular i get a giggle whenever someone starts asking for suggestions for a new pen and points out that they want it to be a smooth writer.

 

 

i dunno - sorta like saying "I want a new car - can you recommend a brand that has tires that spin?"

Not to be contrary but there are some copperplate nibs that are just downright scratchy writers but they produce amazing line variation. Granted I am talking about nibs not fountain pens but if you start talking extra fine and book keepers/ needle point fine you have to give up some of the buttery smoothness just because there isn't as much room for the iridium on the tip.

 

 

Kurt H

[Keith with a capital K]

I think people confuse terms in that they may want a nib with "tooth" but only know how to describe that as a nib that is scratchy.

 

I cannot abide nibs that are too smooth and prefer nibs that give one a little feedback as it moves across the page. Overly smooth nibs also do not perform as well as slightly toothy nibs.

 

Cheers!

[Leslie J.]

"hack amateur newbie" Keith? I don't have very many smooth as butter nibs. Maybe my Esterbrook SJ, Lamy Vista 1.5 italic, and Rotring Art Pen. All without irridium, and smooth as can be, skating across paper.

 

I don't mind some tooth, indeed, all my Pelikans have custom nibs from sharp italics, obliques, cursive italics and stubs. Same with other pens I have. I enjoy the "experience" of writing with such nibs. But my 400 came with a flow problem, and scratchy does not really describe that.

[Keith with a capital K]

Leslie - Pelikan nibs aren't what they used to be and some are flawed from the get go... Chartpak is very good about taking care of these issues and if not I know this "hack" who knows how to remedy the flow problems with modern Pelikan nibs.

 

The problem lies in the shape of the nib and how it sits on the feed and in many cases the tipping is improperly polished causing a "baby bottom" effect.

 

The nib may even feel butterysmooth but they have a tendency to be hard starters and can be a little skippy. My new M200 had these issues when I got it and now it is quite the pleasing little pen to use.

 

Cheers!

[KCat]

I think people confuse terms in that they may want a nib with "tooth" but only know how to describe that as a nib that is scratchy.

 

I cannot abide nibs that are too smooth and prefer nibs that give one a little feedback as it moves across the page. Overly smooth nibs also do not perform as well as slightly toothy nibs.

 

Cheers!

yes, but these posts never read like that... like they are distinguishing between tooth and scratch and smooth.

 

in tooth - uh truth - i suppose early on I would have asked the same question though. just because I'd had enough experience with cheap, scratchy pens to assume that there were brands that rarely had that problem.

 

it wasn't until I was into the hobby a bit that I had any clue that people would *prefer* a pen that had tooth.

 

it wasn't until I was into it that someone reading one of my posts discovered that some people actually write *better* and more comfortably with an oblique nib.

 

so it's a learning experience all the way around.

 

but I still get a little giggle out of it.

 

I use "too smooth" nibs on not-smooth paper which resolves the control/feedback problem considerably. I like feedback as well - in fact have come to love a demi-oblique stub that has some corners on it rather just for that reason. it's still smoooooth - but gives interesting feedback...

[Leslie J.]

Chartpak is very good about taking care of these issues and if not I know this "hack" who knows how to remedy the flow problems with modern Pelikan nibs.

Actually, since I got the pen just before the Toronto show, I decided to have RB grind it there, into a stub. It was a F nib. I waffled between sending it to Chartpak or taking it to the show, but in the end decided I wanted an EF stub anyway, so the $40 I put into having it reground was worth it. It would have been the same price to regrind a replacement nib anyway. It has improved not gushy flow now. Not wet, not dry.

 

I think I do prefer some tooth. My favourite nibs all have tooth. The one that is most finicky is the Nayaka Koi F stub. It is an Eastern stub, thin verticals, wide horizontals. But it was made for my high angle of attack writing, and whereas a lot of other people had trouble with their nibs like this one (RB confirmed this for me at the show), that particular nib works great for me. The flex in it catches me offguard sometimes because of my writing style.

[Guest Denis Richard]

My taste definitely changed from smooth to toothy. The tooth almost forces you to add some character to your writing. I'm becoming uncomfortable with nibs that are really too smooth. I feel like they are writing ahead of me. I had that exact strange feeling with the MB Chopin I found and traded recently.

 

Plus, I like to hear the nib on the paper. It reminds me of those epic French films I used to watch as a kid, where some king would use his quill to write some dramatic orders to a valiant knight...

 

Denis.

[RSVP]

LOL! They seem to have that default though, don't they? I was upset that my Honey M400 came with a scratchy nib and bad flow. That's a first for me from Pelikan. I could have just sent in for a nib exchange, but you know how it is, not wanting your new bird to fly away so soon. I am very happy with it now that it has a Binderized nib.

My Honey M400 came with a scratchy nib... my San Fran is great...I think the feed keeps dislocating itself.

 

I think I might send it back to Pelikan to have a once over.

 

James

[Keith with a capital K]

Rimmer!

 

Good to see you!

 

The new Pelikan nibs (outsourced) aren't like the older Pelikan nibs and they can have a number of problems that make them rather unpoleasant writers.

 

Chartpak's service is top notch and they will make the pen right for you.

 

Cheers!

[KCat]

Is there a Chartpak equivalent in the UK? Or does James have to send it to Germany?

[Keith with a capital K]

I think that if James contacts Chartpak in the U.S. they can let him know what would be the most expeditious method to have his pen serviced and returned...

 

Being that he is already across the pond, Germany is a wee bit closer.

 

And you say that you're verbose... hah!

[Guest Denis Richard]

According to Pelikan web site, the UK distributor is Stone Marketing Limited.

 

http://www.stonegift.com

 

That should be the place to go...

 

Denis.

[Stylo]

I think people confuse terms in that they may want a nib with "tooth" but only know how to describe that as a nib that is scratchy.

I think we had some nice discussions about this on RS a while back ago . See for example RS discussion link

 

Most people call smooth a nib that slides effortlessly on paper. That is perfectly legitimate. But I also like to associate with smooth the feeling of sliding on paper withlout and jitteriness, scratchiness (cause by microvibrations?). There can still be resistance, but it is smooth resistance . For a good analogy of what I mean, think of a well damped volume control knob on a stereo. There is definitely resistance when you turn it, but boy does it feels smoooth. Then for contrast, think of draggin a stick on asphalt (it will make the stick jump and dance around). So what I associate with tooth is the feeling of resistance, but without too much jitteriness. What happens is that you end up fighting the resistance a little bit and you tend to "flick" your pen at the end of strokes, resulting in bolder looking handwriting. At least, thei is my spin on the subject

[KCat]

  For a good analogy of what I mean, think of a well damped volume control knob on a stereo.  There is definitely resistance when you turn it, but boy does it feels smoooth.  Then for contrast, think of draggin a stick on asphalt (it will make the stick jump and dance around).  So what I associate with tooth is the feeling of resistance, but without too much jitteriness.  What happens is that you end up fighting the resistance a little bit and you tend to "flick" your pen at the end of strokes, resulting in bolder looking handwriting.  At least, thei is my spin on the subject 

uh... shuuuuure stylo.

 

(dubious glance)

 

seriously, I do think I understand what you're saying. I equate it with my preference of a stub that is ultra-smooth - but has sharper corners more like an italic nib. there's a sense of feedback (though different from what you describe probably) there without the loss of smoothness.

[Guest Denis Richard]

  For a good analogy of what I mean, think of a well damped volume control knob on a stereo. 

 

uh... shuuuuure stylo.

 

(dubious glance)

What do you expect ? He's an EE.... (right ?)

[KCat]

What do you expect ? He's an EE.... (right ?) 

Those people are everywhere!

 

Hubby and I like to completely baffle each other with our respective professional languages. I have an advantage though - I worked with him for 3 years before going back to school. He, OTOH, hated and just barely got through his Biology 101 class some 30 years ago.

[RSVP]

I love Pel nibs, i notice they have an ever so slight stub (resistant but smoooth) ....unlike every MB I own. This feature is what's causing me to want more...I think they're just lovely.

 

PS Recurrant problem with White Tortoise is that section keeps unscrewing slightly (this hopefully accounts for the scratchiness )