Alcohol plus water-based ink = precipitate

[excarnate]

Like many I innocently thought alcohol might be a good cleaner for a pen. My wife, a research scientist immediately said "No!!". I asked why and instead of answering she said "Let's do an experiment!".

 

We took some Noodler's (bulletproof) black and put it in my Corelle 'lab' dish then added some Everclear 'lab' alcohol (95% pure). The results were immediate, fast changing, and difficult to photograph. Here they are and besides the damage alcohol might have on the components of the pens, it is clear that water-based ink, like driving, doesn't mix well with alcohol. Needless to say, you want to avoid this precipitate. The picture is between 1 to 2 inches wide (2.5-5 cm).

[HDoug]

This is your ink. This is your ink on alcohol. Yipes! Thanks for posting, especially for the spooky pic. Have to have a drink -- no wait! -- have to NOT have a drink!

 

Doug

[Ondina]

Correct. Alcohol is a coagulant of many solids in water based solutions. They will precipitate. But it works great on some ink stains on the skin...

[Deirdre]

So, don't let your pens be lushes. Got it.

[Shangas]

Holy Jesus!

[Goshzilla]

Actually, Noodler's Polar Black precipitates in regular water as well. If you place a drop of ink in a jar of water, shake it up really good and let it sit for a few hours, most of the dye will fall to the bottom.

 

However if you use the 10% ammonia 90% water solution, one drop of the same ink mixed really well in the solution will not drop to the bottom but stay suspended without precipitating for several days.

[JayLo]

Of all the ideas, I've never thought of mixing Everclear with ink.

Orange juice? ... YES!

[Rapt]

Good info!

[Dave S]

So what of all the posts recommending the use of alcohol to dissolve remaining oils from the manufacturing process in new pens?

 

Assuming no ink is present in the feed, what damage could be done to a C/C pen by cleaning with something a little weaker like rubbing alcohol?

[Ondina]

So what of all the posts recommending the use of alcohol to dissolve remaining oils from the manufacturing process in new pens?

 

Assuming no ink is present in the feed, what damage could be done to a C/C pen by cleaning with something a little weaker like rubbing alcohol?

 

 

Alcohol? No, the post talk about water or water with a drop of soap or ammonia.

[jbn10161]

Is the precipitate soluble in water?

 

This is more than a theoretical concern. I recently returned a new pen that had a problem. The seller tried out a replacement pen with a newly formulated ink that has turned out to stain some materials. He tried to eliminate the stain with a mixture of alcohol and water, per the instructions of the inkmaker. It's not clear--at least to me--whether the pen I wound up with is the pen that was stained or a different new pen. So the question is whether, if a precipitate had formed as a result of the alcohol bath, it has now dissolved because of the ink that has flowed through the feed and nib. (Or might the precipitate still be attached to the ebonite feed or elsewhere that the eye cannot see?)

[andru]

I wonder if precipitates formed with alcohol would be dissolved readily with aqueous ammonia. I believe one of the reasons ammonia is recommended for cleaning is that it complexes the dye (especially aniline and related aromatic polycycles). I've also noticed dramatic changes in the colour of ink when I begin rinsing with ammonia.

 

While on the subject of polycycles : JayLo : Which inks do you mix with your OJ? ....

 

As for Noodler's Polar Black, as very much as I want to use the stuff (Canadian eh?), it is nothing but trouble for me. I've only found one modern pen that will write with it without constant heavy pressure: Pelikan. I don't generally let it near my vintage pens. I can confirm that Polar Black gradually forms precipitates when mixed with other inks, such as Diamine Sepia.

 

-Andrew

 

P.S. After reading in the "Saturated inks Why" topic I find my choice of incompatibility example above rather hilarious.

Edited March 26, 2008 by andru