"US versus UK paper comparison of Quo Vadis Habana journals"

[biffybeans]

I'm confused.

 

I recently reviewed the new American made Quo Vadis Habana journal and it's a great journal with excellent quality Clairefontaine paper. (90g white) Clairefontaine paper is silky smooth, thick and probably one of the most fountain pen (ink) friendly papers around.

 

Per Karen Doherty, Marketing VP for Exaclair, Inc:

 

"The Habana notebooks sold now in the U.S.have been manufactured at our plant in Hamburg, NY. They are made with 90 g white Clairefontaine paper.

 

We decided we liked the ivory paper better with the Habana covers, and all the other Habana notebooks sold worldwide are also made with ivory paper - so, we decided to go forward with ivory paper. However, that paper also had to be PEFC certified (pefc.org).

 

The next generation of Habana notebooks will have 80 g PEFC paper. There is very little difference between 80 and 90 g paper. At our annual meeting in June, we spent a lot of time on the paper issue."

 

Hmmm. Okay.... So these new US made Habanas with the 90g Clairefontaine paper are going to be short lived. I believe Swisher Pens is currently stocking them so you might want to get them while you can.

 

I had read a comment somewhere from my friend Sophie, (who lives in Canada) that she has 2 Habana journals with very different paper. One was bought in Canada but made in the UK, and the other was purchased directly from the UK. She voiced a concern that the paper was not exactly what she had expected in the larger journal, and that the small journal had different paper - which she liked much better.

 

Sophie was kind enough to desecrate her journals and send me some pages to compare to the US version.

 

Let me fist say, that there is a world of difference between these three papers.

 

Of note - no inks featherd on ANY of the three.

 

Nothing bled through the white paper except some of my permanent markers. It's a thick, smooth paper that is a dream to write on.

 

The large ivory Habana paper? I don't like that it's ruled to the top of the page. I also don't like how small the ruled lines are. And the paper quality is awful. It's very thin and has a very odd feel to it. It's got a slightly rough surface, or "tooth" that I never, ever, want to write on again. Several of the inks tested bled through it, including the Diamine Imperial Blue, (not shown) the Noodler's Red Black, (ok - my Lamy 2000 is a bit of a wet writer on the downstroke,) the Noodler's Aircorp Blue-Black, the Private Reserve Arabian Rose, and the Noodler's Squeteague. I would never buy a journal that used this paper, and I'm really hoping that's not what's coming for the US Habanas.

 

Now the small Habana paper that's shown, It's smooth - not Clairefontaine smooth, but more like Moleskine. smooth. It's thin like the larger Habana paper, (and like Moleskine. paper) but NONE of the tested inks bled through it at all. I'm hoping this will be the paper that's going to be used in the new US Habanas. I would buy a journal with this paper, so I could use all my inks without the bleeding or feathering problems I've had with my Moleskines.

 

In conclusion, I'm still a bit perplexed why so much variance across the line. Why did they push out the white papered journal with such high-quality paper if they didn't intend on continuing to manufacture it? Perhaps it was an issue of cost - as Habanas aren't cheap to begin with.

 

Perhaps Karen can shed a little more light on the subject, as us fountain pen users are waiting with baited breath for a product that can truly kill off the much loved but inferior Moleskine.

 

PS - I prefer the ivory paper in the smaller journal.

 

I just received a response from Karen Doherty, the VP of marketing about the manufacturing differences between the Habana notebooks:

 

"I checked with both our France and Hamburg plants on Habana notebook product specifics. Here they are:

 

U.S. Made

 

- White paper

- Large notebook - 90 g paper

- Small notebook - 64 g paper

 

France Made

 

- Ivory paper

- Large notebook - 60 g paper

- Small notebook - 60 g paper

 

Later this fall, France will start making both the large and small Habana with 85 g paper

 

French notebooks also include a ribbon, and come in ruled, blank and graph. US-made will only come in ruled.

 

We will be making a decision soon whether or not to continue making Habana notebooks in our US plant, or import them from France. We have several factors we need to weigh as part of the decision:

 

1. Later this fall we will importing Rhodia's new Webnotebook, which comes with ivory paper. Do we need two bound notebooks with ivory paper?

 

2. Manufacturing in the US keeps US workers employed, our plant running at strong capacity, less exposure to future Euro exchange issues re: price.

 

3. Will consumers recognize the ivory paper as "Clairefontaine paper"? Or, are they accustomed to the "extra white, super smooth?"

 

4. Even though there are differences of opinion and taste on the ivory paper vs. white paper preference, white paper Habana notebooks are selling very briskly.

 

A lot to consider in the next few weeks.

 

Thank you very much for the seriousness and care in which you approached this issue. We certainly listen, and read all the comments."

 

Originally blogged with images and links here: http://biffybeans.blogspot.com/2008/09/us-...son-of-quo.html

[BillTheEditor]

Wow. Thanks for all that work.

 

I'm glad they aren't sourcing paper from China ...

 

'Scuse me now -- I need to go pay a visit to Chuck Swisher's shop.

Edited September 5, 2008 by BillTheEditor

[kookychick]

Yup, I stockpiled a few of the Habanas from the Swisher Labor Day sale in anticipation of the change! I love the bright white, super-smooth Clairefontaine paper, and will be very sad if they change to ivory. I write in brightly colored inks, and they won't show up as well on ivory!

 

At first, I thought maybe I'd change to the Rhodia Webnotebooks, but if they're going to have ivory paper, too, then that's not a suitable replacement for me! I'll probably go back to the Exacompta Journey notebooks, which appear to have the same paper as the (small) US Habanas have. The cover on the Journey is a bit more flexible than I'd like, but I love the bright white, super-smooth Clairefontaine paper with narrow ruled paper!

 

[kookychick]

Here's the Quo Vadis Blog, where they're taking an informal poll of which paper they should use in the Habana notebooks.

 

You can let them know of your preference (white or ivory, or both)--they seem to take answers on the blog pretty seriously!

[037]

Just wanting to know before I order from Swisher the US version paper. What is the line spacing on both the small and large journals? The French versions up here measures 6mm spacing, that couple with the thin paper, simply isn't a contenter with Peter Pauper, Ciaks or even Moleskines.

Also, the Swisher page mentioned only one weight,in your experience, are the paper the same thickness in both the small and large US versions?

 

I find the French paper available in Canada way too flimsy, to the point that it creases easily.It also has this insubstantial feel to it. While the ivory paper is smooth, and does not bleed through easily, the thiness of the paper allows the back page writing to be visible. The more annoying thing is how narrow the line spacing is. This put it in the category of a daytimer, not a large size desk top journal. As for the smaller one, I suspect that it'll be used on the go, and how do people actually put anything between those very narrow lines is totally beyond me...writing with a fountain pen for example, and not sitting by a desk.

The US paper, thicker and white is something I'd prefer and at this juncture, only available from the US, and may soon be discontinued.

Such a pity, its back to Peter Pauper and Ciaks.

[kookychick]

Sorry for the late reply--I've been swamped!

 

The small version US version (bright white Clairefontaine paper made in NY) has 5mm line spacing, according to my measurements. The paper is quite thin. I personally like the tight line spacing and thin paper, but that's my preference!

 

I just received a large US Habana--I haven't written in it yet, but the line spacing is 8mm. The paper feels thicker than the small version--bright white Clairefontaine paper made in NY, too. The paper feels more substantial, though.

 

Hope this helps!

[drifting]

The more annoying thing is how narrow the line spacing is.

 

Ah, but this is what I like about it (and Modo moleskines, for that matter): ivory pages and narrow rule! I've got both a large and a small lined Havana with the French paper purchased in Canada and I like them both (neither seems to have the strangely poor paper described here and elsewhere - is it limesally's 'defective' one we're talking about?). I don't want the bright-white Clairefontaine 8mm purple rule - that's what my A5 Age Bag clothbound notebooks are for! Though I wouldn't carp if it were white Clairefontaine with narrower rule. Different strokes...

 

I'm still a bit unclear as to what's happening. French made is going from 60 gsm (which is what I've got) to 85 gsm, and US made is going from 90 & 64 gsm to 80 gsm? Or they're still not entirely sure whether it'll be 80 vs 85, but French and US will be comparable? Or they're still not sure period?

 

It'll be interesting to see what they settle on.

 

Anyway, one thing I am sure of is that I'd like to get a hold of a Rhodia Webnotebook for comparison.

 

Ryan.

 

 

 

 

[kookychick]

I don't want the bright-white Clairefontaine 8mm purple rule - that's what my A5 Age Bag clothbound notebooks are for! Though I wouldn't carp if it were white Clairefontaine with narrower rule. Different strokes...

 

Just a minor clarification--the Clairefontaine paper in both the small and large Habanas made in the US have dark gray lines, not the typical purple Clairefontaine lines. Even though the purple is pretty, I prefer the gray, so it doesn't compete with the ink I'm using!

 

The Exacompta Journey notebooks seem to have the same paper as the Habana. Hopefully they won't change those, too, if they change the Habana--even though I like the relatively firm cover of the Habana better, I'll probably switch back to the Journey for the bright white paper, narrow rule, and gray lines! The Age Bag notebooks don't have an elastic closure, and the line spacing is too wide for me, so those aren't an alternative for me, personally.

[biffybeans]

Here's the clarification. Te French made Habanas are both going to 85g, and the US made are staying the same. The US were going to change to 80 if they were going to move production to France, which they are not. They are keeping it in the US and the paper weights will stay the same.

 

 

 

The more annoying thing is how narrow the line spacing is.

 

Ah, but this is what I like about it (and Modo moleskines, for that matter): ivory pages and narrow rule! I've got both a large and a small lined Havana with the French paper purchased in Canada and I like them both (neither seems to have the strangely poor paper described here and elsewhere - is it limesally's 'defective' one we're talking about?). I don't want the bright-white Clairefontaine 8mm purple rule - that's what my A5 Age Bag clothbound notebooks are for! Though I wouldn't carp if it were white Clairefontaine with narrower rule. Different strokes...

 

I'm still a bit unclear as to what's happening. French made is going from 60 gsm (which is what I've got) to 85 gsm, and US made is going from 90 & 64 gsm to 80 gsm? Or they're still not entirely sure whether it'll be 80 vs 85, but French and US will be comparable? Or they're still not sure period?

 

It'll be interesting to see what they settle on.

 

Anyway, one thing I am sure of is that I'd like to get a hold of a Rhodia Webnotebook for comparison.

 

Ryan.

 

[Jared]

I received the same response from Karen at Exaclair--due to customer response, they're keeping the white 90g Clairefontaine paper for the US versions. However, no bookmarks in the US version due to cost as they are placed on by hand.

 

 

[Ghost Plane]

Whew! Relief! I've gotten hooked on this paper and don't want to lose it. :blink: Guess we can live w/o the ribbons - with the elastic, I can throw my own ribbon in and pull the elastic 'round. It keeps things kind of stable and is a cheap alternative that looks better than paperclips.

[kookychick]

I'm relieved, too! :clap1: Back when they were considering changing it, I bought 1 in each color and 2 of the Robert Le Heros designs, just in case.... :embarrassed_smile: I love the paper in these notebooks, and the narrow rule is really appreciated--it makes my handwriting almost legible! I'd prefer a ribbon, too, but I'm using a pretty, decorative blotter sheet, and that's working pretty well so far!

[inkypete]

I'm relieved, too! :clap1: Back when they were considering changing it, I bought 1 in each color and 2 of the Robert Le Heros designs, just in case.... :embarrassed_smile: I love the paper in these notebooks, and the narrow rule is really appreciated--it makes my handwriting almost legible! I'd prefer a ribbon, too, but I'm using a pretty, decorative blotter sheet, and that's working pretty well so far!

 

 

My notebook of the year for 2008 - outstanding quality. Like you kooky I use a sheet of blotter as my bookmark. I can live without the ribbon bookmark if it means I get better paper quality.

[Aslan]

BB,

 

Great work! Thank you for keeping the rest of us informed.

[Ghost Plane]

I like the blotter paper as a bookmark too! :hmm1:

[biffybeans]

I think the confusion was due to whether or not they were going to continue US production.

 

These are great books with great paper, but remember that the paper weight is different in the large vs small. Small has some see through.