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Scratchy Sailor 1911!


gobi

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Kevin, I went through the same experience you did and it resolved itself. But first let me tell you why I purchased the Sailor(s). I was looking for the finest 'off-the-shelf' fountain pen nib and bought a Sailor desk pen with EF nib from jetpen for about $16. When I received that pen I dropped a Sailor black cartridge in it and began writing. It was amazing - the finest line I've ever seen from a fountain pen, writes on virtually any paper and is consistent and reliable - to say the least I was impressed. So I bought a Sailor 1911 large with a F nib AND a Sailor 1911 standard with EF nib such as you have. I figured the gold nibs should only do better. Out of the box neither one would write very well with the Sailor black cartridge provided. So I changed both to Noodler's anti-feather which helped a little but not much. Both were scratchy and disappointing and I could only write very slowly to get a uniform script. Surprisingly after a couple of days and repeated trials the Sailor 1911 F started to write like a real champ - hadn't changed a thing. The Sailor 1911 EF took about a week of repeated what I called 'exercises' to get it to write - its now one of my best. I would say that both write almost like butter now and I do not need to back-off on my hand pressure as I write with them as with any of my other pens. I don't know why it took this long. I believe that there is a slow chemical reaction occurring with the new feed and the finer the nib the more flow sensitive is the nib and only time will resolve the internal wetting. With time the feed is slowly getting more wet is my guess and I cannot explain it any other way. It also occurred again with a Sailor Young Profit with a EF nib which I purchased last week. But neither 1911 ever came close to the fine writing of the Sailor desk pen - I am still searching. My suggestion is to give it a week or so - use it everyday for about 20 minutes of so and then let it rest. Let me know how it works out for you. Also appreciate if anyone has experienced this 'break-in' time or can explain it.

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Kevin, I went through the same experience you did and it resolved itself. But first let me tell you why I purchased the Sailor(s). I was looking for the finest 'off-the-shelf' fountain pen nib and bought a Sailor desk pen with EF nib from jetpen for about $16. When I received that pen I dropped a Sailor black cartridge in it and began writing. It was amazing - the finest line I've ever seen from a fountain pen, writes on virtually any paper and is consistent and reliable - to say the least I was impressed. So I bought a Sailor 1911 large with a F nib AND a Sailor 1911 standard with EF nib such as you have. I figured the gold nibs should only do better. Out of the box neither one would write very well with the Sailor black cartridge provided. So I changed both to Noodler's anti-feather which helped a little but not much. Both were scratchy and disappointing and I could only write very slowly to get a uniform script. Surprisingly after a couple of days and repeated trials the Sailor 1911 F started to write like a real champ - hadn't changed a thing. The Sailor 1911 EF took about a week of repeated what I called 'exercises' to get it to write - its now one of my best. I would say that both write almost like butter now and I do not need to back-off on my hand pressure as I write with them as with any of my other pens. I don't know why it took this long. I believe that there is a slow chemical reaction occurring with the new feed and the finer the nib the more flow sensitive is the nib and only time will resolve the internal wetting. With time the feed is slowly getting more wet is my guess and I cannot explain it any other way. It also occurred again with a Sailor Young Profit with a EF nib which I purchased last week. But neither 1911 ever came close to the fine writing of the Sailor desk pen - I am still searching. My suggestion is to give it a week or so - use it everyday for about 20 minutes of so and then let it rest. Let me know how it works out for you. Also appreciate if anyone has experienced this 'break-in' time or can explain it.

My guess is that in that time, you were subconsciously adjusting to the pen. I would doubt "wear-in" is a factor, if that were the case you would think that nibs wouldn't last as long as they do.

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

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Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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Kevin, I went through the same experience you did and it resolved itself. But first let me tell you why I purchased the Sailor(s). I was looking for the finest 'off-the-shelf' fountain pen nib and bought a Sailor desk pen with EF nib from jetpen for about $16. When I received that pen I dropped a Sailor black cartridge in it and began writing. It was amazing - the finest line I've ever seen from a fountain pen, writes on virtually any paper and is consistent and reliable - to say the least I was impressed. So I bought a Sailor 1911 large with a F nib AND a Sailor 1911 standard with EF nib such as you have. I figured the gold nibs should only do better. Out of the box neither one would write very well with the Sailor black cartridge provided. So I changed both to Noodler's anti-feather which helped a little but not much. Both were scratchy and disappointing and I could only write very slowly to get a uniform script. Surprisingly after a couple of days and repeated trials the Sailor 1911 F started to write like a real champ - hadn't changed a thing. The Sailor 1911 EF took about a week of repeated what I called 'exercises' to get it to write - its now one of my best. I would say that both write almost like butter now and I do not need to back-off on my hand pressure as I write with them as with any of my other pens. I don't know why it took this long. I believe that there is a slow chemical reaction occurring with the new feed and the finer the nib the more flow sensitive is the nib and only time will resolve the internal wetting. With time the feed is slowly getting more wet is my guess and I cannot explain it any other way. It also occurred again with a Sailor Young Profit with a EF nib which I purchased last week. But neither 1911 ever came close to the fine writing of the Sailor desk pen - I am still searching. My suggestion is to give it a week or so - use it everyday for about 20 minutes of so and then let it rest. Let me know how it works out for you. Also appreciate if anyone has experienced this 'break-in' time or can explain it.

My guess is that in that time, you were subconsciously adjusting to the pen. I would doubt "wear-in" is a factor, if that were the case you would think that nibs wouldn't last as long as they do.

I agree that wear-in of the nib is not and cannot be a factor and I didn't mean to imply this. I'd be the first to admit that I'm not certain what the fluid-mechanics involved are. But I am certain that the effect is there. I've had four pens that were new that exhibited this phenomena and all in the last two months. All were relatively scratchy, wrote non-uniformly (I note especially on up-strokes) and the script was lighter than when the problem was resolved. I attribute this to less than adequate ink flow. I keep good writing samples of this each day for comparison. It could be increased wetting of the feed material with time, or it could be that the nib is mechanically adjusting to my hand, but whatever it is it is definitely there.

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A few gentle figure-eights on a sheet of 12000 Micro-Mesh will take care of any scratchiness. My Sailor 1911M H-M now writes buttery smooth. Good luck.

 

 

cuza

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If the tines are aligned properly, then the safest way to get your nib smoother by applying brown paper bag therapy.

Just draw figure eight a few times and also draw small circles on the bag. After every few minutes just check the smoothness as per your liking.

Hope it will help.

 

 

 

Regards,

Binod

"It's simple to be happy but difficult to be simple"

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It could be residual oil from manufacturing that is gradually being rinsed out. With new pens, you could try giving them a flush with dilute ammonia and a safe detergent solution.

These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives everything its value.--Thomas Paine, "The American Crisis", 1776

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If the tines are aligned properly, then the safest way to get your nib smoother by applying brown paper bag therapy.

Just draw figure eight a few times and also draw small circles on the bag. After every few minutes just check the smoothness as per your liking.

Hope it will help.

 

 

 

Regards,

Binod

 

 

OK, I have read this a number of times on this site yet I continue wondering about it.

 

So we are saying that a fountain pen nib which is tipped with a metal which is suppose to be hard enough to last for many, many years, possible a persons life time, will be rubbed smoother by a few seconds of contact with a brown paper bag?

 

Can anyone provide any empirical data at all to substantiate this claim? It just does not make sense to me.

 

Sorry to take things off on a tangent, but I suppose it is relevant.

Nakaya Aka-tamenuri Long Cigar, standard fine two tone nib/ Nakaya Aka-tamenuri Piccolo, soft medium stub in two tone/ Nakaya Aka-tamenuri Neo Standard, medium cursive italic/ Sailor Pro Gear fine/ Sailor Pro Gear medium cursive italic/ Pelikan M800 extra fine/ 1954 Monte Rosa medium left oblique/ Nakaya Naka-ai, medium left oblique, Heki-Tamenuri/Sailor Realo ll, medium left oblique/ Cross Townsend “Year Of The Rooster” medium/ Pilot Vanishing Point, fine.

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I think that some paper bags are sized with clay; the clay particles are abrasive, not the paper.

Currently using:Too many pens inked to list, I must cut back! :) I can guarantee there are flighters, urushi, and/or Sheaffer Vac-fillers in the mix!!!

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If the tines are aligned properly, then the safest way to get your nib smoother by applying brown paper bag therapy.

Just draw figure eight a few times and also draw small circles on the bag. After every few minutes just check the smoothness as per your liking.

Hope it will help.

 

 

 

Regards,

Binod

 

 

OK, I have read this a number of times on this site yet I continue wondering about it.

 

So we are saying that a fountain pen nib which is tipped with a metal which is suppose to be hard enough to last for many, many years, possible a persons life time, will be rubbed smoother by a few seconds of contact with a brown paper bag?

 

Can anyone provide any empirical data at all to substantiate this claim? It just does not make sense to me.

 

Sorry to take things off on a tangent, but I suppose it is relevant.

 

I'm sorry I don't have any data.But this is from my personal experience. I made my pilot fine nib and sailor fine nib smoother by this process.

"It's simple to be happy but difficult to be simple"

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  • 1 month later...

Hi,

 

I just bought a sailor 1911 14k medium...also scratchy compared with my cheap lamy al-star!

 

I couldn't decide between this and the lamy 2000 but went for sailor because of the 'butter-like' smoothness.... feeling a bit disappointed :mellow:

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PS - You know what, I think it's improving ?!!

 

Don't know if it's me or the pen ??

 

In the end, it doesn't matter whether it's you or the pen that changed. What matters is that you enjoy writing with it now! :)

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Never impatient me! Fingers crossed.

 

Anyway, I've got a feeling that once you like fountain pens all of a sudden you have 10+ and a large set of inks!!

 

Thanks :rolleyes:

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No, I think I have to face it - this pen is scratchy and hard work.

 

It's a relief to get back to the Lamy, I think I need to send it back...surely isn't meant to be like this! :unsure:

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ok I don't know if anyone's interested lol!

 

But just in case - this Sailor of mine only writes smoothly at about 30˚ angle, I have to hold it by the cap to achieve that and can't write properly! I have no idea why that would be (my pens are normally resting in the crook of my thumb). The seller will refund though which is great.

 

Bit of a dilemma now about what to replace it with...don't want the same thing to happen if I get another sailor...then i search Lamy 2000 and see lots of negatives, I love the look of that pen though!

 

Anyway, I'm talking to myself so I'll go lol! :rolleyes:

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Let me take my Sailor history.

 

My Sailor no 1, a full size 1911 with medium nib was purchased in a B&M store far away, so I didn't really test it until I came home. Turned out to be scratchy. Was promised a refund or an exchange, so I sent it back and expected a refund.

 

Sailor no 2, another full size 1911 was ordered online, as was Sailor no 3, a Sapporo Mini Slim with a medium nib aswell (from a different online retailer).

 

After a while, Number 1 came back exchanged for a well working medium. Number 2 arrived and turned out to be scratchier than I wanted. Number 3 was quite good but a bit dry.

 

For number 2 I sent it to a repairman who described it as:

 

The Sailor was a pig to sort out

 

Basically he disassebled and reassembled it a couple of times, and now it's not just good, it's super good!

 

For Sailor no 3, it's was a bit dry, but I DIY-fiddled a bit with spreading the tines, and now it works very well.

 

After that spree, I advertised number 1 on the classifieds section of FPN since it's a bit wierd to have two very identical pens.

 

And I purchased Sailor no 4, another fullsize 1911 with a fine nib. It writes wonderfully, although naturally the wider nibs feels a bit smoother. Japanese fine is very very very fine for my clumsy hands. :)

 

So, in conclusion: Most Sailors I purchased needed some adjustment of some sort before getting what I wanted. Now they all write fine, even if I have seen a little bit of the tentency that spareclaire describes - they write even more well when held at a lower angle to the paper than what is comfortable for me.

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Ah thanks for that lemanfan! I am really torn, I think it 'could' be great from what I have read, but I need a pen asap!

 

I just have normal sized female hands (!) they rest in the crook of my thumb so i couldn't hold the pen any lower, so the angle thing is odd! But that makes me concerned the Sailor is not for me - I need to go to a shop and try before I get one next time I think...no time to do that at the mo unfortunately (none nearby).

 

I will try again another time! Thanks :thumbup:

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Well, spareclaire, if you like the pen otherwise, you could consider doing what I did - sending a brand new pen off to a repairman. The person I used was UK based, if that's of interest, PM me and I'll give you the contact info.

 

One of the reasons for me doing this was that I purchased that pen from an ebay seller who was quite rude when I expressed concerns about the pen. He basically told me to sod off. Live and learn, and read return policies carefully! :)

 

But Sailors are not the only pens where I've not been entirely satisfied, so in the future I'll probably give more thought to either purchasing where I can test first (like B&M stores, which we have very few of in my country) or from sellers reputed to test pens before shipping and with a good return policy.

 

Personally, I really like the 1911:s, but would like them even more if they were a bit bigger. That probably pushes me into King of Pen territory, and then there are many seemingly fine options out there.

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Thanks lemanfan! I'm going to send this one back as the seller agreed and I need a pen quickly, but if I do get one in the future I will be prepared for the possibility of tinkering!!

 

I also think I might prefer a bigger pen, ahem !! ;)

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Same thing happened to me, and I ended up sending the pen to Michael Masuyama, who smoothed the nib nicely. These nibs seem tuned for smoothness only when the pen is held at close to a 45-degree angle. The nib I got was scratchy at other angles and especially on wide, sweeping strokes like the tails of the characters Y and g. I did not have the same problem with a naginata togi MF nib, which is usable at many angles.

These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives everything its value.--Thomas Paine, "The American Crisis", 1776

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