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Onoto 6233 plunger filler repair


Paul-in-SF

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I recently acquired this pen, and I find that the plunger filler does not draw up very much liquid, and it draws less each time I try it (I have been drawing and expelling water to try to clean out my first fill of ink in it). So I assume I need to refresh the vacuum seals, about which I have mostly theoretical knowledge, and nothing at all specifically about this pen. 

 

I assume I should remove the plunger filler from the back, and access the seals from there? I assume there is one or more O-rings that should be replaced? 

 

I really am fumbling in the dark, any and all help will be greatly appreciated. 

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  • Paul-in-SF

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Thank you, @Nethermark, that's way better than what I was hoping for. 

 

I love this place. 

 

edited to add: that store does not apparently ship to the US. I have sent them a message asking for any workaround or other solution. In a word, aarghh. 

 

edited again to add: the difficulty is connected to the cyber attack on Royal Mail, not to store policy or anything like that. I suppose it will be resolved at some point, and I realize I don't need to be in a hurry to fix this pen. "aarghh" rescinded. 

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I hope you can get what you need for the repair. It would be a good idea to disassemble the pen before you order parts. It sometimes turns out one needs more parts than expected...

 

 

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Hey Paul,

 

CPP will ship to the US and Canada if you email and ask, in my experience. Roger is a good guy, though a typical ironically grumpy Brit (as am I). You should also pick up a copy of the Onoto repair book, which I believe is £10.

 

There's a few things to be aware of. The washers for the end of the rod come in different sizes, and to get the right amount of suck you need the right size. Hopefully CPP can confirm the most likely size for a 5601.

 

Pay attention to threading; a few threads are left hand.

 

You'll need to make up a tool to knock out the hard rubber pins that prevent things from unthreading in use. Worth buying new pins from CPP so you have them on hand and don't need to re-order. The parts need to be threaded together exactly the right amount before the pin is inserted, but it's easy to see.

 

Watch for corrosion of the plunger rod. It seems, in my experience, to be less common than with Sheaffers, but still an issue from time to time. The plunger shaft may break level with the inner face of the knob, which is a real pain.

 

The back seal is cork and is fiddly! In my experience this seal can be a problem to get spot on (tightening a disk pre-tensions it, altering its fit to the shaft slightly). Some restorers use rubber o-rings here, which last a lot longer than cork. If you go with cork (which is not at all difficult to do) you'll have to think through the whole "store it wet or dry or . . ."

 

Having said all this, nothing sounds as good as "pop" of any nicely restored plunger filler!

 

Good luck,

 

Ralf

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Thanks @ralfstc, I did email to the store and Roger answered, not grumpy that I could tell, and he is the one who asked me to wait until the Royal Mail situation is resolved before he would ship to the US. Thanks for the tip on the book, I didn't know there was such a thing. They don't seem to have it at CPP (at least I can't find it) do you have an idea where else I might find one for sale? Richard Binder's site seems pretty good, but I always like to get a second opinion. 

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The Onoto repair book can be bought here:

 

https://www.penpractice.com/

 

https://vintagepensacsandparts.com/collections/pen-pencil-repair-reference-books

 

https://pentooling.com/books.html

 

I just thought it might be a bit much to buy the book for just one repair.

 

At these sites you can also buy the pen repair book by Marshall and Oldfield (co-authors on the Onoto book) that covers many more brands and models.

 

10 hours ago, ralfstc said:

The washers for the end of the rod come in different sizes, and to get the right amount of suck you need the right size. Hopefully CPP can confirm the most likely size for a 5601.

In his pen identification chart, Rogers shows that for the 6233, you need a 7.65 washer: https://www.custompenparts.co.uk/gb/content/7-onoto-model-identification However, I would also buy the 7.8 washer, as the 7.65 sometimes turns out to be too small.

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On 1/23/2023 at 12:46 AM, Nethermark said:

I just thought it might be a bit much to buy the book for just one repair.

 

 

You're right, I didn't buy the book, Richard's instructions seem to be all I need. On receipt of an order of assorted sizes of music wire (at least 100 times what I needed plus a lot of sizes I don't need, I wonder what other uses I can find for it) I was able to punch out the blind cap pin and disassemble the pen the rest of the way, cleaning out the old cork. Also, I was able to order parts from CPP starting today, so I did so. I hope I can get the parts onto the inside end of the shaft in correct order, unfortunately Richard's demo was with an older model that looks a little different. He has verbal instructions for my pen but no photos, I'll have to rely on very careful reading and the cutaway drawing. Thanks again all for the help, I will report back when I have successfully finished the repair. 

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Hi folks,

 

I would like to publicly apologize for suggesting Roger of CPP was grumpy. It was meant as an ironic and silly comment, but I appreciate it does not read that way. I have had nothing but excellent interactions with Roger and really appreciate the work he does.

 

Thanks,

 

Ralf

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 1/23/2023 at 12:46 AM, Nethermark said:

In his pen identification chart, Rogers shows that for the 6233, you need a 7.65 washer: https://www.custompenparts.co.uk/gb/content/7-onoto-model-identification However, I would also buy the 7.8 washer, as the 7.65 sometimes turns out to be too small.

 

I did not follow this advice; regarding the washer size, I couldn't tell whether the size that was in it was the right size or not. Now that I have re-assembled with the new washer (same apparent size) I am not getting a pop when I push in (except once in a while, when the section is off, but the rest of the time it's a bloop), and I am not getting any liquid into the barrel. Therefore I assume the washer is too small, and I am going to order the larger size now to see if that works. Binder says that a too-large washer will be hard to pull back, but he doesn't say it won't fill. 

 

Any further advice on this repair gratefully received. I managed to get through all the steps, I think correctly, so this result is disappointing. 

 

edited to add: I just realized that I am missing the tiny washer that sits behind the gasket, and that is probably the root of the problem. I bought a repair kit that was supposed to have a washer in it, but I wasn't looking for it specifically before I opened the little plastic container, and either it didn't have one or I somehow lost it. I am working on an empty white desk, so I'm not sure how I could have lost it. So I had to order some. 

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4 hours ago, Paul-in-SF said:

I just realized that I am missing the tiny washer that sits behind the gasket, and that is probably the root of the problem. I bought a repair kit that was supposed to have a washer in it, but I wasn't looking for it specifically before I opened the little plastic container, and either it didn't have one or I somehow lost it. I am working on an empty white desk, so I'm not sure how I could have lost it. So I had to order some.

If it’s any reassurance, I can tell you, you’re not the first one to have them, or some of the other repair items for Onotos disappear. I tend to keep a small stock of this stuff, just in case

 

I hope you also ordered some of the bigger gaskets while you were at it…

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Frankly, I'm not sure this whole effort is worth it to me. The barrel is so slender that it is not particularly comfortable for me to write with. At this point I suspect I'm repairing it only so I can sell it on with a clear conscience. I mean, I thought some Sheaffer fillers were fussy to fix, but this blows them out of the water entirely. 

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I like 6233s 🙂

 

Some seals need a backing washer, some don't. If you need one, you need one. (Friday circularity, you're welcome).

 

Did you use any grease or anything on the plunger rod? I find that's sometimes harder to get right than the rubber seal.

 

Cheers,

 

R.

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44 minutes ago, ralfstc said:

Did you use any grease or anything on the plunger rod? I find that's sometimes harder to get right than the rubber seal.

 

The cork seal came pre-soaked in what I assume was silicone oil, and that seemed to be enough to allow the rod to move freely. 

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15 hours ago, Paul-in-SF said:

 I mean, I thought some Sheaffer fillers were fussy to fix, but this blows them out of the water entirely. 

😋 I repair/service between 100-150 Onoto plunger fill pens a year, after the first few in my early days, they are a joy to work on. The delrin washer to the rear of the plunger piston head is not always required, as the there is a groove(needs cleaned out of old ossified washer) in the back of the plunger head that the washer "step" sits in. If these are not positioned correctly the problems you are having will be experienced. On occasion the plunger cone interferes and stops the pen filling and has to be reduced to fill.

In the UK I probably repair/service more Sheaffer vac fill pens than anyone else, I am also the only person that correctly repairs Wahl vac fill pens in the UK. I made back end seals/plugs for the conical nib Sheaffer pens, as even with the correct tools the nibs can be extremely difficult to remove with the collar. I like the challenge of these pens, but Onoto's are a "guilty pleasure" to work on.

eckiethump

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge (Charles Darwin)

http://www.wesonline.org.uk/

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Thank you for your perspective. It doesn't seem that way to me as a beginner, but I'm sure once you master the tricks of getting those little pins back in place, the rest of it is a slam dunk. 

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  • 1 month later...

Well, I finally got around to putting this pen back together, including the little tiny white piece of plastic in the form of a backing washer (that I missed the first time and had to send away to the UK for), and this time I got the satisfying pop at the end. So it's all inked and writing, and maybe I will keep it after all. 

 

Thanks everyone for all your help. Having ordered five sets of repair stuff for these pens, and having taken it apart and put it back together twice, I feel able to try again, should the occasion arise. 

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38 minutes ago, Paul-in-SF said:

Well, I finally got around to putting this pen back together, including the little tiny white piece of plastic in the form of a backing washer (that I missed the first time and had to send away to the UK for), and this time I got the satisfying pop at the end. So it's all inked and writing, and maybe I will keep it after all. 

 

Thanks everyone for all your help. Having ordered five sets of repair stuff for these pens, and having taken it apart and put it back together twice, I feel able to try again, should the occasion arise. 

Being now familiar with right and left hand threads of the parts to these pens and with Custom Pen Parts seals, you'll be looking for these pens to service :-) They are the most fun to do, mechanically , without having to wait for thing to "cure",as wit Sheaffer closure washers.

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge (Charles Darwin)

http://www.wesonline.org.uk/

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On 4/9/2023 at 10:10 PM, eckiethump said:

you'll be looking for these pens to service 🙂 They are the most fun to do, mechanically

I allways enjoy repairing Onotos. These are very good quality pens and with the parts from Custom Pen Parts, repair in most cases is not too difficult. Just hearing that pop when finished is pure satisfaction.

 

Unfortunately, Brexit has made Onotos rather expensive my side of the channel

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