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Pilot is finally doing pigmented fountain pen inks


khalameet

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Hello,

 

I don't know who else was waiting for them, but I always found it odd that both Platinum and Sailor have pigmented offerings out there and Pilot does not. You could argue that their standard range is somewhat permanent, but now they seem to get their feet into permanent terrain. Found this on reddit:

 

Can't wait for the first experiences! Being a big fan of Pilot pens and inks I think I will get the blue black one.

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Thank you! 

Here is a translation of the description:

Fountain pen pigment ink strong color (TSUWAIRO) that is hard to bleed even if applied to water and resistant to light appeared.

Please use CON-40 or CON-70N as a converter.
It cannot be used for lacquer products (including makie products), screw type, plunger type, and justus 95.
Item number: INK-30TW
Item name: Pigment ink 30ml
Specifications: The lid is resin, the main body is glass, capacity: 30ml

 

They now also have a cleaning solution: Pilot Fountain Pen Cleaning Set FOS-5S Neck Cleaning.

For what it's worth.

 

Or here:

 


Please be sure to check the following precautions.
※Please do not mix even if it is the same color.
※Please flip the bottle up and down 4 to 5 times before using it.
※If you do not use it for a while or change the ink color, please clean the nib and neck axis well with a special cleaning solution. ( Cleaning solution is sold separately) 
Click here for cleaning set (cleaning solution) ⇒
※Please note that it may not fall off if it sticks to clothes.
※Please do not put it within the reach of infants.
※Please do not place it in direct sunlight or hot places.
※Please do not use it for anything other than the pilot's products.

※It cannot be used for lacquer products (including makie products), fountain pens dedicated to inhalation (S type and P type), and Justus 95.
※Please use CON-40 or CON-70N as a converter.
※The ink is easy to evaporate, so please close the cap properly after use.
※If you accidentally swallow the ink, please consult your doctor after taking measures such as making them drink water, and if you get into your eyes, please rinse it off with water.
Product code: ink-30tw
Price: 1,100 yen (tax included)

 

 

 

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18 minutes ago, nibtip said:

Here is a translation of the description:

 

Thank you!

 

I love the long list of precautions, straight from the horse's mouth, so that consumers (especially fans of Pilot pens) have been duly warned and therefore should not have any recourse if they ignore the official advisory. It's a good thing that the CON-40 converter is so commonplace (and relatively cheap) and can be used in pens that accommodate the CON-70 converters, so owners of the Pilot Custom Heritage 91, Custom Kaede, Custom 743, etc. who bought theirs before the CON-70N was introduced need not fork out for pricier new converters.

 

I think I'll stick to using Platinum Carbon Black in my Pilot ‘Hannya Shingyo’ (which has a lacquer/maki-e finish, and an old CON-70 converter) if using a Japanese pigment ink of whichever brand is going to void warranty anyway.

 

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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2 hours ago, nibtip said:


※It cannot be used for lacquer products (including makie products), fountain pens dedicated to inhalation (S type and P type), and Justus 95.

Okay, I'll bite. Just what exactly does "pens dedicated to inhalation" mean?  

(I'm also somewhat skeptical about the "use our special cleaning product" bit because I've NEVER had trouble with flushing other pigmented inks.....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

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1 hour ago, sketchstack said:

I also noticed an ink on their site that I’ve personally never seen before: https://www.pilot.co.jp/products/pen/fountain/ink/ink_30_stock/

 

Based on some auto-translation, it’s a permanent ink to be used in dip pens. India ink? 

 

“※ It can't be used for fountain pens and desk pens. If you use it for other purposes, there may be a problem.”

I haven't looked at the website, but that might be my guess (i.e., that it's India ink...).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

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55 minutes ago, inkstainedruth said:

Just what exactly does "pens dedicated to inhalation" mean?

 

Pens with integrated filling mechanisms (that suck ink into the reservoir, cf. ‘inhale’).

 

54 minutes ago, inkstainedruth said:

I'm also somewhat skeptical about the "use our special cleaning product" bit because I've NEVER had trouble with flushing other pigmented inks

 

To be fair, Rohrer & Klingner also sells a pen cleaning solution that it markets as being useful in dealing with its SketchINK line of pigment inks.

 

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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42 minutes ago, lgsoltek said:

These inks sound really high maintenance.

 

I think, effectively, the message is that the particles can easily settle and stick, and the ink can clog intricate/precision moving parts, including the nib softness control mechanism in the Justus 95. That's why Pilot is recommending that only converters with agitators are used. Someone on reddit ventured, ”May as well just sell the ink in cartridges”; but if Pilot doesn't, then I'd take it as further supporting the hypothesis, as Pilot ink cartridges lack the metal ball stopper-cum-agitator found in Platinum ink cartridges.

 

More concerning to me is what chemical might be in the composition of the solvent that may be apt to damage urushi/lacquers used in Pilot's high-end pen models.

 

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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41 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

Pens with integrated filling mechanisms (that suck ink into the reservoir, cf. ‘inhale’).

But that sounds like MOST fill systems with the exception of eyedroppers.  I mean, even converters pull ink up through the feed....

Do you mean something like a blow filler systems or Vac fillers?  Or something else entirely like areometric pens or that style of converter?

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

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1 minute ago, inkstainedruth said:

But that sounds like MOST fill systems with the exception of eyedroppers.  I mean, even converters pull ink up through the feed....

 

But converters are consumables that can be easily ordered and replaced by pen owners in self-service. I think what Pilot is saying is that it won't repair a Custom Heritage 92 or Custom 823 for you, if the ink ends up clogging the filling mechanism, such that you can't move the piston and/or damage that when trying to force it. If the rotary-driven piston in a CON-40 converter stops working eventually through use of these pigment inks, Pilot will probably just tell you to buy a new one, as the easily replaceable part is subject to wear and tear anyway. (Or, if you're in Japan, the company may just send you a new converter to appease and squelch the complaint, because it's economical and painless to Pilot to do so.)

 

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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Overall my guess is the cautionary warnings are more for the benefit of Pilot than the user. They absolve themselves of responsibility if someone allows a pigmented ink to dry out in a $9K Namiki.

 

Pigmented inks are oft discussed in terms of maintenance, and I understand why. That said I’ve never once seen someone describe a fountain pen ruined by pigmented inks. That’s not to say it has never happened —but it does not seem like a common real world issue. 

 

(India inks are another story…)

 

 

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4 hours ago, sketchstack said:

India ink

Yes, correct. India ink.

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2 hours ago, inkstainedruth said:

"pens dedicated to inhalation"

Piston filler 🙂

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57 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

But converters are consumables that can be easily ordered and replaced by pen owners in self-service. I think what Pilot is saying is that it won't repair a Custom Heritage 92 or Custom 823 for you, if the ink ends up clogging the filling mechanism, such that you can't move the piston and/or damage that when trying to force it. If the rotary-driven piston in a CON-40 converter stops working eventually through use of these pigment inks, Pilot will probably just tell you to buy a new one, as the easily replaceable part is subject to wear and tear anyway. (Or, if you're in Japan, the company may just send you a new converter to appease and squelch the complaint, because it's economical and painless to Pilot to do so.)

 

Sure, and if the converters were $3-5 US I'd buy that claim that they are "consumables".  But for the most part they AREN'T.  I did a quick Google search to price Con-40 converters and they're MORE than that (before sales tax and shipping) -- and aren't YOU the one who is always complaining about how expensive to order things to be shipped to where you live?  And since I *don't* live in Japan, the odds of me being sent a replacement to shut me up are pretty much "slim" and "none".

I did have to replace the Con-B converter on my first Metropolitan, because I didn't realize that some vintage blue-black (presumably iron gall) ink had gone bad.  Fortunately the ink was only a buck at a booth at an antiques mall, an hour or so northeast of me, and I didn't feel bad about pitching it.  But at the same time I *don't* have the sort of disposable income that you apparently have (yeah, I ALSO just priced a Custom 823 -- and for that sort of price I'm going to buy a Pelikan because I like piston fillers better; the only vacuum filler I have is the TWSBI Vac 700 Iris, and I'm not 100% sold on the mechanism -- but it cost less than a THIRD of what a Custom 823 does.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

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1 hour ago, inkstainedruth said:

and aren't YOU the one who is always complaining about how expensive to order things to be shipped to where you live?

 

Yes, and that's why I prefer not to buy from American retailers — except Amazon, by way of Amazon.com.au.

 

The shipping cost of a product — whether that's a ream of paper, a (say, one-litre) bottle of ink, or a replacement converter — has no part in defining whether it is categorically a consumable. Replaceable filters for my Brita water jug, and branded descaling solution from my espresso machine brand's manufacturer, etc. that need to be replaced periodically aren't cheap; yet they are still consumables by the nature of those products.

 

Furthermore, there is no implication that it would be economical to order one unit of a consumable product at a time as required, instead of source ten or a hundred units at once to make the average out-of-pocket cost of acquisition per unit more palatable, with the trade-off of having to commit to a greater spend upfront at once.

 

I checked just now, and there's a ships-from-Amazon offer on Amazon AU for a 5-pack of Pilot CON-40 converters for A$43.99, inclusive of 10% GST and free Prime One-Day shipping. That works out to A$8.80, which is a little under US$6.50, per unit. Bookbinders Design in Australia is selling individual units for A$7.60 (US$5.60) each, incl. tax before shipping; and there is a free shipping offer to AU and NZ, once the qualifying threshold is reached.

 

1 hour ago, inkstainedruth said:

And since I *don't* live in Japan, the odds of me being sent a replacement to shut me up are pretty much "slim" and "none".

 

Well, your perspective as a US consumer simply cannot be considered to be Pilot's perspective, or my perspective, or the typical/representative fountain pen hobbyist's perspective. Maybe Pilot won't even officially distribute its new pigment inks to retailers in the US via Pilot Corporation of America, in which case our argument would be moot. It's not as if Pilot does not have a track record of excluding entire Western regional markets such as Australia, UK, Europe, and North America from getting certain fine writing products and paraphernalia; China seems to be where Pilot cares most about, as far as regional markets go.

 

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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5 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

I checked just now, and there's a ships-from-Amazon offer on Amazon AU for a 5-pack of Pilot CON-40 converters for A$43.99, inclusive of 10% GST and free Prime One-Day shipping. That works out to A$8.80, which is a little under US$6.50, per unit. Bookbinders Design in Australia is selling individual units for A$7.60 (US$5.60) each, incl. tax before shipping; and there is a free shipping offer to AU and NZ, once the qualifying threshold is reached.

 

 

Well, your perspective as a US consumer simply cannot be considered to be Pilot's perspective, or my perspective, or the average global fountain pen hobbyist's perspective. Maybe Pilot won't even officially distribute its new pigment inks to retailers in the US via Pilot Corporation of America, in which case our argument would be moot. It's not as if Pilot does not have a track record of excluding significant regional markets such as Europe, UK, and North America from getting certain fine writing products and paraphernalia; China seems to be where Pilot cares most about, as far as regional markets go.

Well, I don't NEED to be buying backup 5 packs of Con-40s -- I go on the assumption that they should last some *reasonable* length of time and that I shouldn't have to replace them all at once -- or that they will fail after a short amount of time.  Does that make me a "bad" consumer?  No -- just a practical one, from my perspective; and given my experiences with PilotUSA and Pilot's "marketing decisions" I don't actually give a rat's ass about THEIR perspective at this point... Shrug.  Too many companies (Pilot included) seem to be of the opinion that "What we give you is what you should of *course* want" and then seem shocked and amazed when the customers disagree and say things like "But why DON'T you sell the *other four* 'standard' Decimo colors in the US?  Not every guy might want a full size VP, and not every woman wants the 'girly' colors of Decimos....  And why SHOULD I pay the US distributor markup when I can get the color I DO want from a Japanese seller on eBay and pay less overall -- even with economy airmail shipping?  Is it MY fault that *you* have stupee 'marketing decisions'?  No it isn't -- and you have only your marketing department to blame...."

I just counted how many Pilot pens I have (not counting the the two Varsities) plus the used Vanishing Point I gave my husband for which we have Con-40 converters and the TOTAL is five (six if you count the original Decimo, which I lost :().  Plus Con-B converters in the two Metropolitans and the pen that someone on FPN ID'd as a Pilot Saturn (apparently made in Korea for the Korean market -- a pen for which I couldn't even get information about from PilotUSA, BTW -- but for which I paid MORE for repairs than I did for the pen itself (found it in an antiques store about 3-1/2 years ago for ten bucks US plus sales tax).  

Of course, if Pilot decides that the way to improve their bottom line and sell junk converters which HAVE to be replaced more often, that will just bite them on the (bleep) in the long run because then people will be complaining about how the quality of their products has gone down (look what has largely happened with Parker, which is now basically just an imprint for Newell-Rubbermaid), and the arguments on here as to whether or not the "reboot" Parker 51s are worth buying or not....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

 

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

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7 hours ago, sketchstack said:

I also noticed an ink on their site that I’ve personally never seen before: https://www.pilot.co.jp/products/pen/fountain/ink/ink_30_stock/

 

Based on some auto-translation, it’s a permanent ink to be used in dip pens. India ink? 

 

“※ It can't be used for fountain pens and desk pens. If you use it for other purposes, there may be a problem.”

At first I thought that this is the drawing ink they were selling for years. The drawing ink is specifically marketed as dip pen ink only, but the label on this bottle looks different...

 

I am also a bit worried that these new inks are not as fuzz free as Sailor's inks. I would like to use them in my high end Pilot pens but with all these precautions I am a bit reluctant. I hope that the inks are as easy to use as SouBoku for example. I wonder if they will also offer these inks in bigger bottles than 30ml, would like to see the 350ml bottle for those.

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If the cost is still reasonable when it gets to Australia I will try it.

It's all about the greys...

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I was excited until I read all the cautions. Haha.

 

As for pigment inks, I'm using Sailor Kiwaguro in lieu of Platinum Carbon Black.

 

I prefer PCB colorwise, seems somehow deeper, but SK doesn't widen my lines so much and it's easy to see the ink level in the eye-dropper I'm using it in.

 

Regardless, I'm looking forward to reviews or opinions of the Pilot pigment inks, as I'm not in the market for replacing either PCB or SK. Definitely not Noodler's Black, still my favorite Favorite ink.

_________________

etherX in To Miasto

Fleekair <--French accent.

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