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Sailor Pro Gear Fountain Pen


MPK
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does anyone have experience with the Sailor Pro Gear Fountain Pen (xf nib)?  if so, please convey detailed nib experience.....i love my pilot

912 with PO nib.....wondering how it will compare (feeedback / flow / general feel).  Cheers,  MK

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I've one on a Pro Gear Imperial. Flow is surprisingly good for such a fine nib. It has definite feed back but not annoyingly so (and I tend to be a touch sensitive to feedback). I do like the feel and balance of the model in the hand but always use them posted. The nib is firm but not a nail. You can get a touch of expression from it without adding too mjch pressure but it's not dramatic and in no way a flexible, soft or bouncy nib. It can feel a little sharp on textured papers and is best saved for very smooth or coated papers. Dark, saturated inks are fairly essential for this nib. The 'meanness' of the nibs ink use makes the tiny capacity of the converter considerably more bearable.

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Each to their own, but having started my fountain pen odyssey with Sailor pens and a couple of smaller items (Promenade mf and 1911s), I then bought a GT trim Pro Gear f and found it delightful.  The feedbacky experience is one I wouldn't want to describe in words other than it felt special to me.  And then, for a year or so, I plunged into the world of flex and vintage Pelikans, a wonderful world and quite different. 

Last month I lost my Pro Gear and it was then that I realised this was a pen I would struggle to be without.  Weeks have passed and it still remains missing so I've given in to that 'need' and another has just arrived in the post, a turquoise demonstrator this time.  Despite everything else out there the Pro Gear is just the loveliest of pens...and beautiful though it looks, it's all about the nib! (My Pilot 74 is enjoyable but doesn't hold a candle to the Sailors...).

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I just ordered a Sailor Pro Gear Fine (Black with gold trim).  After looking at Goulet Pens Nib Nook and a video thst measured the line thickness of both the EF and F pens at about an equivalent .3mm fine liner, I decided to go with the Fine version.  Mainly because it is easier to get at a discount than the EF version.  I hope I will like it.  I will use it for mainly writing Japanese kanji.

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My fine was a dream - just completely reliable.   My latest is ef and is perfect for my spidery meandering!

 

Hope you love your pen...

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49 minutes ago, Firecrest said:

My fine was a dream - just completely reliable.   My latest is ef and is perfect for my spidery meandering!

 

Hope you love your pen...

I’m hoping the fine is small enough for small kanji.  In the writing samples and videos I saw, there wasn’t much of a difference with the. EF except for maybe a slightly darker line.  In one video they measured the lines and said they were both about 0.3mm.

 

edit: Here is the video from Yoseka Stationary comparing the Pro Gear nib lines.
 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwj3sumHtLvzAhXOGFkFHZU7DVYQwqsBegQIBRAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DJ9cX4xa7WsA&usg=AOvVaw0CWeMoD_ASyn1l4Zj1w0GF

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6 hours ago, PotbellyPig said:

I’m hoping the fine is small enough for small kanji.

 

This might help. 

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/343508-q-i-use-western-fine-nibs-what-is-the-japanese-equivalent/?do=findComment&comment=4173821

 

(The dot grid spacing on Rhodia DotPad paper is 5mm, in case you didn't know.)

 

But I don't want to comment on characteristics and/or differences in subjective feel and 'wetness' of various nibs that cannot be captured and shown photographically, especially when it seems obvious to me that someone wants to use their own perception of such as criteria for whether to acquire, keep and/or use a pen.

 

On 10/3/2021 at 6:51 AM, MPK said:

....wondering how it will compare (feeedback / flow / general feel).

 

The ink and paper used (or of one's choice) will also factor significantly into one's perception of such.

 

To satisfy your curiosity in those regards, the best way and (in my opinion!) only valid way is to try it for yourself first-hand. Avoiding the incidental personal costs of doing so is legit, of course, but that just means satisfying one's curiosity is of lesser importance to oneself.

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct for valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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28 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

This might help. 

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/343508-q-i-use-western-fine-nibs-what-is-the-japanese-equivalent/?do=findComment&comment=4173821

 

(The dot grid spacing on Rhodia DotPad paper is 5mm, in case you didn't know.)

 

Thank you so much for showing me this!  It does look like from your sample that the differences going from a EF to F Sailor 21k nib is very minor if any.  I write on a Rhodia pad as well but I like to use the graph paper variety right now and not the DotPad.  But I am stunned.  You wrote whole kanji in just one square!  When I said I want to write small kanji I meant 4 boxes (10mm square).  My perception of writing small is way off!  (And I have to re-assess my Japanese handwriting skills.)  So I guess I am safe with the F nib then.  I could probably even go bigger if I wanted.

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8 minutes ago, PotbellyPig said:

You wrote whole kanji in just one square!  When I said I want to write small kanji I meant 4 boxes (10mm square).  …‹snip›… So I guess I am safe with the F nib then.  I could probably even go bigger if I wanted.

 

 

I have a (printed) page of hanzi / kanji ideograms that I found are among the most stroke-dense, for more stringent testing of whether particular nib-ink combinations are fine enough. 👺

 

Try these ones on for size!

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct for valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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36 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

 

I have a (printed) page of hanzi / kanji ideograms that I found are among the most stroke-dense, for more stringent testing of whether particular nib-ink combinations are fine enough. 👺

 

Try these ones on for size!

Most kanji aren’t terribly dense.  The more denser ones are like 襲 and 鬱.  I think the second one is the most dense of the standard jouyou kanji (for those who don’t know the list of kanji used in newspapers and the like). If I can write these in a 10mm square with a Sailor fine and it looks okay, then I am satisfied.  But it doesn’t look like a Salor EF helps that much anyway from all the samples I’ve seen, including yours.

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39 minutes ago, PotbellyPig said:

But it doesn’t look like a Salor EF helps that much anyway from all the samples I’ve seen, including yours.

 

I can't comment on the Sailor 21K gold EF nibs, even though I have one (on a pen that is still heat-sealed in a plastic sleeve as supplied new from the factory), but the 14K gold EF nib on my Sailor Promenade is easily as fine as a Platinum UEF nib. Beyond a certain point, though, indeed it doesn't “[help] that much anyway” by putting down even finer lines. I use it sometimes for drawing (this kind of thing), or writing on tiny self-adhesive labels.

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct for valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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33 minutes ago, A Smug Dill said:

 

I can't comment on the Sailor 21K gold EF nibs, even though I have one (on a pen that is still heat-sealed in a plastic sleeve as supplied new from the factory), but the 14K gold EF nib on my Sailor Promenade is easily as fine as a Platinum UEF nib. Beyond a certain point, though, indeed it doesn't “[help] that much anyway” by putting down even finer lines. I use it sometimes for drawing (this kind of thing), or writing on tiny self-adhesive labels.

In your example from the post you linked, the 14k EF nib was about the same line width of the 21k F nib.  From the video I mentioned, the Sailor 21k F, EF and 14k F, EF were all four about the same.  It also looks about the same on Goulet nib nook site.  So I don’t think I am making a big mistake by choosing a pen with a fine nib.  I hope I am not just talking it into myself but it seems to be the case.

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An extra fine nib will not give you a much finer line than a fine nib unless you have a very light hand. If you find yourself needing something finer than a Japanese fine, but you find it annoying or difficult to have to control the pressure constantly, you can always check out one of Pilot's posting(PO) nibs that can be found on the 742/912 and 743. They stay extra fine even if you have a heavy hand, but will still widen a little bit if you are really exerting pressure like you would when writing with a ballpoint pen, though less so than a normal extra fine.

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1 hour ago, Harold said:

An extra fine nib will not give you a much finer line than a fine nib unless you have a very light hand. If you find yourself needing something finer than a Japanese fine, but you find it annoying or difficult to have to control the pressure constantly, you can always check out one of Pilot's posting(PO) nibs that can be found on the 742/912 and 743. They stay extra fine even if you have a heavy hand, but will still widen a little bit if you are really exerting pressure like you would when writing with a ballpoint pen, though less so than a normal extra fine.

I just read about Pilot posting nibs the other day.  Thanks for the info.  I have a fine Sailor Pro Gear (the larger of the two sizes) on order and I guess I will just try it out.  I am a little hesitant on the EF because for such a small decrease in line width (even I can’t see it in the samples), from what I read, there is a greater chance with getting a nib that’s so called scratchy or with a lot of feedback.  People have also reassured me here that for my writing size, about 10mm square per Chinese character, a fine should be fine.  A Smug Dill was writing kanji in a 5mm box which amazes me.

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I hadn't heard about posting nibs until this thread - sound interesting.  Just received a Sailor PG ef and for me the line is definitely thinner than my old (and lost!) PG f.  Nothing scratchy about it.  Every Sailor I've owned (5 now) has been 100% reliable and a dream to use.  They have their nib reputation for a reason...

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22 minutes ago, Firecrest said:

I hadn't heard about posting nibs until this thread - sound interesting.  Just received a Sailor PG ef and for me the line is definitely thinner than my old (and lost!) PG f.  Nothing scratchy about it.  Every Sailor I've owned (5 now) has been 100% reliable and a dream to use.  They have their nib reputation for a reason...

May I ask where you purchased it?  I like Goulet Pens but they don’t have the basic large Pro Gear black with either gold trim or silver trim.  I don’t feel like paying extra for fancy colors.  But I like buying from a place which accepts returns.  This is in case the fine doesn’t work out.  Thanks!

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Hi - I bought my first Pro Gear from Amazon for quite a cheap price (around £130 - I'm UK-based).  Everything else has been ebay with my last PG pre-owned and immaculate though a little more expensive at £180.  I think all my sales have been fine for returns.  Most of my more recent purchases have been vintage Pelikans for their (semi-) flex nibs, a bit niche but rewarding if you get into them, and they're clearly only going to be available via places like ebay (though you've some specialist dealers in the USA if that's where you're from).  You might want to support your local pen shops of course...

 

Good luck wherever you decide to buy and I'm sure you'll find real delight in those Sailor nibs!

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On 10/9/2021 at 2:59 AM, PotbellyPig said:

I’m hoping the fine is small enough for small kanji.

That's funny, considering that many Japanese write with M or even B. Handwritten Kanji tend to be different from "printed" Kanji.

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With Sailor 21K gold EF or F nibs(on the 1911L or full size pro gear), when you add and subtract pressure to the pen, do you get a very slight line variation?  Like enough to see the difference in a small stroke or stroke ending when writing kanji?  Or are the nibs too hard for that?  Thanks!

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46 minutes ago, PotbellyPig said:

With Sailor 21K gold EF or F nibs(on the 1911L or full size pro gear), when you add and subtract pressure to the pen, do you get a very slight line variation?

 

Yes.

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct for valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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