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Questions about Platinum 3776 Celluloid (also a sub question about “legit” retailers)


collectorofmanythings
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So I am looking into purchasing a Platinum 3776 Celluloid at some point and noticed some things that I have a few questions about, so, here they are:

 

1.) Why are some models so much more expensive than others? Like there is one over $1,000 and there is another for $382. Why?

 

2.) Are they real celluloid or cellulose acateate?

 

3.) Is PenSachi a “legit” retailer? It is a lot less expensive like most Japanese retailers, and I was wondering if any of you in the US have had experience with this retailer, I would appreciate if you valued tell your experiences. 
 

4.) Do any of you have this pen? Do you like it?

 

Thank you all in advance for your responses! I really appreciate it.

 

W. H. Major

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1. The most obvious answer is that one is a chinkin (hand engraved pattern) model. Otherwise, Platinum used to have larger, faceted versions of their celluloid pens that were higher priced as well (I say “used to” because I don’t see it on their website catalogue anymore).

 

2. Nibs.com calls it “the real stuff” (https://www.nibs.com/pens/platinum-celluloid-midnight-ocean), whatever that means.

 

4. I have the Koi and Sakura versions, and I sometimes consider getting the rest :P A common dealbreaker for most people is that instead of being turned from a celluloid rod, they are rolled from a celluloid sheet. This means that for patterns like the Koi, the vertical seam is noticeable. However, for patterns like the Sakura, it takes a close inspection to see the seam.

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13 hours ago, collectorofmanythings said:

1.) Why are some models so much more expensive than others? Like there is one over $1,000 and there is another for $382. Why?

 

Because.

 

large.1357897417_Platinum3776CenturyCelluloidmodelsMSRPinofficialCatalogue2021-2022.jpg.cfec4a9c53d8b8e06b10069bbe88b509.jpg

 

I'm not sure whether your question implies a demand for either fellow forum members or the manufacturer / distributor / retailer to justify the product pricing in accordance of some value assessment framework, or give you a run-down of the state of supply and demand (and competition) in the fountain pen market today.

 

13 hours ago, collectorofmanythings said:

2.) Are they real celluloid or cellulose acateate?

 

I'm afraid I'm not in a position to independently and/or authoritatively determine that for you, but I can only tell you that Platinum uses the word “celluloid” to describe the body material in the catalogue shown above. See also:

If Platinum doesn't clarify that to your satisfaction, then it's up to you to either ask the manufacturer directly, or get a unit to inspect, examine or test for yourself in order to arrive at that piece of intelligence.

 

13 hours ago, collectorofmanythings said:

3.) Is PenSachi a “legit” retailer?

 

I've placed a number of orders with Pensachi in the past, and they went fine. Mind you, I'm in Australia; but I don't know what being in the US has to do with the legitimacy of the retailer selling out of Japan, when it has nothing to do with the delivery method or speed, or whether someone will end up having to pay any due taxes and/or duties when the shipments arrive in the customer's country.

 

For what it's worth, I vaguely remember Pensachi recently (in May?) sending out an email message to newsletter subscribers that from now on it will declare the full value of the products on customs declaration paperwork, so that's one aspect of ‘legitimacy’ in the handling of orders. (My mistake. That was Wancher.) The other main one is simply whether Pensachi is an authorised retailer in Japan of the brands it carries; and I have no reason to doubt that it is.

 

13 hours ago, collectorofmanythings said:

4.) Do any of you have this pen? Do you like it?

 

Which one specifically?

 

The pen's material and finish are fine; but I'm not impressed by Platinum #3776 Celluloid pen's cap seal performance.

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/345825-platinum-3776-non-century-cap-seal-effectiveness/

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct for valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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What is your experience with Platinum Celluloid? Time resistant or like some Italian Celluloid pens that crack ,brake or simply destroy themselves after some years.

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4 minutes ago, jchch1950 said:

What is your experience with Platinum Celluloid? Time resistant or like some Italian Celluloid pens that crack ,brake or simply destroy themselves after some years.

 

Who, me? I haven't had the pen long enough (cf. “some years”) to say.

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct for valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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Th efinish on th emore expensive ones is different. 

 

with the cheaper ones, you ge the colour of the acetate.

 

Th emore expensive ones have make-i designed painted or etched into them by hand and have had gold and/or silver powders infused into the design. 

 

It'll be a prettier pen, but won't write differently.  

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Ah, okay. Thank you all for the responses to the questions so far! I also have one more question, when ordering from PenSachi, does the cap band have Japanese characters or English? Again, thank you all ( @sandy101, @A Smug Dill, @jchch1950, @ridiculopathy) for the answers so far!

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On 6/19/2021 at 8:31 AM, jchch1950 said:

What is your experience with Platinum Celluloid? Time resistant or like some Italian Celluloid pens that crack ,brake or simply destroy themselves after some years.

 

It's a cellulose nitrate sheet produced by the Daicel corporation, I believe. I have tortoise a 3776 and smell of camphor is evident. No idea about the long term durability of this material, should be a stable celluloid anyway. Just one thing, the celluloid 3776 is smaller than the resin Century. 

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On 6/19/2021 at 10:26 AM, collectorofmanythings said:

1.) Why are some models so much more expensive than others? Like there is one over $1,000 and there is another for $382. Why?

Looking at the Platinum catalogue (which exists in English too), it is clear. It is not the celluloid that is different but it is because the Chinkin design is made with Platinum powder.

Catalogue page link

 

 

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On 6/19/2021 at 10:26 AM, collectorofmanythings said:

2.) Are they real celluloid or cellulose acateate?

There are VERY FEW makers of "real celluloid" now, I was told by a Japanese company making celluloid  pens. Problem is the explosive properties of celluloid nitrate during the production process.

I heard there are only 2 plants making this in China.

If you really want to know if they use the nitrate or acetate - ask Platinum Pens via their homepage.

 

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My understanding is Platinum revised the formula for the celluloid used in their pens some time around 2000, maybe later. Late 1990s Platinum catalogues note them as ReCelluloid with the description revised to celluloid several year later. This may have been due to environmental or fire hazard requirements. Maybe shrinkage! Their older models can shrink slightly making the barrel difficult to remove from the section. Can does not mean will as there are many examples where shrinkage is very minimal or not at all where pens may have been maintained in an environment that limits shrinkage. We have about ten older 3776 celluloid Platinum pens with both 14K and 18K nibs. Not enough of a sampling. Some colors of celluloid might shrink more or not at all.

 

The 3776 originally came in several additional colors that are now discontinued. Finding them is a challenge and premium pricing is the norm. If you find any with 18K nibs, go for it. A good pen repairer can mitigate the shrinkage problem.

 

Celluloid used in the 3776 does not crack or disintegrate.

 

Agree with mke. Platinum, the metal, ain't cheap, and may be difficult to apply as designed.

 

 

stan

Formerly Ryojusen Pens
The oldest and largest buyer and seller of vintage Japanese pens in America.


Member: Pen Collectors of America & Fuente, THE Japanese Pen Collectors Club

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12 hours ago, stan said:

My understanding is Platinum revised the formula for the celluloid used in their pens some time around 2000, maybe later. Late 1990s Platinum catalogues note them as ReCelluloid with the description revised to celluloid several year later. This may have been due to environmental or fire hazard requirements. Maybe shrinkage! Their older models can shrink slightly making the barrel difficult to remove from the section. Can does not mean will as there are many examples where shrinkage is very minimal or not at all where pens may have been maintained in an environment that limits shrinkage. We have about ten older 3776 celluloid Platinum pens with both 14K and 18K nibs. Not enough of a sampling. Some colors of celluloid might shrink more or not at all.

 

The 3776 originally came in several additional colors that are now discontinued. Finding them is a challenge and premium pricing is the norm. If you find any with 18K nibs, go for it. A good pen repairer can mitigate the shrinkage problem.

 

Celluloid used in the 3776 does not crack or disintegrate.

 

Agree with mke. Platinum, the metal, ain't cheap, and may be difficult to apply as designed.

 

 

 

On 6/19/2021 at 12:18 PM, rvur said:

 

It's a cellulose nitrate sheet produced by the Daicel corporation, I believe. I have tortoise a 3776 and smell of camphor is evident. No idea about the long term durability of this material, should be a stable celluloid anyway. Just one thing, the celluloid 3776 is smaller than the resin Century. 

 So.. this post that comes first scared me a little that now the “ReCelluloid” is cellulose acetate. So, @rvur, when did you buy your pen after 2000, give or take a few years? And if you have any other pen that is cellulose nitrate (real celluloid) for sure, does it feel the same?

 

Thank you both (as well as @mke) for your responses!

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9 hours ago, collectorofmanythings said:

 

 So.. this post that comes first scared me a little that now the “ReCelluloid” is cellulose acetate. So, @rvur, when did you buy your pen after 2000, give or take a few years? And if you have any other pen that is cellulose nitrate (real celluloid) for sure, does it feel the same?

 

Thank you both (as well as @mke) for your responses!

 

You're welcome. To answer to your questions: 1) last February and 2) yes, I have some vintage pens in cellulose nitrate and - to the touch - the material feels the same. Anyway, in the box there's a little note where is stated that the pen is manufactured in celluloid nitrate (unfortunately don't have it with me, otherwise I would have posted a photo, maybe there's a reference somewhere online).

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On 6/20/2021 at 1:18 AM, rvur said:

 

It's a cellulose nitrate sheet produced by the Daicel corporation, I believe. I have tortoise a 3776 and smell of camphor is evident. No idea about the long term durability of this material, should be a stable celluloid anyway. Just one thing, the celluloid 3776 is smaller than the resin Century. 

Daicel is known for their cellulose acetate business. I doubt that they still produce the nitrate in Japan. I asked them but chances are high that they don't answer. I will keep you updated if they do.

I searched the web but didn't find any maker in Japan.

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3 hours ago, mke said:

Daicel is known for their cellulose acetate business. I doubt that they still produce the nitrate in Japan. I asked them but chances are high that they don't answer. I will keep you updated if they do.

I searched the web but didn't find any maker in Japan.

 

Thanks! My hypothesis started from this 2017 thread here on fpn

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I got in contact with the Daicel subsidiary who makes celluloid. Let's see what information I can get.

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On 6/23/2021 at 6:56 AM, mke said:

I got in contact with the Daicel subsidiary who makes celluloid. Let's see what information I can get.

Great! I hope they still use nitrate. Thank you for your help!

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On 6/21/2021 at 10:38 AM, rvur said:

 

Thanks! My hypothesis started from this 2017 thread here on fpn

Gosh! I just read that. I hope they were allowed to keep making real celluloid!

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On 6/21/2021 at 6:14 AM, rvur said:

 

You're welcome. To answer to your questions: 1) last February and 2) yes, I have some vintage pens in cellulose nitrate and - to the touch - the material feels the same. Anyway, in the box there's a little note where is stated that the pen is manufactured in celluloid nitrate (unfortunately don't have it with me, otherwise I would have posted a photo, maybe there's a reference somewhere online).

That’s great! I hope that your pen wasn’t from a pre-2017 stock and is new, because if it is then it probably is, and all the new ones probably are, nitrate, because I’ve heard that acetate doesn’t have the camphor smell.

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On 6/23/2021 at 6:56 AM, mke said:

I got in contact with the Daicel subsidiary who makes celluloid. Let's see what information I can get.

So it’s been a few weeks.. have you heard anything? Or was it not helpful?

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