Rohrer & Klingner Sketch Ink: Lotte (review)

[mouse2cat]

Rohrer and Klingner Sketch ink Lotte

 

I noticed that we didn’t have a review of the black ink from the Rohrer and Klingner Sketch Ink line. This is my main black ink right now so I thought I’d write a review for it here. This is my first review on the forum

 

The Sketch Ink Line is a set of pigment based fountain pen inks. They are waterproof and lightfast. Primarily they are marketed towards artists. Lotte is the black ink from this line.

 

 

A lot of inks are marketed as waterproof, but what they mean is that if you spill something there will be enough of a line left to make out what is on the paper. The entire sketch ink series is fully waterproof in that you could slosh watercolor all over it and you won’t get any ink discharge. You could take this ink swimming and have no real issue. There are only a few other inks on the market that have this level of waterproof quality.

 

The ones that come to mind are Noodler’s Black, Platinum Carbon Black and DeAtramentis Document Black. So a quick comparison

 

Noodlers black is not as waterproof at this ink. Depending on the paper you use Noodlers seems to need a longer dry time and depending on the paper you use results can vary as far as how waterproof it gets. I have had some small feathering with the Noodlers as it soaks into certain papers. On watercolor paper Noodlers works just fine.

 

The Platinum Carbon black is just as waterproof as this ink but has a different look. The Platinum Carbon is a darker black that dries with a bit of sheen. It kind of looks like sumi ink with that sheen. This is the blackest of the waterproof inks. It has a kind of thicker viscosity and I am more worried about the Platinum Carbon clogging my pen because it just seems so thick and black. But I haven’t had any issues despite my worries.

 

De Atramentis Document Black line is equally waterproof but I haven’t tested it out as much. The Document ink seems to behave similar to this ink except being darker than Lotte and more expensive per bottle. I think once I finish my Bottle of Lotte I’ll get a full bottle of this instead of a sample. (the document black also comes in short international cartridges)

 

 

As I mentioned above this is not the blackest of inks. I would actually go as far as to call this a “light black” All the other waterproof blacks I compare this to are blacker. This ink also shows no shading and is pretty flat looking on the paper. For a black I would like a little more punch, but I think that having slightly less pigment here may contribute to this ink being so well behaved. I have experienced no feathering with this ink. Even on crappy paper.

Dry time is very fast. I’m a lefty and I don’t get any smear with this ink.

 

Price $13.50 for a 50ml bottle. Except for Noodler’s this is the cheapest fully black ink on the market.

 

Because this is a pigmented ink. The micro pigment particles can sink to the bottom. So it’s a good idea to shake the bottle before loading it in a pen. Shaking this ink creates a lot of foam so that a little annoying when trying to fill your pen. Lotte is in a dark glass bottle so you can’t actually see the pigment separate. But I have seen separation in my Twsbi when I use the colored Sketch ink, so I assume that the black is the same.

 

Because pigmented inks have a reputation for damaging pens if you forget about your pen and let it dry up. I would recommend using this ink in a pen that has a good cap seal. I have some click closure pens that ink seems to evaporate out of faster. While my twist cap pens with a rubber gasket seems to show almost no evaporation. Also just clean your pens once in a while ya filthy animal.

 

Would I recommend this ink? Yes. This is a solid, low maintenance, totally waterproof ink. You could use this as an everyday black. Honestly this ink could use a little more love. The whole line of inks are excellent.

 

 

 

 

[LizEF]

Thanks for a great review!  I linked it to another person online who was just asking about waterproof blacks.

 

1 hour ago, mouse2cat said:

Also just clean your pens once in a while ya filthy animal.

[A Smug Dill]

What a wonderfully descriptive and detailed review!  Thank you very much for that.

 

2 hours ago, mouse2cat said:

A lot of inks are marketed as waterproof, but what they mean is that if you spill something there will be enough of a line left to make out what is on the paper. The entire sketch ink series is fully waterproof in that you could slosh watercolor all over it and you won’t get any ink discharge.

 

Excellent clarification.  I regard ‘waterproofness’ just as strictly.

 

2 hours ago, mouse2cat said:

The Platinum Carbon black is just as waterproof as this ink but has a different look.

 

Is R&K Lotte at all prone to mechanical erasure, when re-wetted after drying?

 

…

 

Oh, and have you tried Hero 234 carbon black ink, which is also pigmented?

 

[mouse2cat]

1 hour ago, A Smug Dill said:

What a wonderfully descriptive and detailed review!  Thank you very much for that.

 

 

Excellent clarification.  I regard ‘waterproofness’ just as strictly.

 

 

Is R&K Lotte at all prone to mechanical erasure, when re-wetted after drying?

 

…

 

Oh, and have you tried Hero 234 carbon black ink, which is also pigmented?

 

 

Hi Dill, I haven't tried the Hero 234. It doesn't seem very easy to get here in the states. And I won't order from amazon. #evil. 

 

I can try the test you are describing. But I want to make sure I am doing it right. I don't have fountain pen paper just watercolor paper over here. I think that Lotte seems to "soak" into the paper while the Platinum carbon sits a little more on the surface so I could see the Platinum carbon being more vulnerable to friction because of that. I only have a tiny sample of the platinum carbon, but that was my impression. 

[yazeh]

Thanks for such detailed and passionate review. Another friend of mine often uses Lotte for sketching.

I use Marlene and Klara. 

I would say these inks a e best used in pens  with least amount of evaporation or pens that we use on a daily basis...

 

[A Smug Dill]

4 minutes ago, mouse2cat said:

But I want to make sure I am doing it right. I don't have fountain pen paper just watercolor paper over here.

 

If you draw a line with the ink on the paper, let it dry, then squiggle over it with a water brush pen (or just a clean but wet paintbrush), and are satisfy that no colourant comes off the line to make the wetted area (once it's dry again) next to it appear other than the paper's original colour, then I think for all intents and purposes the ink is waterproof and not subject to mechanical erasure.

 

I used Arttec Como Drawing Pad 210gsm mixed media paper in the video of my testing of Platinum Carbon Black.

[mouse2cat]

Just now, A Smug Dill said:

 

If you draw a line with the ink on the paper, let it dry, then squiggle over it with a water brush pen (or just a clean but wet paintbrush), and are satisfy that no colourant comes off the line to make the wetted area (once it's dry again) next to it appear other than the paper's original colour, then I think for all intents and purposes the ink is waterproof and not subject to mechanical erasure.

 

I used Arttec Como Drawing Pad 210gsm mixed media paper in the video of my testing of Platinum Carbon Black.

 

Oh yes. So you just let the wet spot dry naturally without blotting so you can see if there is a subtle halo of color? Somehow I imagined you scrubbing the fibers with your waterbrush. lol. I have a whole test page. I guess I should have posted it. Lotte is at the bottom. All the squiggles were wet and then allowed to dry. 

 

 

So I have done watercolor sketches with this ink and it is totally waterproof. To the same degree as the platinum carbon. I can't work with watercolors if the pigment discharges when wet since it will contaminate the colors. 

[mouse2cat]

From this test I would say that it preforms very similarly to the DeAtramentis document in they have the same matte look. I think the DeA Document Black is a hair darker. Lotte looks darker than it should in this test because it was in a stub nib pen. 

[mouse2cat]

50 minutes ago, yazeh said:

Thanks for such detailed and passionate review. Another friend of mine often uses Lotte for sketching.

I use Marlene and Klara. 

I would say these inks a e best used in pens  with least amount of evaporation or pens that we use on a daily basis...

 

 

I agree! I have Emma, Freida and Carmen as well and I feel like my Twsbi is the best pen for them. It has such a good airtight seal that none of the ink seems to evaporate. I would hate to have the thick sludgy remains building up in a pen that evaporated. 

I also have a fude nib pen that just lays down so much ink I think it would be hard for it to clog. 

 

Or you know just draw all the time. 

I actually don't see a review for Carmen. Maybe I should do that one next. 

[Tas]

Just my type of ink. thanks for the excellent review.

Whilst, until a bottle runs dry, I'm not buying any inks this year (a promise to myself) this has now made it to the "wish list"

Thank you!
😊

[txomsy]

I don't know why I thought the R&K Sketch Ink line wasn't apt for fountain pens. Learning they can be used on FPs has set them on my radar as well. Like @Tas I will have to wait until I empty a few bottles, but I expect that with the new brush pen, ink will run off faster now.

[mouse2cat]

7 hours ago, txomsy said:

I don't know why I thought the R&K Sketch Ink line wasn't apt for fountain pens. Learning they can be used on FPs has set them on my radar as well. Like @Tas I will have to wait until I empty a few bottles, but I expect that with the new brush pen, ink will run off faster now.

 

There are so few totally waterproof inks that are actually safe for fountain pens. I have had zero issues with this clogging. 

A lot of inks marketed towards artist are dip pen inks so unless you dig it's easy just to assume.

 

I got the green one from the sketch line and it is the perfect shade of sap green, I use it in a brush pen for drawing plants and trees. Have had no issues with this ink clogging in a brush pen either. 

[yazeh]

7 minutes ago, mouse2cat said:

 

There are so few totally waterproof inks that are actually safe for fountain pens. I have had zero issues with this clogging. 

A lot of inks marketed towards artist are dip pen inks so unless you dig it's easy just to assume.

 

I got the green one from the sketch line and it is the perfect shade of sap green, I use it in a brush pen for drawing plants and trees. Have had no issues with this ink clogging in a brush pen either. 

There are a couple of specially fountain pen which you can use "India ink". One is indigraph and the other is Ackerman pens...

I can tell you through experience that sketchiness can clog... but it's nothing bad....

 

[lapis]

8 hours ago, Tas said:

... Whilst, until a bottle runs dry, I'm not buying any inks this year (a promise to myself)....

Har, har... that's a good one. Reminds me of Mark Twain's good ol' saying: "Why, that's easy... just like stopping smoking. I've done that hundreds of times!".

[mouse2cat]

2 hours ago, yazeh said:

There are a couple of specially fountain pen which you can use "India ink". One is indigraph and the other is Ackerman pens...

I can tell you through experience that sketchiness can clog... but it's nothing bad....

 

 

Ooooh I didn't know about the Ackerman pen. This looks super cool.

[Tas]

17 hours ago, lapis said:

Har, har... that's a good one. Reminds me of Mark Twain's good ol' saying: "Why, that's easy... just like stopping smoking. I've done that hundreds of times!".

I've made it to mid April. I'm SO proud! 😊.
(My Sailor Blue Black is on fumes though . . . 😬)

[Adeline V]

I'd like to respond to mouse2cat's photo.  I have a number of those inks, and do very similar tests-  I too use ink and wash watercolor techniques.  SO I test ink by making a lot of marks and wetting some but not other areas to see what it looks like once dry.  I get pretty different results with the Noodlers inks than what a lot of sites show in their tests.  So far, I concur with the conclusions about :

De'atramentis document inks.  dries pretty fast, you could leave it wet hours and it's not gonna budge.  I use the ARCHIVAL rather than the document black, simply because I bought that  before I started collecting the document line.  I have the white, light grey, urban grey, fog grey, document grey, archival black.

 

I got consistently identical results to the image for :

rome is burning, Noodler's black, Salix, Scabiosa, d'A urban grey, Carbon black.  I get that same yellow seepage of general of the armies that is displayed on rome is burning in the image.  those two inks are often listed as waterproof but they both have strong vibrant yellow seepage when I've washed over them.

 

Noodlers:

lexington grey

la reine mauve

polar brown

are all what I'd call the same level of waterproof as the document line.  I never see those noodlers' inks budge with heavy washes The polar brown has feathered a good deal on multimedia inexpensive sketchbook paper (canson xl MM pad) where I do a lot of color testing for paint and ink combos. 

 

I have a hard time telling Platinum Carbon Black from the Deatramentis Archive black once It's in a pen and getting used.  the carbon black does sometimes make a sheen if it was a very wet line.  it also seems to like dip nibs better than D'A, but goes on pretty rich.  I can get a heavy layer of the carbon black to lift a little sometimes, I never get that sort of extra ink from the Archival D'A Black.

 

in addition, I have R&K sketch frieda- it's bluish-greyish, and it hasn't budged under a wash.  I get the faintest amount of lifting under a heavy wash of Sailor Souboku, but it's not enough for me to care- it's VERY faint, and unless the wash is completely clear, with any color at all over the top, it's not going to be significant enough to be visually any different.  Souboku is a little more or less waterproof depending on dry time and how much cotton the paper has.

 

I have found Jetpens to have very accurate ink swatch imaging.  almost every ink they sell has been tested with water-based highlighters, gel highlighters, water soak tests, and water brush tests.  and the tests are shown side by side in the images for the ink with actual swatches.  It hasn't failed me yet, it's the only place i've seen that lists consistent swatches for everything with those four tests.  and my results have mostly matched theirs very closely.

 

as for some other not mentioned inks-

Kala Nostalgia Moonstone and Opal-  they are almost identical colors but both are outstandingly waterproof, just like the de'A doc inks.  I wouldn't buy both in the future.  they both resemble 2H or 3H pencil lines in tone and darkness. 

 

I just got a few Tono and Lims inks yesterday from Shigure inks.  All three of them were exactly as waterproof as described. 

 

SO I would trust ratings from them, Roher&Klingener Sketch, and de'atramentis document and archival lines far more than I would testing on the Noodler's lines.  I know nobody needs a newb to validate their results, but It was striking to me when I read that post just how identical my purposes and results were, and in case anyone is looking in the sketching community for more alternative colors than BLACK waterproof inks, and doesnt' want to mess with noodlers sort of schitzoid ink behavior, hopefully they can try these inks with more confidence.

 

Next week I should get my Birmingham everlasting bottles of ink.  I'll let you know how waterproofing tests go!

 

[mouse2cat]

I'm glad the photo was helpful. I wish it wasn't so dreadfully yellow toned but if you are familiar with these inks you get the gist. 

 

The whole sketch ink line is very consistent. Although I find there is some sediment that needs to be shaken back in. This doesn't seem to affect flow in any way. I've tested Thea and Lilly. Lilly was too muddy (for me) with more spread (like Frieda) while Thea was quite well behaved. Thea is a really nice pencil grey. Lotte can dry a bit too quickly on the nib, so make sure to only use that ink in a pen with a good cap seal. 

 

The DeA line is also very consistent and really REALLY waterproof although some colors seem to have more spread than others. This is not particularly apparent on watercolor paper. Black, Brown and Urban Grey are excellent. DeA Fuchsia (magenta) is an amazing ink. In general I find the DeA line to be less fussy and also more expensive. 

 

Personally I am not mad about the weird Noodler's because it's a unique effect when drawing. The Noodler's Red Black lets off a nice warm terracotta shade when wet that works well in a figure drawing context. The Zhivago a bright green and the Rome burning a bright yellow with the line beneath being very stable. The Rome burning lines turn purple once the yellow is lifted off. Which is pretty wild. 

 

You may be new to this forum but you don't seem new to drawing with ink. Welcome. 

[txomsy]

Ditto. That was a really useful post, @Adeline V. Thank you.

[txomsy]

BTW, for those who like sketching with brush, I have to say, Kuretake black, the one they ship with their brush fountain pens, is amazingly water resistant. I recently forgot an A7 notebook in a jeans pocket when doing the laundry. After going through the washing machine with detergent et al. and hanging in the line under strong summer sun, the pages with Kuretake black brush FP sketches were absolutely the same, no washing at all, the lines and colors as sharp as when first laid down, one couldn't tell they'd had suffered any change.