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Shaeffer Ink Sac Repair alteternative replacement.

Echowind

By Echowind
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Echowind Near Mint

Echowind

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Needed a little help here, I've got a few Shaeffer Imperial and a Targa Ink sacks which have gone bad.

The internal Ink sacs have crumbled into pieces.

Does anyone know whether the new converters or any alternatives for getting a new one.

I'm posting the pics below.

P_20210112_190826.thumb.jpg.347999ffcecca42a0574348d71d2360d.jpgP_20210112_190931.thumb.jpg.789f235d596ad1d25861bebf7b35a863.jpg

Edited by Echowind
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Mr.Rene Collectors Item

Mr.Rene

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Standard modern converters are available in pen shops, piston system.

Old style, with sacs, are available too, old stocks,...I have seen some with silicone sacs ...

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pen lady Collectors Item

pen lady

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I've replaced several Sheaffer converter sacs and I think I used a size 14 sac. Check to be sure though.

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Echowind Near Mint

Echowind

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29 minutes ago, Mr.Rene said:

Standard modern converters are available in pen shops, piston system.

Old style, with sacs, are available too, old stocks,...I have seen some with silicone sacs ...

By modern converter, do you mean this- Fountain Pen Piston Converter Push-in Style?

Link: https://www.sheaffer.com/sh_en_us/96700

 

 

 

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Mr.Rene Collectors Item

Mr.Rene

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4 minutes ago, Echowind said:

By modern converter, do you mean this- Fountain Pen Piston Converter Push-in Style?

Link: https://www.sheaffer.com/sh_en_us/96700

 

 

 

 Yes...and You can find some like yours damage converter...bladder/sac style...some made of rubber and some made of silicone (later before descontinued)...

 

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Echowind Near Mint

Echowind

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Just now, Mr.Rene said:

 Yes...and You can find some like yours damage converter...bladder/sac style...some made of rubber and some made of silicone (later before descontinued)...

 

Thank you, I'l get one and try it out.

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Ron Z Museum Piece

Ron Z

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1 hour ago, pen lady said:

I've replaced several Sheaffer converter sacs and I think I used a size 14 sac. Check to be sure though.

 

The correct size is a #16.  A 16 PVC works well, and brings the converter up to the grade of one of the red end converters.  It's worth doing because some of the Imperials, and most of the Connaisseur pens will not take the piston converter because of the brass plug in the end.

 

Sheaffer did not use silicone sacs.

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Mr.Rene Collectors Item

Mr.Rene

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Silicone sac is used like a general concept..like for "plastic" in several acrylic..or "precious resin" for an unspecified kind of plastic... I am almost sure Echowind does not care if it is silocone or PVC sac material..He needs a working converter replace..SO..Ron..do not be "fussy", please..Thank you so much.

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Ron Z Museum Piece

Ron Z

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Sorry, I disagree.  If you had perhaps said "synthetic" I still might have pointed out that the Sheaffer converters used PVC, but there is a big difference between silicone and PVC if one is considering repairing their converters - and it's worth doing because of what a replacement squeeze converter goes for these days.

 

Silicone needs silicone cement to stick to a sac nipple, PVC  can be secured with shellac.  Silicone sacs are also gas permeable, which means that a pen in which they are installed can ooze if not stored with the nib up.  It's a known weakness, and why I double check and make sure that a pen's owner knows this when they ask to have one installed.   PVC and latex sacs are not.

 

Martin Smith at Woodbin sold his PVC sacs as silicone, when they were in fact PVC.  David Nishimura  had some articles about it a number of years ago. 

 

Anyone interested is welcome to read this article  to learn more about different sacs and the strengths and weaknesses of each material.

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es9 Vintage

es9

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Ron, couple quick questions:

 

(1) I know David Nishimura sells PVC sacs for snorkels, but can one also get them for PFMs? 
 

(2) I understand the softening caused by PVC is not a problem on snorkels and PFMs because of the metal sac guard (and I assume the rubber nipple).  But wouldn’t a PVC sac be problematic on the celluloid section of a TD?  If so, am I correct that a silicone sac would be the only synthetic option for TDs?

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Ron Z Museum Piece

Ron Z

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I don't think that David sells them for the PFM.  The PVC sac for a snorkel is important because it has a carbon spring.  When a sac fails, ink gets into the barrel and the spring and other parts rust, creating an expensive repair.  The spring in a PFM is stainless steel, and does not rust.  Granted it would be nice if the sac didn't fail, but it is not as crucial an item.

 

Point 2 - I've thought about this.  The PVC sac does not come into direct contact with the nipple on the section because of the layer of shellac.   I'm willing to take the risk.

 

Two points - I am not convinced that a PVC sac will cause damage to celluloid, but grant that it may.  We find plenty of aerometric 51s that have perfectly good sac nipples, so there was a change in the formulation of either the plastic of the sac nipple or the plasticizer used in the sac.  We don't know.  I had used a PVC sac in some of my pens for a decade or more before the silicone sacs were released.  The 51 sacs that David sells are PVC, and we're quite happy to install them to replace defective or stained originals.

 

The second point is that in many ways this is a moot point at the moment.  David has the #14 sacs available, but none in the other sizes.  The sacs were made by Martin Smith, who passed away two or three years ago.  I've bought as many of the PVC sacs as I could, but my supply of everything but #14 is quite low.

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es9 Vintage

es9

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15 hours ago, Ron Z said:

Point 2 - I've thought about this.  The PVC sac does not come into direct contact with the nipple on the section because of the layer of shellac.   I'm willing to take the risk.

 

...

 

The second point is that in many ways this is a moot point at the moment.  David has the #14 sacs available, but none in the other sizes.  The sacs were made by Martin Smith, who passed away two or three years ago.  I've bought as many of the PVC sacs as I could, but my supply of everything but #14 is quite low.

 

(Granted its entirely academic, so this is just out of curiosity at this point.)  Regarding the italicized text: Did Parker use something other than shellac to secure pli-glass sacs? 

 

EDIT: 

 

PS: when installing a PCV sac in a snorkel, is the process the same other than swabbing with some alcohol?  In other words, do I just cut the sac, shellac it on, dust with talc, etc?  

 

PPS: does it matter if the PVC sac isn't a perfect cylinder/is a little lopsided?

 

 

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