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Why Don’T Steel Sub Nibs Have Tipping Material?


sketchstack

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I have several Jowo and Bock steel stub nibs and none of them have tipping. I don’t think I’ve ever knowingly seen a steel stub nib with tipping material, ever.

 

The opposite is true for the gold and palladium stub nibs I’ve seen or owned. In fact my Visconti palladium stub looked like a little hammerhead due to so much tipping.

 

Anyone know why? Is it that softer alloys require tipping for longevity whereas steel doesn’t?

Edited by sketchstack
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I have several Jowo and Bock steel stub nibs and none of them have tipping. I don’t think I’ve ever knowingly seen a steel stub nib with tipping material, ever.

 

There is tipping on my Sailor Young Profit's steel MS nib, which is just a Stub nib by any other name, since Sailor doesn't offer Stub nibs.

 

I haven't seen a steel Stub nib on an Aurora Ipsilon, but the steel Italic nib does appear to have a little bit of tipping.

 

UniqueWritingGifts-6-1.jpeg

(Click to enlarge)

 

Source: Goulet Pens

Edited by A Smug Dill

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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All of the steel nibs I own have tipping: Jowo and Kaweco, in and . Admittedly, it is a small sample size, totalling half a dozen nibs.

 

Disregard: I missed the "stub" bit. :P

Edited by silverlifter

Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

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An Indian company called Kanwrite sells steel stubs. The nibs are properly tipped. The tipping is then ground to a stub.

 

I dont know why jowo or bock dont tip and reshape the steel nibs they sell as italic in mm sizes.(btw, Do they sell steel nibs labelled stubs? )If any company can do it, it should be them. Maybe the cost of the tipping balls is too high to be economical.

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Steel nibs meant for italic calligraphy have no tipping because their maintenance requires for them be be sharpened to maintain their crispness. Hard metal tipping would last longer but it would also be very hard to maintain (cost is also a factor).

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I guess it's just cheaper to make them without a tipping than to attach a tipping and then grind them. Jowo steel italics work just fine so no real reason to add extra processes.

 

Mana, you mentioned sharpening them to keep them crisp. Assuming that you're talking about Jowo/Bock steel italics, I haven't heard of this before, so could you share how you do it?

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Many Italic nibs are tipped. Many steel nibs are tipped. For example aParker Octanium nibs are tipped.

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Mana, you mentioned sharpening them to keep them crisp. Assuming that you're talking about Jowo/Bock steel italics, I haven't heard of this before, so could you share how you do it?

With an Arkansas stone, basically the idea is to grind the front/forward facing part of the nib so that the tip is all 90 degree angles for producing the greatest line variation at the area of contact with the paper (thin/hairline side strokes vs. broad down strokes).

 

More here > http://www.marcuslink.com/pens/aboutpens/ludwig-tan.html

 

Here is also a video that goes in to the process in more detail > https://youtu.be/xO825G32V_E

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I guess it's just cheaper to make them without a tipping than to attach a tipping and then grind them. Jowo steel italics work just fine so no real reason to add extra processes.

 

Mana, you mentioned sharpening them to keep them crisp. Assuming that you're talking about Jowo/Bock steel italics, I haven't heard of this before, so could you share how you do it?

It’s more for formal calligraphic lettering than handwriting (if that distinction makes sense!).

 

Patricia Lovett shows how a broad-edge dip nib is sharpened to maintain very crisp lines, and I’ve done the same with steel italic fountain pen nibs. ‘Stubs’ don’t really exist in calligraphy, you have a crisp italic nib, or a pointed nib.

 

https://www.patricialovett.com/calligraphy-sharpening-nibs/

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With an Arkansas stone, basically the idea is to grind the front/forward facing part of the nib so that the tip is all 90 degree angles for producing the greatest line variation at the area of contact with the paper (thin/hairline side strokes vs. broad down strokes).

 

More here > http://www.marcuslink.com/pens/aboutpens/ludwig-tan.html

 

Here is also a video that goes in to the process in more detail >

 

It’s more for formal calligraphic lettering than handwriting (if that distinction makes sense!).

 

Patricia Lovett shows how a broad-edge dip nib is sharpened to maintain very crisp lines, and I’ve done the same with steel italic fountain pen nibs. ‘Stubs’ don’t really exist in calligraphy, you have a crisp italic nib, or a pointed nib.

 

https://www.patricialovett.com/calligraphy-sharpening-nibs/

 

Thanks both for that. It'd be really interesting to see Jowo/Bock/Lamy 1.1 nib sharpened to a crisp italic. I recently bought a whetstone to sharpen my kitchen knives, and sharpening steel nibs seems like a similar process.

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Thanks for all the replies. I am starting to believe it’s a cost saving measure. Easier to not bother tipping than to shape the blob to a stub.

 

Whereas the more expensive gold & palladium are just that —more expensive. Thus they merit the extra work involved to make a tipped stub (not to mention the durability factor).

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I am starting to believe it’s a cost saving measure. Easier to not bother tipping than to shape the blob to a stub.

 

I suppose you could frame it as that, but is the tipping even necessary for a steel Stub nib to be fit for the purpose — including having reasonable durability for the expected usage and useful lifetime of the product — for which it is specified, marketed and sold?

 

A fountain pen with a threaded/screw- cap does not really need a spring-loaded inner cap, gold-plated trim, or moisture and/or ink-level monitors connected to a built-in Bluetooth transmitter to be fit for purpose as a writing instrument, even if some users may find those features useful, appealing, or otherwise make the pen a better product. Would you call the absence of such features on a particular pen to be "a cost saving measure", though?

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

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Thanks for all the replies. I am starting to believe it’s a cost saving measure. Easier to not bother tipping than to shape the blob to a stub.

 

Whereas the more expensive gold & palladium are just that —more expensive. Thus they merit the extra work involved to make a tipped stub (not to mention the durability factor).

Steel "stubs" are more often italic nibs rather than stubs. Gold stubs are rarely proper italic nibs, but are more suited to handwriting. I don't think it's cost saving, I think it's more related to what people have traditionally used those nibs for.

Instagram @inkysloth

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Thanks both for that. It'd be really interesting to see Jowo/Bock/Lamy 1.1 nib sharpened to a crisp italic. I recently bought a whetstone to sharpen my kitchen knives, and sharpening steel nibs seems like a similar process.

I sharpened the 1.1mm nib on my TWSBI Eco, and it's still no where near as crisp as a dip nib... maybe someone braver than I am could take it thinner!

 

50266318828_5083186a5a.jpg1.1mm nib comparison by Robin Inkysloth, on Flickr

 

50266978511_9912b45f84.jpg1.1mm nibs side on by Robin Inkysloth, on Flickr

 

 

Instagram @inkysloth

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moisture and/or ink-level monitors connected to a built-in Bluetooth transmitter

 

We need this, and it should be linked to your smart device to send you an alert when you are running low. :)

Edited by MadAsAHatter
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Sharpening an ordinary "italic" fountain pen nib to a proper crisp italic can take considerable effort using manual tools as the amount of material that needs to be removed is greater due to the nib usually being of much thicker stock compared to dip nibs.

Btw. you do not actually have to make it thinner but instead grind the tip to a square profile (when viewed from the side and top) so that the edge in contact with paper is a 90° one and the corners also as close to that (a bit of rounding there makes it more forgiving). I might actually give one of my stubby 1.1. mm italic nibs a go tonight and post a before and after pic of that... Just wish I had kit for streaming stuff, might make for an entertaining session. :D

 

I sharpened the 1.1mm nib on my TWSBI Eco, and it's still no where near as crisp as a dip nib... maybe someone braver than I am could take it thinner!

Edited by mana
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Steel "stubs" are more often italic nibs rather than stubs. Gold stubs are rarely proper italic nibs, but are more suited to handwriting. I don't think it's cost saving, I think it's more related to what people have traditionally used those nibs for.

Have you been exposed to the Aurora "italic" gold nibs? Those things are wood chisels! Even the common steel italic nibs (the ones found in things like Sheaffer and Staedtler calligraphy sets) are more suited for hand-writing. In my view, if it is under 0.8mm wide and has about a 3x or less thick vs thin ratio, and doesn't have chisel sharpness, it is a stub (my 18K Vanishing Point stub is 0.6 by 0.2). Wider than that but without chisel is a "cursive italic". Those Auroras -- what I class "formal italic". My (older model) Stipula Passaporto italic is 0.9 by 0.2, but suited for hand-writing. My Lamy 1.1 Joy -- OTOH, is closer to a stub... In my test it only put down a 0.8 by 0.4!

Edited by BaronWulfraed
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Thanks for all the replies. I am starting to believe it’s a cost saving measure. Easier to not bother tipping than to shape the blob to a stub.

 

Whereas the more expensive gold & palladium are just that —more expensive. Thus they merit the extra work involved to make a tipped stub (not to mention the durability factor).

I believe that is the reason. Steel nibs need to be cheap. You expect to pay $15 to 30 for one, tipping and then grinding would add cost beyond acceptable.

On EF to B only tipping and polishing is needed.

 

I'm unhappy about that too, as I much prefer gold stubs with tipping (Stipula, Bexley, Visconti...)

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