Buying a Namiki Vanishing Point ..... but

[Daniel Shih]

"when it writes"...Do I sense in that, Daniel, that you are not all that impressed with the writing of your VP M nib?

Well, I really can't complain--a generous Pentracer offered a free medium nib on the Yellow Board in a thread on Vanishing Points, and I was lucky enough to send the first e-mail to claim it.

 

The main problem is that it's a hard starter. After a couple of hours, it takes a wet tissue to get it going again. That said, the medium nib is buttery smooth--almost too smooth for my tastes. To be honest, I really didn't spend much time trying to get the medium nib to work, because I prefer the fine nib. While very smooth, the fine nib offers a hint of tooth due to its small amount of tipping, giving me more control when writing.

 

Roger, my experience with the medium nib seems to be an anomaly, so if you can't stand a fine nib that writes like an EF and instead prefer a fine/medium nib, I'd say go for the medium. Either way, getting a Vanishing Point is a good decision. What a workhorse!

Edited August 3, 2005 by Daniel Shih

[Roger]

Well, I really can't complain--a generous Pentracer offered a free medium nib on the Yellow Board in a thread on Vanishing Points, and I was lucky enough to send the first e-mail to claim it. 

 

The main problem is that it's a hard starter.  After a couple of hours, it takes a wet tissue to get it going again.  That said, the medium nib is buttery smooth--almost too smooth for my tastes.  To be honest, I really didn't spend much time trying to get the medium nib to work, because I prefer the fine nib.  While very smooth, the fine nib offers a hint of tooth due to its small amount of tipping, giving me more control when writing.

 

Roger, my experience with the medium nib seems to be an anomaly, so if you can't stand a fine nib that writes like an EF and instead prefer a fine/medium nib, I'd say go for the medium.  Either way, getting a Vanishing Point is a good decision.  What a workhorse!

Interesting and thanks, Daniel.

 

For general, everyday writing, I prefer the typical Euro/Amer F line, so that's why I'm interested in the VP M nib. Of course, at $14.00 per from Pam, it's cheap enough to try several. Since I hadn't heard of the M being a hard starter after a short rest, I'm wondering if it is an anomaly in your example?

 

I have a Sailor Magellan that I bet you would like. It has the F nib which writes a lovely EF size line, and the flow is right on medium and wonderfully consistent, page to page. It is smooth, but with just enough tooth to let you know what you're doing. For everyday, though, it's a bit too fine for me. Marginal notes would be my use for it, but how often do I make marginal notes?

[southpaw]

VP's have a reputation for starting right up, especially after an initial break-in period. My new VP medium (still on it's first tank of WM Blue-Black) takes just a very short time to get going (one or two small strokes is enough) and then it is buttery smoooooooth - probably one of the smoothest I have (it's close between the VP medium, which is more like a fine, and my Bexley and Danitrio mediums, which are true mediums). After finishing this tankful in the medium, I'm going to ink my fine, hoping it's really an EF.

[Roger]

VP's have a reputation for starting right up, especially after an initial break-in period.  My new VP medium (still on it's first tank of WM Blue-Black) takes just a very short time to get going (one or two small strokes is enough) and then it is buttery smoooooooth - probably one of the smoothest I have (it's close between the VP medium, which is more like a fine, and my Bexley and Danitrio mediums, which are true mediums).  After finishing this tankful in the medium, I'm going to ink my fine, hoping it's really an EF.

Another Wim apostle with the WM B/B break-in ink, eh? I think you and I came under Wim's influence at about the same point in time, SP.

 

Oh, I know another thing I wanted to ask about the VP. I've heard that the converter holds a rather small amount of ink. True or not?

 

Also, is the converter furnished with it a twist type? I understand there is an aerometric (squeeze to fill) converter available, also. Is it just as skimpy on volume?

[wimg]

Hi Roger,

 

Since your're so full of it (questions of course, what else ), I'd thought I'd answer one or two , and provide some comments if so required .

Another Wim apostle with the WM B/B break-in ink, eh? I think you and I came under Wim's influence at about the same point in time, SP.

Nah, Southpaw was here a few months earlier at the least . More time for brainwashing .

 

Oh, I know another thing I wanted to ask about the VP. I've heard that the converter holds a rather small amount of ink. True or not?

Yes, but it does last long enough. It is about a standard international cartridge full. The advantage of course is that you get to change inks sooner...

 

Also, is the converter furnished with it a twist type?

Yes, a cute, tiny little piston converter.

I understand there is an aerometric (squeeze to fill) converter available, also. Is it just as skimpy on volume?

It holds probably about 1 3/4 times as much, but is a little difficult to fill completely. And they are not so easy to come by as the complete nib/feed/converter assemblies.

 

Regarding some of your questions in other posts:

 

Generally, they are very easy starters, no problem whatsoever. Considering the small feeds (on the outside of the metal tube anyway) it is amazing they don't dry out faster than they do (they only do after about 2 to 4 weeks of non-use). I did some experiments, as I have a few spare assemblies .

 

Regarding nib sizes, IMO they are only at most half a size smaller than regular sizes. So a B is an M-B, an M is an F-M, and an F is just a little narrower than an F, but not really an EF. Obviously, it depends on the inks used, too, as they are slightly wetter writers, than, let's say, Stipula Etrurias .

 

HTH, warm regards, Wim

[KCat]

i think, for the most part, Daniel's experience is a bit of an anomaly. both my nibs start right up and the F has been a bit neglected of late. She still starts right up though. I've got Levenger Cobalt in that pen - an ink that is known for getting pretty saturated if left in an unused pen for a while. So I was pleased with it's performance in the VP F. i suppose it's more accurate to say, I am pleased with the nib's performance.

 

Likewise, my "M" nib is a equally as consistent. I have a noodler's ink in it that has given me problems in other pens (or at least, i thought it was the ink - i'm starting to think it was the pens.) The M is deliciously smooth and has been flawless since I got it er.. about a month ago? I have probably said in this thread already that it writes as a fine. I wouldn't even say F-M but a true Fine by my standards. While the F is definitely very fine - XF and approaching XXF depending on the ink. With the Cobalt it's probably closer to an XXF though I haven't tried to measure it formally. It is also very smooth - of course, as such a fine nib you will get more feedback from it but it's not scratchy at all.

 

the nibs are yellow gold - but they are a very light yellow-gold and perhaps part of the confusion is because the yellow-gold accents on the pens are rather dark yellow-gold compared to most. And if I didn't have good lighting, I'd be fooled into thinking the nib is "white gold."

[cmeisenzahl]

My M VP works quite well. But I've read several comemnts from people that their nibs make a squeeking noise for some reason when writing.

 

Hopefully, they're silent when not writing. ;-)

 

Chris

[southpaw]

Another Wim apostle with the WM B/B break-in ink, eh?

 

Who, me???? Following Wim, the Mad Dutchman??? :blink: :blink:

 

Actually, I was using WM Florida Blue until a week or two ago when I got my first bottle of WM B-B and figured I'd give it a go and use it to break in a few new pens.

 

But to be serious for a moment (and just for a moment), YES, Wim and many others here at FPN have taught this newbie much about fps and I am very grateful for their expertise, their willingness to share it, and their patience with an uninitiated and somewhat slow learner.

[KCat]

My M VP works quite well. But I've read several comemnts from people that their nibs make a squeeking noise for some reason when writing.

 

Hopefully, they're silent when not writing. ;-)

 

Chris

Chris, my VP medium "sang" when I first started using it. First thing I did was switch inks. the Pilot ink that came with it just didn't lubricate the nib as well as the other inks I normally use. This reduced the singing about 50%. Also, it squeaked slick papers and since it's sooo smooth, I find it feels great on rougher papers and it doesn't sing on them.

 

Some squeaks are caused by tines rubbing together too tightly. in this case, I am 99.9% certain that the singing was caused by the highly polished tipping and the ink being a bit too thin.

 

the F never squeaked and of course, has less contact with the paper therefore less of that highly-polished feel.

 

mine are not silent when not writing - they call to me often these days - "you know you want to use us - put that Pelikan down just for a little while, please."

[Roger]

Since your're so full of it (questions of course, what else ),

Oh, I'm full of that, too!

I'd thought I'd answer one or two , and provide some comments if so required .

Not required, but much appreciated. What with your personal loss and then the damn semi flood, I've been avoiding soliciting your opinions as much, thinking that you would let it be know when you're ready for the full assault! You seem to be working back in an orderly fashion.

Nah, Southpaw was here a few months earlier at the least . More time for brainwashing .

Yeah, I know he's been on the board longer than I have, but he was gentlemanly and stayed in the shadows as a newbie, whereas, I came in and started to make the usual stupid newbie moves with gusto. Now, you'll notice, I'm sure, how much more sophisticated SP and me are. Heck, SP even gives some advice, now.

It holds probably about 1 3/4 times as much, but is a little difficult to fill completely. And they are not so easy to come by as the complete nib/feed/converter assemblies.

Assemblies? I thought that the VP nibs were just replacable nibs. Pam can't be selling an entire nib/feed/converter assembly for $14.00.

Regarding some of your questions in other posts:

 

Generally, they are very easy starters, no problem whatsoever. Considering the small feeds (on the outside of the metal tube anyway) it is amazing they don't dry out faster than they do (they only do after about 2 to 4 weeks of non-use). I did some experiments, as I have a few spare assemblies .

Ok. More evidence that maybe Daniel's is the exception.

Regarding nib sizes, IMO they are only at most half a size smaller than regular sizes. So a B is an M-B, an M is an F-M, and an F is just a little narrower than an F, but not really an EF. Obviously, it depends on the inks used, too, as they are slightly wetter writers, than, let's say, Stipula Etrurias .

Gotcha! Jives with Pam's thinking that they are all a bit finer than the same marked Amer/Euro marked. From B right through F.

 

Harking back: Clarify for me the converter. Is it a removable converter as we normally think of converters? Your use of assembly stopped me. I think of an assembly as a unit fabricated so that further disassembly is not possible or, at least, discouraged.

 

Lastly, if a normal converter, can it be replaced with the Pelikan converter or must one procure the VP converter?

 

If I could just get one of these blasted things in my hands, I wouldn't have to ask all these stupid newbie questions. But of course, I'l probably ruin it by tugging on a converter that isn't supposed to be tugged on!

[Leslie J.]

I have the aerometric filler (pen came with it, from FPH), the piston converter (ordered from Pam braun), and I refill carts. I find the carts hold the most amount of ink, maybe because as Wim suggests, the aerometric filler requires more finessing. And yes, the converters are removable, but they seat very firmly, more firmly than any other converters I've used. The converters are proprietary I believe, and they are small.

 

Yes, Pam sells the nib units for $14 + tax, I ordered and received a very smooth and wettish M from her. She will dip test the nib for smoothness if you like.

 

My pen came with a F nib that I had trouble with at first. After I got my M nib unit, I decided to fiddle with the F. I did a few fingernail adjustments, and presto, it's a F wet writer. Now I use it almost all the time, instead of the M nib. As Wim also said, with certain inks on nice paper, it gives an XF line. But I mostly use recylced paper for everyday stuff, and it's not too fine for that. You can't go too wrong really, since these nibs are so inexpensive to change. Probably a M might be a more universally preferred nib unless you usually like a fine line.

Edited August 3, 2005 by Leslie J.

[Guest Denis Richard]

Hi Roger,

 

A picture is worth a thousand posts

 

http://www.riverapens.com/Vanishing_Point_images/VP02Oct_Exp.jpg

 

The converter is removable, as on any regular c/c filler.

 

Denis.

 

Edit : Pic from RiveraPens.com

Edited August 3, 2005 by Denis Richard

[southpaw]

he was gentlemanly and stayed in the shadows as a newbie, whereas, I came in and started to make the usual stupid newbie moves with gusto. Now, you'll notice, I'm sure, how much more sophisticated SP and me are. Heck, SP even gives some advice, now.

 

Roger, if you look at some of my earlier posts, they were also full of newbie mistakes, stupidity, etc.

 

Sophisticated????? Me?????:blink:

 

Regarding the advice, it's worth what is paid for it -- zilch (except when I'm regurgitating what Wim has said ).

 

Seriously now, on the VP I just received from Pam, the VP nib units come in one piece with the converter (piston type), and from the looks of them, disassembly is possible but not as easy as with some. And yes, she is selling the nib/converter/feed assembly for $14 - I got an extra one with my VP.

 

And here's another piece of sophisticated, gentlemanly advice for you - stop flappin' yer jaw (or fingers) and jist git one !

 

 

Edit: look at all the posts while I was posting! Dennis was quicker on the camera draw - nicely done.

Edited August 3, 2005 by southpaw

[Guest Denis Richard]

I added credits for the pic. I always forget

 

The great thing is that for $14 a piece, with a 14k nib, disassembly is not really an issue anymore.

 

All that talk makes me want to try a medium and a fine, to complement my Arabic.

 

Edit :

 

And a great link, where the earlier pic is from : Pilot Vanishing Point Pen History

 

And another one : Pilot Web Site with the Capless versions sold in Japan

Edited August 3, 2005 by Denis Richard

[southpaw]

Denis - two questions (just to show my newbie expertise): what is an Arabic nib, and where did you get it? Any chance of a writing sample (I know that's the third question, but )?

[Guest Denis Richard]

SP,

 

an Arabic is a nib with a tip that is narrow and long. You see how a stub is ? Arabic is exactly the contrary. The result is wide horizontal and narrow vertical strokes.

 

I ground this one myself (the broad VP nib is just calling for it, with all that iridium ! ), but any Nibmeister will do it I guess.

 

Link : Richard Binder's Glossary entry for Arabic

 

I'll try to take a pic of a sample tonight.

 

Denis.

[southpaw]

Denis - thanks. I found Richard's info also. Just curious - do you use it for Arabic writing, or just for a change of pace to an italic? I'm interested because of the way I write (basically a mirror image of a right-handed person), a normal italic nib ends up reversing the thick and thin sections of the letters. This might be a neat solution. . . .

[Guest Denis Richard]

SP,

 

Even though I have some North African blood, few generations back, you would be up to a great challenge to try getting any Arabic sign out of me

 

I use it as I would an Italic, simply to add character to my writing. Before I knew that Richard calls it an Arabic, I was simply calling it a contra-stub

 

Denis.

[wimg]

Roger,

 

No the VP converter cannot be replaced with any other but a VP converter, either piston or squeeze. Nothing else will fit (ok, a Pilot cartridge will).

 

Oh, that reminds me, the pen comes with a kind of little metal cage, and it may just flabbergast you as to the reason why it is included. However, don't throw it away. You need it in conjunction with a cartridge, it fits right over, and serves to make sure the click mechanism doesn't compress the cartridge too much, and potentially splits it. This has the potential to result in a minor flooding disaster otherwise .

 

Warm regards, Wim

[wimg]

Hi Southpaw,

 

An arabic may just do the trick for you, as it is an italic turned 90 degrees. Just be aware that it will be slightly wetter than a normal italic, if it isn't adjusted. Because the split is lengthwise, it can carry relatively more ink than a standard italic nib.

 

Warm regards, Wim