Jump to content
Classifieds is broken, please do not submit any new ads ×

Pelikan Nib Exchange - Amazon Global Uk



shawnee

Recommended Posts

Hi guys,

 

So I'm the newbie Pelikan owner who bought a Souveran M600 with an M nib from Amazon Global UK because the price was great and everyone in this forum raved about how awesome the M600 is (I'm coming over from being a Montblanc owner, be nice). Problem is this: my handwriting is small and the M nib is waaaaay too wet even using Pelikan's 4001 royal blue and Montblanc's midnight blue ink.

 

So I reached out to Chartpak to do a nib exchange and lo and behold, they're not going to honor a nib exchange on a pen purchased outside of the US, which makes me wonder what they do about Americans who buy pens abroad and then come home, but whatever . . . .

 

At this point, the pen is driving me a bit nuts because while I do like it, the M nib is practically unusable for me.

 

What are my options at this point?

 

Nibmeister and a grind?

Purchase a new F nib and be bitter?

 

I really wanted to fall in love with Pelikan but now, not so much (I also bought a P205 which I returned because it was super scratchy)

 

UGH.

 

Shawnee

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 32
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • shawnee

    11

  • Bo Bo Olson

    4

  • A Smug Dill

    3

  • Tasmith

    2

Top Posters In This Topic

Posted Images

At this point, the pen is driving me a bit nuts because while I do like it, the M nib is practically unusable for me.

 

What are my options at this point?

 

Nibmeister and a grind?

Purchase a new F nib and be bitter?

 

 

Purchase a new F nib and be bitter happy because you now have a spare nib to be ground to you liking at a later date.

 

Howzat?

Edited by Karmachanic

"Simplicate and add Lightness."

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Purchase a new F nib and be bitter happy because you now have a spare nib to be ground to you liking at a later date.

 

Howzat?

 

Better than I was feeling like 5 minutes ago. LOL. Do you have any recommendations on a reputable dealer to buy a nib from? I don't want to return the pen because I really want to give Pelikan a go. There are so many fans that I feel like I'm missing something. This M600 was my shot into the fold, but man, talk about being frustrated.

 

Sorry, I'm ranting. It's a bad FP day here.

 

shawnee

Link to post
Share on other sites

Contact Pelikan Hanover. They will speak English.

 

Go EF, the modern 400/600 semi-nail is Pelikan nib is a double round ball (Ball above and below the nib tip) with a fat tip. Made so that ball point crossovers, don't have to waste three minutes of their time and learn to hold a fountain pen, and continue to hold it like a ball point.

It is semi-nail, so it is harder to bend. The nib is rounder and is butter smooth....good, unless you get baby bottom....from a too polished nib. Not a particularly clean line.

So if M is too wide for you, F will be too.

 

 

Other alternatives, buy a gold plated 200's regular flex nib. It is a nice springy regular flex nib, that is 1/2 width narrower than modern, and has an 'oblong', non-ball nib. A nice comfortable ride and a vintage/semi-vintage clean line. State side price @ $41...saw a much cheaper price from England. 13-15 pounds or so? That price was cheaper than Germany......how ever I'm quite satisfied with my M nibs. I did order a marbled brown 200 in EF....in I needed an editor pen. I'm not heavy into narrower than western F.

 

As you can tell I don't like the fat and blobby modern Pelikan nibs. I do like the semi-vintage '82-97 regular flex nibs be that in gold or steel. :thumbup: The 200's nib remained that.

 

Next alternative, a bit more expensive....You can of course get a regular flex gold '400's nib from the '80-90's....that I don't see as any better at all than the 200's nib. I claim that era's steel and gold nibs = to the 200. (well, the 200 is from '87-88-now)

 

My advice is to spend about half as much as you would on a new 600's nib and get a vintage '50-65 semi-flex 14 K nib. :notworthy1: It too like the semi-vintage is 1/2 a width narrower than modern. It is monotone gold.....so is the 200's gold plating. It don't matter you have a better nib, either of the three ways.

 

But if you have any bit of a heavy hand a semi-flex F will write to an M until you develop a lighter Hand. It took me three months, to stop maxing the nib all the time.

An EF is rarer so will cost more. A F will do fine, is easier to find.

 

I had an early '50's B nib on my 605 for the longest time, until I finally got the BB nib I swapped for from an M, in some day I was going to make it a stub or CI. I made it a 1.0 stub. (should have made it a 0.8, but I didn't really know wat 1.0 was in real size. :(

The semi-flex B..... :notworthy1: Semi-flex is a flair nib not a flex nib. Due to ease of tine bend and spread, the first letter or a crossed T will be a tad wider, giving you that old fashioned fountain pen flair. It is line variation, On Demand, if you have a light Hand.

 

The nib can be made a F stub....which will give you some flair...always, with out doing anything.

 

....personally I would see more use out of a M in Cursive italic than an F......but if you really like narrow, then that could do the trick. Do send a bit of writing and a picture of how you hold the pen, in CI needs a bit more precise hold than a stub.

 

You can have a nibmeister make it EF....western......or go Japanese EF which is a XXF....needle point.

 

Pelikan's feed and nib is designed for a dry ink....so normally is a wet writer. R&K makes nice dry inks also.

The right paper will make any of your pens write 1/2 a width narrower.

Edited by Bo Bo Olson

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

RIP...200's once great nib, now a double ball.:crybaby::wallbash:

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

You could also post a want to trade ad here and at other sites to see if someone can help out.

 

I'd rather a grind than a new nib as you can better dictate flow and writing characteristics. A new, narrower nib may not be perfect to your liking out of the gate.

If you want less blah, blah, blah and more pictures, follow me on Instagram!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's a writing sample. As an author, I write in journals every day with my FPs. I have a tendency to use Italian journals with hand-made papers. I'm currently using a Manufactus Incision. The paper has a bit more tooth than say a Paperblank journal.

 

In the sample, I've written with 3 separate pens - the MB 145 with an 'F' nib still has the best feel and line size for me. I know it's not fair to throw the Lamy Safari in there, but it's the only other pen I have inked at the moment.

 

 

post-121617-0-37322700-1548188319_thumb.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

As BoBo says, Pelikan's gold nibs write a size broader than the equivalent steel nib. So a gold fine nib is equivalent to a steel medium nib in width.

 

If you use a Lamy fine, you probably want a gold EF nib. The pelikan M600 F nib will probably be about the equivalent of a Lamy medium.

You have a choice:

The gold m400 nibs are slightly cheaper than the M600 nibs and you won't really notice the slight difference in length.

 

Else, get a medium or fine steel M200 nib and store the original nib and save quite a bit of money.

 

Pelikan's steel M200 nibs are a lot springier than their M series gold nibs and are just as nice to write with.

 

The nice thing about the M2XX/M4XX/M6XX Pelikans is that you can swap nibs between pens with ease. The only caveat when swapping nibs is to make sure you soak the nib up to the section to loosen any dried ink first and then grip the nib as close to the section as possible with the thumb on the top of the nib and a finger on the feed so as not to twist the nib in the feed.

Link to post
Share on other sites

1. Sell it, try again with a smaller nib.

2. Try less absorbent paper, like Clairefontaine or Rhodia; it will take longer to dry.

3. Some inks might look better with broader nibs.

"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt."

 

B. Russell

Link to post
Share on other sites

Pelikan nibs run wide historically. Im sorry that you found that out the hard way. Chartpak only supports pens purchased domestically from authorized retailers. Buying a new nib to swap is gonna be the more expensive route and you still may have a wider line than you are looking for. Id say your best bet is to go for a custom grind from a nib meister. Thatll be the cheapest route and likely lead to the most satisfaction. I have a fine CI from an M nib that I love. Think about it. There is a lot to love with Pelikan if you can get the line you like.

Edited by sargetalon

PELIKAN - Too many birds in the flock to count. My pen chest has proven to be a most fertile breeding ground.

fpn_1508261203__fpn_logo_300x150.jpg

THE PELIKAN'S PERCH - A growing reference site for all things Pelikan

Link to post
Share on other sites

Pelikan makes a dry ink in the 4001 inks.....and some Edelsteine inks. So makes a wet nib and faster feed.

 

Waterman makes a wet ink so make a thin nib and slow feed, for it's wetter ink.

Both Pelikan and Waterman then meet in the middle, in a mix of wet and dry.

 

All pen companies that make their own ink match their ink to their nib and feed.

 

Slick paper as suggested will make the pen write @ 1/2 a width narrower.

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

RIP...200's once great nib, now a double ball.:crybaby::wallbash:

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have sent out 6 or 8 Pelikan nibs to be ground and they are without a doubt my favorite/best nibs, even counting all the MB nibs I own (I love the MBs for other reasons). I agree with sargetalon, sending it out and getting it perfect the first time would be the cheapest and surest.

"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working." -Pablo Picasso


Link to post
Share on other sites
sirgilbert357

Pelikan makes a dry ink in the 4001 inks.....and some Edelsteine inks. So makes a wet nib and faster feed.

 

Waterman makes a wet ink so make a thin nib and slow feed, for it's wetter ink.

Both Pelikan and Waterman then meet in the middle, in a mix of wet and dry.

 

All pen companies that make their own ink match their ink to their nib and feed.

 

Slick paper as suggested will make the pen write @ 1/2 a width narrower.

 

 

I feel compelled to offer the following, since there is a newbie reading this thread...

 

Pelikan's 4001 inks are drier than their Edelstein inks, and there is variation even within the Edelstein inks. Topaz acted wetter for me than Tanzanite, for example. But both were wetter than 4001 Black. Smoky Quartz is just a tad wetter than 4001 Black, but takes longer to dry. All flowed well in each Pelikan (and other pens) I tried them in.

 

It seems to me that all pen companies do not make their inks to work *only* in their pens. That was probably the focus 40 - 60 years ago. You think Pelikan assumes every bottle of Edelstein they sell is going into a Pelikan pen? No way. So they make their ink to be used in as many pens as possible. We see a huge variety of inks that work in a huge variety of pens and vice versa. The pen and ink makers know to make inks that work across a wide variety of conditions, and the pen's feed is designed to account for differences in wetness of inks and still control the flow. You sell more ink if it works in more pens!

 

Tine gap, baby's bottom, feed to nib clearance, and bottlenecks at the converter nipple preventing air exchange all also contribute to ink wetness -- sometimes much more than the ink itself! You can put a gusher of an ink in a pen with a bad nib and get a dry line. But adjust the nib and it can be an amazing writer.

 

To the OP: if you are committed to that paper you are using, then get the nib adjusted. If you are open to other papers, something like Clairefontaine or Rhodia might tighten that line up. I wouldn't change the ink. That's the last thing I do when trying to find that perfect balance between pen, paper and ink. But I dedicate a given ink to a single pen and I always use only Clairefontaine, so yeah...people who frequently change inks across multiple pens might have different advice.

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

I feel compelled to offer the following, since there is a newbie reading this thread...

 

Pelikan's 4001 inks are drier than their Edelstein inks, and there is variation even within the Edelstein inks. Topaz acted wetter for me than Tanzanite, for example. But both were wetter than 4001 Black. Smoky Quartz is just a tad wetter than 4001 Black, but takes longer to dry. All flowed well in each Pelikan (and other pens) I tried them in.

 

It seems to me that all pen companies do not make their inks to work *only* in their pens. That was probably the focus 40 - 60 years ago. You think Pelikan assumes every bottle of Edelstein they sell is going into a Pelikan pen? No way. So they make their ink to be used in as many pens as possible. We see a huge variety of inks that work in a huge variety of pens and vice versa. The pen and ink makers know to make inks that work across a wide variety of conditions, and the pen's feed is designed to account for differences in wetness of inks and still control the flow. You sell more ink if it works in more pens!

 

Tine gap, baby's bottom, feed to nib clearance, and bottlenecks at the converter nipple preventing air exchange all also contribute to ink wetness -- sometimes much more than the ink itself! You can put a gusher of an ink in a pen with a bad nib and get a dry line. But adjust the nib and it can be an amazing writer.

 

To the OP: if you are committed to that paper you are using, then get the nib adjusted. If you are open to other papers, something like Clairefontaine or Rhodia might tighten that line up. I wouldn't change the ink. That's the last thing I do when trying to find that perfect balance between pen, paper and ink. But I dedicate a given ink to a single pen and I always use only Clairefontaine, so yeah...people who frequently change inks across multiple pens might have different advice.

 

On the advice of a Pelikan user here, I got the Pelikan 4001 ink (royal blue and brilliant black) to compensate for the M nib and had really hoped it would do the trick, but it hasn't. As painful as it is, I think I will get an EF or F and see how I get on. Eventually, I will probably have the M nib ground by a meister, but until I have more knowledge and experience, I'm probably going to hold off. I'm just starting the journey and the problem with being a novice with nice pens is the high probability of screwing one of them up. I don't want that to be me. I should've started with more budget pens.

 

But I do think I will like Pelikan *if* I can get to grips with the right damn nib. I love the fact that you can take it apart without special tools and do a nib swap without sending it off for a service. I have 2 MBs right now that will need repair and I have no choice but to send them off.

 

In my defense, I did get a Pelikan P205 with a F nib and hated it and returned it. I don't think I like steel nibs. It was really scratchy.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Real scratchy....means the tines were not aligned....happens during the mailing....world wide.

A Pelikan 200's nib is not scratchy....is good and smooth, the level under butter smooth.

 

Holding a fountain pen behind the big index knuckle cuts down on scratchy also.....held before the big index knuckle like an old fashioned pre-gel/hybrid ball point, helps cause scratchy and digs little grand canyons in the paper.

Those two are 95% of scratchy.

 

One has to learn to align a nib, one needs a loupe, get a cheap Chinese 40X loupe that is = to a 10X good glass one. Not quite as good of course....it's cheap.Sooner or alter you may talk your self into a $35 Belomo. Good for a life time. Bet the replacement cost of a battery for the Chinese one cost more than the loupe.

 

One can misaligned a nib real easy at home.

It's a basic skill, don't take long to learn.........is a tad nervy the first time, by the third it's Ho Humm.

 

Eventually there will be a third time....unless you never drop a pen, bang it on the paper, and always buy at a Brick and Mortar.

Buying by mail = sooner or later, aligning a misaligned nib.

Edited by Bo Bo Olson

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

RIP...200's once great nib, now a double ball.:crybaby::wallbash:

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...

So my M600 EF nib finally arrived.

 

Im sort of on the fence. It definitely is waaaaay better than the M nib but is still a relatively broad line for me. I probably should taken the advice and gotten a steel EF but I really wanted the experience of a gold nib. All and all, it will be a reliable writer, but I think my Pelikan journey is at an end for now. And thats okay. Lots of research still to do.

post-121617-0-50919800-1552261188_thumb.jpeg

Link to post
Share on other sites
Bo Bo Olson

Pressure is one of the factors that increase line width. Most 'noobies' are ham fisted....pressing near as hard as an old ball point....will admit the 'new' gel/hybrid are much smoother and require less pressure. It can take months to get a lighter Hand.

There is nothing wrong with a Safari.....I had one, did give it away to get someone into fountain pens...........it's main fault for me....was it was a nail and I don't care for nail/rigid/manifold nibs.

 

One can do something strange............learn to write larger. :happyberet:

Take two sheets of paper, fold in half. Start with one 'quarter' writing as large as you can....each 'quarter' a bit smaller until you get back to your tiny scribble.

It will then be much easier to write larger.

 

Look for a free line printing template, print out a few sheets of wider than 'collage' wide lines, so one is encouraged to write wider, and see if you can get a size of script that don't close your e's.

 

Inks, there are dryer two toned shading inks....Pelikan, Herbin, MB, R&K, some DA....even some Noodlers.....EF much less the even thinner Japanese EF, are not good for shading inks.

M&F are good widths for two toned shading inks. Where one has written with more pressure there is more ink, and it dries sitting on top of the paper....so there is two tones. :notworthy1: :puddle: 4/5ths of my 60 or so inks are shading inks.

 

There are vivid boring monotone supersaturated inks.

 

There are inks with sheen.......still behind the power curve with that.

Have some glitter inks and wider nibs are needed. So save your 'wide' M nib for that.

 

Many of Noodlers and it is my understanding most Japanese inks are wet. Waterman used to be considered wet a decade ago. Is a great ink to test pens with.

 

You didn't notice any difference when using 4001 inks in width....OK. Many buy a wet pen, a Pelikan and complain that it is too wet, ....but often that is because they are using their normal super wet inks.

 

Goulet(sp) a pen, ink and paper seller, sells ink samples at a fair price.....

 

Writing is 1/3 nib width/flex, 1/3 paper and 1/3 ink, and in that order.

 

Go to Ink Reviews, and read any of Sandy1's :notworthy1: :thumbup: Ink Reviews....She is our First Ink Guru. Her written points of things inks 'do'/should do, will cover many that will be new to you.

She takes 4 normal pens of different widths and 4 different papers and writes with an ink..........it is so astounding what a different nib width, or paper can do to an ink color.

Over the years she has used 7 papers...................I keep saying I got to get some but never do.

Edited by Bo Bo Olson

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

RIP...200's once great nib, now a double ball.:crybaby::wallbash:

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Karmachanic

I second the suggestion on trying different paper. A Clairefontaine Age Bag A5 is inexpensive. I find a marked line difference between that and Tomoe River, for instance.

 

A lot less expensive that trying new nibs!

Edited by Karmachanic

"Simplicate and add Lightness."

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now







×
×
  • Create New...