Jump to content
Classifieds is broken, please do not submit any new ads ×

Do I Need Iron Gall



bozhidarr

Recommended Posts

I will be taking lots of notes in the upcoming 3 years and I need them to be perfectly readable for at least 2 years from the date they are written. The notes will be frequently opened (exposure to sunlight) and I am worried that the ink may fade. My arsenal of inks includes different colours of Diamine and Lamy inks. Do I need Iron Gall ink(have been looking at ESS) to retain readability of my notes, as Noodler's are hard to come by here?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 28
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • amberleadavis

    4

  • Arkanabar

    2

  • Olya

    2

  • Sandy1

    2

As long as you're in that neighborhood, ESS is a great choice, as is Diamine Registrar's ink.

Jeffery

In the Irish Channel of

New Orleans, LA

Link to post
Share on other sites

You definitely don't need iron gall ink for that. Some IGs actually fade terribly over time, esp when exposed to sunlight (eg Rohrer & Klinger IG inks in some tests done by members).

"regular" dye based inks are perfectly fine.

I recommend pigment ink though if you are concerned so much and will only settle for super proof ink, that stuff will hold up to anything, incl sun light. You can either buy pigment ink for FPs (do take care of your pen, but it shouldn't be a problem anyway with just a bit of care) or use uni ball's eye rollerballs, the black & blue ones are filled with pigment ink.

 

I used to use washable blue in school and even though washable blue fades terribly, 99% of what I have left from my school notes is still legible. Also some bits I wrote at university with washable blue (I had switched from washable blue to other inks and pens) are still legible, even though faded. You really needn't worry.

Edited by Olya
Link to post
Share on other sites

A. As said above, you don't need an IG ink for something like that. There are enough permanent inks out there. Check out the posts on fading.

B. If you do want to use an IG ink for anything, don't satrt off with the ESSR ink. It is the second driest IG I've yet entcountered. The very most dry IG ink is Diamine's Registrar's ink. Try out anything else first, like from MB (old stock, Ident.-Nr. 105194) or De Atramentis

Life is too short to drink bad wine (Goethe)

Link to post
Share on other sites

I will be taking lots of notes in the upcoming 3 years and I need them to be perfectly readable for at least 2 years from the date they are written. The notes will be frequently opened (exposure to sunlight) and I am worried that the ink may fade. My arsenal of inks includes different colours of Diamine and Lamy inks. Do I need Iron Gall ink(have been looking at ESS) to retain readability of my notes, as Noodler's are hard to come by here?

 

No, you don't need IG ink for your proposed purpose. Some IG inks aren't at all fade proof. I would recommend you use a saturated dark blue, blue-black or black. :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

:W2FPN:

 

Hi,

 

It very much depends on your notes' basket of risk exposure : loss, exposure to liquids, sunlight, etc.

 

Perhaps one of the greatest hidden risks is exposure to acid-laden paper.

 

This Topic has considerable discussion: https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/265201-inky-t-o-d-have-you-ever-had-an-ink-fade/

 

As for inky recommendations, I'm very comfy with iron-gall ink, and accept the increased diligence in handling those inks.

(My field notes, which are source documents, are written in I-G ink; and the Document Controller is fine with that.)

 

There are also numerous simple aniline dye inks with admirable properties: perhaps most notably the basic Pilot/Namiki Blue and Blue-Black (economical when ordered from Japan in the 350ml size), Sheaffer Skrip BlBl, Diamine Sappire, the essential Pelikan 4001 BlBk (When you're out of P4BlBK, you're out of ink.) Plus many others. If a 2nd colour for mark-up seems a good idea, then R&K Sepia and Peiikan Edelstein Topaz might fit the bill.

 

Kindly avoid the Washable inks, which are inherently unstable. e.g Pelikan Royal Blue, Waterman Serenity, Lamy Blue, et al.

 

I invite you to avail yourself of the resources in the Ink Review Forum.

 

Also, be your own Archivist: take photos of your new work on a daily basis, then heave those files into a Cloud.

 

Bye,

S1

 

__ __

 

Quite frankly and with respect, I have no idea why one would have their origianl notes exposed to sunlight for an expended period. (make a photocopy for that purpose.)

Sometimes I work on an A0 sheet (portable white board) that's on a draughting table for days on end in an office/installation illuminated by natural light, and have found no problem.

 

That said, I wonder if an FP is the best tool for mark-making on work that is continuously exposed to direct sunlight. Sharpies can be your best friend.

 

As ever it is up to you to pick and choose - FPN Members are exceptional enablers.

 

:)

Edited by Sandy1

The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Platinum has a newish line of IG inks they call "classic." I am using their Cassis IG ink and love it, great color and very well behaved.

A nice review of the Cassis ink here https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/319275-platinum-classic-ink-cassis-black-iron-gall/

You can see all the classic colors at this store's website https://www.penchalet.com/blog/platinum-classic-ink/

"It's funny; in this era of email and voice mail and all those things that I did not even grow up with, a plain old paper letter takes on amazing intimacy."  Elizabeth Kostova

 

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I am a frequent user of over eight or nine different iron gall inks, and enjoy using them greatly. I used Diamine Registrars for a good deal of my college notes, and its lasted just fine ten years later. My one recommendation would be to use a wet writing pen so that you lay a nice line of ink on the paper, the more iron gall that is laid down the more UV and waterproof it is. One additional quality that benefits using iron gall ink for college notes, especially Diamine Registrars and ESSRI, is that they will work on a wider quality of paper than most other fountain pen inks.

 

Regular aniline dye inks will generally last though, I took a good number of my notes with Diamine Woodland Green, Monanco Red, Umber, Steel Blue, China Blue, Chocolate, Grey, Golden Brown, Violet and they have all lasted a similar ten years so far.

Edited by JakobS

FP Ink Orphanage-Is an ink not working with your pens, not the color you're looking for, is never to see the light of day again?!! If this is you, and the ink is in fine condition otherwise, don't dump it down the sink, or throw it into the trash, send it to me (payment can be negotiated), and I will provide it a nice safe home with love, and a decent meal of paper! Please PM me!<span style='color: #000080'>For Sale:</span> TBA

Link to post
Share on other sites
BlazeOrangeGuy

Montblanc Permanent Blue

Montblanc Permanent Black

De-Atramentis Permanent Inks

Sailor Kiwa-Guro

Platinum Carbon Black

 

All of these should be available in Europe, I would think.

Link to post
Share on other sites

When I saw your question, my first thought was, "Everyone needs iron gall!" Rohrer & Klingner Scabiosa is one of my favorite inks.

 

Some members of this forum have put considerable effort into discovering which inks are least likely to fade when exposed to sunlight. A search for "fade test" is likely to yield abundant information on that subject.

Link to post
Share on other sites

:W2FPN:

 

Hi,

 

It very much depends on your notes' basket of risk exposure : loss, exposure to liquids, sunlight, etc.

 

Perhaps one of the greatest hidden risks is exposure to acid-laden paper.

 

This Topic has considerable discussion: https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/265201-inky-t-o-d-have-you-ever-had-an-ink-fade/

 

As for inky recommendations, I'm very comfy with iron-gall ink, and accept the increased diligence in handling those inks.

(My field notes, which are source documents, are written in I-G ink; and the Document Controller is fine with that.)

 

There are also numerous simple aniline dye inks with admirable properties: perhaps most notably the basic Pilot/Namiki Blue and Blue-Black (economical when ordered from Japan in the 350ml size), Sheaffer Skrip BlBl, Diamine Sappire, the essential Pelikan 4001 BlBk (When you're out of P4BlBK, you're out of ink.) Plus many others. If a 2nd colour for mark-up seems a good idea, then R&K Sepia and Peiikan Edelstein Topaz might fit the bill.

 

Kindly avoid the Washable inks, which are inherently unstable. e.g Pelikan Royal Blue, Waterman Serenity, Lamy Blue, et al.

 

I invite you to avail yourself of the resources in the Ink Review Forum.

 

Also, be your own Archivist: take photos of your new work on a daily basis, then heave those files into a Cloud.

 

Bye,

S1

From where and how do you order from Japan? All websites I have found don't ship internationally

Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't recommend washable ink at all, actually I avoid that at all cost :D

Just that as washable blue has remained legible (just about in some cases/ pages), then normal (dye based) inks won't be a problem at all.

 

You can order from Japan via ebay or amazon. Search for what you want to buy and you can see a list of sellers and their prices (on amazon for example) and where they ship from. Use your regular amazon site, no need to go on the japanese version, but you can use japanese amazon as well, you just need a credit card. You can order from Rakuten as well.

 

PS Which sites don't ship internationally?

Edited by Olya
Link to post
Share on other sites

From where and how do you order from Japan? All websites I have found don't ship internationally

 

Hi,

 

Not to plump a Vendor, we have this eb@y entry : https://www.ebay.com/p/Pilot-Fountain-Pen-Blue-Black-Ink-350ml-Ink350bb/1444985324

They seem to offer free intl shipping.

 

G00gle searchwords: "ebay Pilot Blue 350ml" returned other Vendors, offering wonders other than ink.

 

​I also found that our good friends at The Writing Desk had smaller bottles of Namiki Blue on offer. https://www.thewritingdesk.co.uk/?r=2ca4 , so maybe check for restocking date.

 

>> Beware the Pixel Pixies, who will add things to your Shopping Cart in the blink of an eye. (Oi, this Pilot Custom 74 with an SFM nib is a stowaway!?!, but welcome aboard.)

 

Bye,

S1

Edited by Sandy1

The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

No, you don't need Iron Gall inks or "permanent" inks. They are a solution in search of a problem.

 

Opening and closing a notebook is not enough to cause ink to fade. I shifted back to fountain pens in 2008 or 2009; all of my work notes are intact, unchanged. I whip through a notebook a month.

 

I still have essays from the '60s...no fading. All written in Sheaffer Skrip Washable Black.

Washington Nationals 2019: the fight for .500; "stay in the fight"; WON the fight

Link to post
Share on other sites
Sasha Royale

Everyday-use ink of the American Colonial period was usually water, alcohol, and lamp black (soot). Iron Gall ink is permanent ink of Eighteenth Century technology. In three hundred years, there has been much progress in permanent inks. Unless the written text is to be displayed in a sunny window, I don't think three years is a long time for ink on paper.

 

Why not post an address, with a request, such as "Please send me a postcard, with name of ink and date. I want to observe the endurance of the ink, over the next few years." Keep the cards in an envelope, in a drawer. Worse case : Everybody ignores you. I would wager that you get responses.

 

FYI : A "postcard" is a card stock letter, with front and back, but no insides. Maximum dimensions are 6" X 4¼" , with "6" being the length. Postage is 34¢ .

Edited by Sasha Royale

Auf freiem Grund mit freiem Volke stehn.
Zum Augenblicke dürft ich sagen:
Verweile doch, du bist so schön !

Link to post
Share on other sites

Methinks you worry too much. My desk sits in front of south facing windows. I leave material exposed on the desk for weeks, if not months, and have not problem with fading. I am also at 7,000 feet where the sun is far more intense then at sea level. I use my notebooks outside (patio, camping, in the garden, in the forest) and up to 12,000-13,000 feet with no fading. Use quality ink and relax. I checked my notebooks from twenty years ago and there was no fading.

 

I only wish the notes i kept on computer lasted as long but alias programs change, technology changes, etc. My electronic notes from then are long gone.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I only wish the notes i kept on computer lasted as long but alias programs change, technology changes, etc. My electronic notes from then are long gone.

This is why I prefer to keep computerized information in plain text files, as these tend to remain rather stable, especially in Linux/Unix. But the one file type which ought never to become obsolete is FITS.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Also have a look at the Koh-i-Noor Document inks. Available in Blue and Black (as well as non-document Blue, Black, Red). I use the Blue regularly, and it is an excellent, well-behaved ink.

 

You can also get the Blackstone Barrister permanent inks from Appelboom or Bureau Direct

 

Pelikan Blue-Black is also said to be permanent, as are Pilot Blue, Black and Blue-Black.

fpn_1412827311__pg_d_104def64.gif




“Them as can do has to do for them as can’t.


And someone has to speak up for them as has no voices.”


Granny Aching

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Most Contributions

    1. amberleadavis
      amberleadavis
      37779
    2. PAKMAN
      PAKMAN
      30873
    3. Ghost Plane
      Ghost Plane
      28220
    4. jar
      jar
      26101
    5. wimg
      wimg
      25570
  • Upcoming Events

  • Blog Comments

    • Matthew TWP
      @Ruaidhri This was an absolutely wonderful bit of writing, and I hope that you're able to maintain the style once all of the medications are out of your system.  Take care and recover quickly!
    • Dr.X
      Very punny daniel
    • danielfalgerho
      These comments make me sad as I sympathise with Ruaidhri, having great difficulties in being taken seriously. Or being taken at all (no off-colors jokes, please!) In spite of overwhelming odds,  Ruaidhri -now I know how to spell it- made a courageous decision and stuck to it. I was diagnosed with a similar growth in a place I will not reveal. Oh, well, if you insist it was Mount Sinai Hospital. But I firmly intend to walk in Ruaidhri's footsteps, if he will let me, on my next visit to Dublin.
    • ParramattaPaul
      Reminds me of the day my associates and I developed a cure for all mankind's ills and mistakenly wrote it down with invisible ink.
    • AnneD
      Was that the end of the Laboratory? Somehow the exactitude created a fully destructive device, as always!
  • Chatbox

    You don't have permission to chat.
    Load More
  • Expiring Soon

    • By benbot517
      51 years and 10 months
    • By benbot517
      51 years and 10 months
    • By benbot517
      51 years and 10 months
    • By Okami
      51 years and 10 months
    • By Okami
      51 years and 10 months
  • Random Adverts

  • Files

  • Today's Birthdays

    1. alexamdz
      alexamdz
      (33 years old)
    2. allisonkl
      allisonkl
      (66 years old)
    3. Aredfalcon
      Aredfalcon
      (50 years old)
    4. Atilla
      Atilla
      (65 years old)
    5. Biohazard Hugh
      Biohazard Hugh
      (34 years old)





×
×
  • Create New...