Advantages Integrated (Piston) Filling System Over Converter/ Cartridge ?

[BaronWulfraed]

Doesn't that rattle around?

 

That's how you know it's working

 

Not really a joke... The steel balls that seal Platinum cartridges can be heard rolling back and forth as one tilts the pen, and the same can be said of the inserts in Pilot converters (top-hat or balls&cage).

 

The plastic ball that seals some cartridge styles may also apply.

[vicpen123]

None.

[CoolBreeze]

Forgive me for reviving an old thread but I found it fascinating to read. I was wondering if any modifications like the ones described in this thread were done on the Bock nib units used in the Fountainbel designed Conid pen? Everything I searched seemed to indicated it was just a standard nib unit. Thanks!

[danielfalgerho]

Thank you Fountainbel, I love your artwork, too. This would explain the irregular ink flow of my MB Noblesse. Now what I need to know is how I or anyone else can fix it. Any suggestions would be welcome. 

[fountainbel]

On 3/30/2020 at 11:19 PM, CoolBreeze said:

Forgive me for reviving an old thread but I found it fascinating to read. I was wondering if any modifications like the ones described in this thread were done on the Bock nib units used in the Fountainbel designed Conid pen? Everything I searched seemed to indicated it was just a standard nib unit. Thanks!

Conid pens feature an integrated filling system, hence don't need a cartridge/convertor nipple on the screw-in nib housing

On all Conid pens the cartridge nipple is removed by drilling the housing though with a 3mm bore ensuring a fluent ink/air exchange.

[Temenos]

It's mostly an subjective aesthetic advantage. In terms of practicality, almost none, unless you need a huge ink capacity - but then why not just use an eyedropper?

 

I find that there are more disadvantages of the piston system over the CC system. Higher price, harder to clean, more prone to break down, messier to fill and so on. Having said that, I do love the piston-filler Pelikans's design even though their nibs kinda suck. 

[Karmachanic]

1 hour ago, fountainbel said:

On all Conid pens the cartridge nipple is removed by drilling the housing though with a 3mm bore ensuring a fluent ink/air exchange.

 

In that Conid feeds are not available at this time, would removing the nipple and enlarging the resultant hole negate this problem for Conid pens?

[fountainbel]

58 minutes ago, Karmachanic said:

 

In that Conid feeds are not available at this time, would removing the nipple and enlarging the resultant hole negate this problem for Conid pens?

Only the nipple of the nib & feed housing is to be removed by drilling through with a 3mm drill
The thin  feed tail on the feed itself can stay in place.

Francis

[Karmachanic]

Thank you Francis

[es9]

Does the lack of metal spike create any problems?

 

(I do not currently own a Conid, but am chomping at the bit to buy one as soon as they reopen.  In fact, I am so excited that my wife -- who is not a pen person -- has started asking me if there are any updates.)

[CoolBreeze]

16 hours ago, fountainbel said:

Conid pens feature an integrated filling system, hence don't need a cartridge/convertor nipple on the screw-in nib housing

On all Conid pens the cartridge nipple is removed by drilling the housing though with a 3mm bore ensuring a fluent ink/air exchange.

Thank you for responding. I loved this thread and your pens look great!

[bunnspecial]

I think in general many folks say "piston" when they're talking about "integrated filling system", especially since that seems to be by far and away the most common integrated system in use.

 

I prefer integrated filling pens. Most of mine are in fact pistons, but I have levers, buttons, vacumatics, aeromatics, touchdowns/Snorkels(I'd broadly class all of those as "sac fillers" since they work on the principle of compressing an elastic sac and then allowing it to such ink in as it expands-they just differ in how the sac is compressed) and a few vacuum fillers.

 

Especially on a premium pen, I don't particularly enjoy taking the pen apart and twiddling a little plastic knob to fill the pen. I actually don't particularly care for converters in general, and tend to refill cartridges instead. I will tolerate the system as a whole, though, if the pen is worth it. The Duofold Centennial I've been using a lot the past few weeks is one that's definitely worth it.

 

On 11/4/2017 at 7:01 AM, Arkanabar said:

Then there's the Parker cartridge, which is pretty broad, really long, and has ribs to increase capillary flow to the open end. Parker was certainly intent on making the best possible FP cartridge, just as they intended to make the best possible BP cartridge, and, in my opinion, largely succeeded.

 

I have a C/C 61, and the converter included with it really is a nice piece also. It's a "squeeze" type converter that basically is a 21/51 Aeromatic filler made into a converter. I wish it could be used in modern Parkers, but I don't think it would work since it is designed to screw into the section. If I'm not mistaken, the Pli-Glass sac(PVC) has ribs running its length presumably for the same reason as the cartridges.

 

I do like Parker cartridges, though. My Duofold has had the same cartridge refilled about 3 times now, and the converter remains tucked in the box unused. I haven't measured, but as a nice little bonus the Parker cartridges hold a fair bit of ink and I suspect probably quite a bit more than the twist type converter.

[fountainbel]

On 5/2/2021 at 2:12 PM, es9 said:

Does the lack of metal spike create any problems?

 

 

The spike acts as  a "surface tension breaker", ensuring a fluent ink transfer from the main ink tank to the secondary  ink tank & vice versa.

However removing the spike is not dramatical is most cases.

In the mean time, the design has changed : the  spike is not mounted on the feed anymore , but on the syringe rod. Doing so the feed remains completely standard and complete nib units can be swapped between different pens

[es9]

13 hours ago, fountainbel said:

In the mean time, the design has changed : the  spike is not mounted on the feed anymore , but on the syringe rod. Doing so the feed remains completely standard and complete nib units can be swapped between different pens

 

Brilliant!!  When can I get one??  

[fountainbel]

22 hours ago, es9 said:

 

Brilliant!!  When can I get one??  

You will have to wait till Conid starts up production again....

Please don't ask me when this will happen, sorry, I really have no idea ...

Francis

[mtcn77]

On 8/27/2019 at 8:40 PM, sansenri said:

I have several pens in which ink sticks at the top end and just will not flow down...

Hi, I had that. Turns out the converter was not air tight and ink was moving up along with air.

[sansenri]

that is not the problem I'm talking about, I have a number of converter pens in which ink clings to the convert walls defying gravity...

the reason is surface tension, the surface tension characteristics of the plastic of which the converter is made are so high that ink just sticks to the walls and does not flow down unless you shake the pen...

I usually try to solve these issue washing the inside of the converter with a highly detergent soap, or even a de-greaser.

 

here is one of them

[mtcn77]

10 hours ago, sansenri said:

 

I usually try to solve these issue washing the inside of the converter with a highly detergent soap, or even a de-greaser.

To the dismay of the community, I will highly caution against doing it. Degreasers and detergents wreak havoc on piston rubbers. It wouldn't be so much an issue with twist converters, but with push converters, you can unseat the converter or burp ink just to unseize it. It is very disappointing to use it any more at that point. I still keep it as a pen flush, though.🙂

 

PS: May I ask new illustrations on how the air channel modification is done? I cannot view the old images, it redirects to the site's main page and I am highly enthusiastic about it. The pens I have write smooth with a hint of surfactants, but the flow disturbance gets even more pronounced. I'm thinking ink absorbs more air in cold temperature and body warmth speeds bubble formation in winter... I can also switch to Sailor with their big section converters, or move to piston fillers altogether. I need my heavy duty note taker.

[Karmachanic]

1 hour ago, mtcn77 said:

I cannot view the old images,

 

Have a look at the bottom of page 2 of this thread

[mtcn77]

1 hour ago, Karmachanic said:

 

Have a look at the bottom of page 2 of this thread

Oh, those two! I saw them, but not understood them since both looked similar. Do I cut the nib collar? Because that is what it looks like.