Demonstrators

[gregamckinney]

An old photo, but the main demos I had at the time:

 

http://www.gergyor.com/images/demonstrators_june2011.jpg

 

and my most recently acquired one (reusing a photo from the 'does your pen match your watch' thread.)

 

http://www.gergyor.com/images/marine-master_and_pfm-demo_sm.jpg

 

Best Regards, greg

[Bluey]

An old photo, but the main demos I had at the time:

 

http://www.gergyor.com/images/demonstrators_june2011.jpg

 

and my most recently acquired one (reusing a photo from the 'does your pen match your watch' thread.)

 

http://www.gergyor.com/images/marine-master_and_pfm-demo_sm.jpg

 

Best Regards, greg

Hi Greg, the 2nd and 3rd from the right are Pelikan's I assume because of the shape of the clip. Which Pelikan's are they? They look rather attractive.

[gregamckinney]

Hi Bluey,

They are LEs from the mid-90's. The blue is the Blue Ocean, and the green has the snappy sounding name of 'the green M800 demonstrator.' Don't know why they didn't give it a cool name.

They are M800 family pens, so the great thing is that they interchange nibs with any M800.

 

Best Regards,

greg

[Bluey]

Hi Bluey,

They are LEs from the mid-90's. The blue is the Blue Ocean, and the green has the snappy sounding name of 'the green M800 demonstrator.' Don't know why they didn't give it a cool name.

They are M800 family pens, so the great thing is that they interchange nibs with any M800.

 

Best Regards,

greg

Thanks Greg. If they're m800s they'll be well out of my price range even if they can still be found for sale. Something like Electric Green or similar would have been a better name.

Nice range of pens!

[frogbaby]

Am I being too narrow in my view that only uncolored / untinted pens should be called "demonstrators" ?

 

The Pilot 823 is my favorite pen but I really cannot think of the amber and smoke variations as "demonstrators" for example.

 

The term is derived from pens that were transparent in order to demonstrate construction and mechanism and so were made of as much transparent material as possible to show the interior of the pen.

 

I think that including the tinted versions under the nomenclature "demonstrator" kind of muddies the waters, so to speak.

[Sagarb]

[gregamckinney]

Am I being too narrow in my view that only uncolored / untinted pens should be called "demonstrators" ?

 

The Pilot 823 is my favorite pen but I really cannot think of the amber and smoke variations as "demonstrators" for example.

 

The term is derived from pens that were transparent in order to demonstrate construction and mechanism and so were made of as much transparent material as possible to show the interior of the pen.

 

I think that including the tinted versions under the nomenclature "demonstrator" kind of muddies the waters, so to speak.

 

You have summed up a classic debate quite well.

Others would say that if you can "see what's going on inside" then it is a demonstrator.

The term generally is used pretty loosely, in my experience.

Best Regards, greg

[phillieskjk]

Jetpens Chibi Demonstrator. Not the prettiest pen, but I don't think it looks too bad.

Edited May 15, 2016 by phillieskjk

[frogbaby]

 

You have summed up a classic debate quite well.

Others would say that if you can "see what's going on inside" then it is a demonstrator.

The term generally is used pretty loosely, in my experience.

Best Regards, greg

 

Fair enough.

Can't we go ahead and tighten the term up.

It seems that a pen could / should be called a demonstrator if it conforms to a simple rule, i.e. it is transparent and you can see the inside mechanism of the pen easily.

Any tinted pen would not qualify since it obscures the mechanism to at least some degree.

It doesn't seem like a difficult distinction to make.

Nevertheless, I won't hold my breath until everyone falls in line.

[Gofixmix]

Fair enough.

Can't we go ahead and tighten the term up.

It seems that a pen could / should be called a demonstrator if it conforms to a simple rule, i.e. it is transparent and you can see the inside mechanism of the pen easily.

Any tinted pen would not qualify since it obscures the mechanism to at least some degree.

It doesn't seem like a difficult distinction to make.

Nevertheless, I won't hold my breath until everyone falls in line.

We need something like Scale of Demonstrator Purity.

 

Here is my highly impure collection of cheapo demonstrators:

 

I included tinted pen to annoy you.

(But hey, you can see insides better then on most of others - like nib when capped)

 

My only rule, no convertors!

[frogbaby]

My only rule, no convertors!

 

Not an insignificant rule as it leaves a huge whack of demos like the Pelikan 200, Pilot 74, Sailor 1911 to mention only a few.

[Gofixmix]

Not an insignificant rule as it leaves a huge whack of demos like the Pelikan 200, Pilot 74, Sailor 1911 to mention only a few.

But I'm not questioning that they belong, I just personally don't want to look at convertor, so if they are cheap, I can convert them to eyedroppers and with more expensive.. Well I'd rather only get piston fillers.. Which Pelikan M200 fortunately is...

[gregamckinney]

Going back to your point about the origins of the term, frogbaby, don't forget some of the very earliest demonstrators were 'cutout' versions of hard rubber, celluloid or metal pens and pencils that showed the inner workings of the mechanics. I've seen Waterman, Wahl and Sheaffer examples, but I'm sure they exist for most makers. That part of the definition makes the waters almost completely opaque in one sense.

 

Best, greg

[frogbaby]

But I'm not questioning that they belong, I just personally don't want to look at convertor, so if they are cheap, I can convert them to eyedroppers and with more expensive.. Well I'd rather only get piston fillers.. Which Pelikan M200 fortunately is...

I agree with that.

I only own 3 demonstrators, an 823 and 2 TWSBI's

I hate the idea of looking at a converter in a demonstrator and have (so far) restricted my purchases to piston and vac fillers.

I would own more except the really nice piston fill demos are pricey.

I did just buy another 823 and have now bought 3, all clear demos.

 

Greg, I see your point and won't quibble but tend to think the demos you are talking about are fairly well old and have largely been replaced by the clear models which are still made for the purposes of actually demonstrating function, right ?

 

Do we see any of these "cutouts" any more and what period were they in vogue ?

[gregamckinney]

 

Greg, I see your point and won't quibble but tend to think the demos you are talking about are fairly well old and have largely been replaced by the clear models which are still made for the purposes of actually demonstrating function, right ?

 

Do we see any of these "cutouts" any more and what period were they in vogue ?

 

You are correct. Once translucent and transparent materials could be made cut-out style demos were not required. I've seen a photo of a Vacumatic cutout, or rather a Vacumatic cut lengthwise, but nothing newer than that, that I can recall. By that point, celluloid and modern plastics could reveal the inner workings.

 

The historians here could give you a better answer than I about the in vogue period, but I know I've seen cutout pencils from the 20's and pens from the 20's and 30's. I am sure there are bisected eyedropper pens to show the reservoir of the then newfangled eyedropper pen, but I can't recall seeing one. So, probably from the advent of mechanical pencils through the late 1930's?

 

Best Regards, greg

[mehandiratta]

My TansNauka

 

Edited May 31, 2016 by mehandiratta

[stringsandpedals]

I bought a lens that I've been wanting for ages this week and attempted some fountain pen photography with it. This is my TWSBI Diamond 580AL (one of my absolute favourites)

 

 

[cunim]

This meeting of the Inuvialuit Literary Club will come to order.

Edited June 13, 2016 by cunim

[cunim]

A Conid. The aviator's friend.

[Newjelan]

My TansNauka

 

Ooooh, that's beautiful.