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Esterbrook 444 Inkwell (Without Ink) As Stand For Lever-Fill Deskpen?


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Can I use an Esterbrook 444 dip-less inkwell, with no ink in it, as a stand for a Esterbrook lever fill pen? Or will the fact that the base is empty of ink allow the desk pen to dry out?

 

Thanks

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My money's on drying out ... although the base has a rubber gasket that may prevent air circulation. Why not try it out for a few days and see what happens? If the area you live in has a high enough humidity, you might get lucky.

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Paul


“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
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Left lever fill pen in in the 444 inkwell with no ink in the inkwell, just in the pen over the weekend, untouched and the pen writes straight away, no problems. The pen is a very wet writer to begin with. Also, I'm not sure that ink has not flowed from the pen into the little cup part of the inkwell, helping to keep the pen wet.

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I think if you put a small amount of water in the 444 it might keep the pen moist. I thought about some of these desk pen reservoirs that I came upon over time, but ink is a lot more expensive now (or the government has made money worth less by excess printing of it). When I was young in the antediluvian days ink cost about $0.25 per bottle. Then you could afford to splurge a lot of ink in one of these wells. Now it's a different matter.

 

I have an Esterbrook lever filler desk pen in one of those white desk pen holders with a heart base that you often see at weddings. Cheap and cutesy. It keeps the desk pen with 9314-B nib moist and writable over a month now. So, there's another idea: any desk pen base the pen will fit in that you like the look of.

 

Having had a lot of trouble with modern C/C pens drying out, I have put Carenes, Phileases, Sonnets, etc. in decent desk pen bases that fit them. Bases for Sheaffer Imperial inlaid desk pens, Parker 21 and 51 pens, whatever. They cure the drying out problem caused by defective cap designs or defectively made caps.

"Don't hurry, don't worry. It's better to be late at the Golden Gate than to arrive in Hell on time."
--Sign in a bar and grill, Ormond Beach, Florida, 1960.

 

 

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I would make sure that you clean out the 444 first. Where the nib goes into the top is actually a small compartment that holds a bunch of small, thin rods. These suck ink up from the bottom well and keep the nib supplied with ink, when used as a Dip-less inkwell. That also means that these small compartments get filled with ink, and thus filled with dried ink. I would make sure I cleaned it out really well first. And I like the idea of a little water in the bottom, and replacing the rubber gasket should at least keep it nice and moist, which means you may want to add some anti-microbial to the water so that you don't have the creeping crud working it's way up into your pen.

 

Or you can just take your restored 444, and get a dip-less pen, fill up the ink well and have a great holder with tons of ink. Just saying.

 

The ends of the dip-less pens and the desk master pens are different, so they may not fit quite the same. But just being nib-down in a fairly confined space should help keep the ink flowing as long as you use it periodically.

 

“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928

Check out my Steel Pen Blog

"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne

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Thanks, I had thought about putting water in but I was concerned about it being drawn up and diluting the nib. It is being held in deserve as plan b. Hopefully I won't nee to try it.

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I'd be concerned about the pen putting its reserve of ink into the rod capsule. Well, "concerned" is a strong word, but I suspect what you'll end up with is a pen with no ink in it that writes because the almost empty desk stand is keeping the point and feed wet.

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Oh, good heavens. He's got a blog now, too.

 

fpn_1465330536__hwabutton.jpg

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I would make sure that you clean out the 444 first. Where the nib goes into the top is actually a small compartment that holds a bunch of small, thin rods. These suck ink up from the bottom well and keep the nib supplied with ink, when used as a Dip-less inkwell. That also means that these small compartments get filled with ink, and thus filled with dried ink. I would make sure I cleaned it out really well first. And I like the idea of a little water in the bottom, and replacing the rubber gasket should at least keep it nice and moist, which means you may want to add some anti-microbial to the water so that you don't have the creeping crud working it's way up into your pen.

 

Or you can just take your restored 444, and get a dip-less pen, fill up the ink well and have a great holder with tons of ink. Just saying.

 

The ends of the dip-less pens and the desk master pens are different, so they may not fit quite the same. But just being nib-down in a fairly confined space should help keep the ink flowing as long as you use it periodically.

I was too eager to try the pen, so I didn't do any cleaning first, and you're right, I should have. The base is clear glass and there is no visible ink so I'm hoping it was at least reasonably clean.

 

I do want to get a dip-less pen, the problem is there are a lot of pens I'm wanting to get.

 

Thanks for the input.

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I'd be concerned about the pen putting its reserve of ink into the rod capsule. Well, "concerned" is a strong word, but I suspect what you'll end up with is a pen with no ink in it that writes because the almost empty desk stand is keeping the point and feed wet.

Yes, that occurred to me, the nib on the pen is very wet and I started wondering if the ink was just collecting and keeping it wet. I guess I'll need to put a pen with no ink in it to test.

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Put in a pen filled with just water and see if the nib gets inky.

 

“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928

Check out my Steel Pen Blog

"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne

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It turns out that yes, ink from the pen did collect in the "capsule" (as Ernst predicted). I wrote with the pen today, as I was writing it ran out of ink so I dipped it in the inkwell and I was able to continue writing with it, a few words for each dip.

 

I may continue using it this way, not sure yet. The pen needs some attention, the section fits very loosely and comes out too easily and I'd like to see if I can narrow the gap between the tines a little so it's not so wet.

 

Thanks everybody for your input!

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If you're going to do that, might as well restore the inkwell and use it like that. It will hold enough ink in the capsule to load up your pen for more than a few words.

 

Just a thought. They're easy to repair. I can tell you how I just did it.

 

fpn_1461592418__image.jpeg

 

“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928

Check out my Steel Pen Blog

"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne

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I really like the ones with the chains!

 

I may do that and I think it may not need anything but to be filled with ink. It didn't open easily and I was planning on soaking and trying again but I got started on this experiment using it just as a stand.

 

I like the idea of using it at work but I'd be really hesitant about possible spills, however unlikely it may be, I'd feel pretty dumb if it did happen. I know it would get more use if I keep it at work so if I can use it without filling that would be ideal. Then again, it would be nice to fill it and use it as intended. Maybe once I get a dip-less pen.

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Go ahead and soak it. The old ink is gluing it together. It will come undone. The top will not be hurt by soaking it in cool water and a little dish soap. Mine still had the adhesive pad on the bottom that you can use to stick it to a counter, so I had to soak mine upside down.

 

The top will just pry off, but do it carefully so you don't chip the edge.

 

Once you get the top off, then you'll want to pull off the feeder rod holder and clean that out. For instructions I followed to do that, see this thread.

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/171590-how-i-clean-the-feed-of-an-esterbrook-444-inkwell/

 

If you are missing any rods, or, heaven forbid, you lose rods, there's another thread that tells you how to make replacements.

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/205228-esterbrook-base-replacement-feeder-rods/

 

Clean out the glass well, and hopefully the red ring will still be in there. (it tells you how high you can fill the well, and rests on a ledge in the glass)

 

You will also encounter a rubber gasket that is most likely not in great shape. Keep the gasket, but go get a replacement. You can use a standard plumbing gasket and then trim it. These are normally recommended for a 407, but it can be used for a 444 if you trim the outside diameter a bit. Use a Flush Valve Seal for Mansfield #210. I get mine at Ace Hardware (fits both 210 and 211). You'll need to trim it down. I started at about 1.5 mm and just worked my way in until it all fit inside the diameter of the glass well. The type and diameter recommended for the 407 works with this trimming and is described here.

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/15292-upper-seal-gasket-for-esterbrook-444-desk-set/

 

That's it. Once you get the top off, it's easy to restore it in an hour or two tops, depending on how much soaking needs to take place. But you can scrub all of the parts with a toothbrush and soapy water, and taking the feed apart as described in the link above, will speed up that cleaning process by huge amounts. It's actually quite easy. There aren't too many parts (the feeder rods are the hardest part) and it all goes back together easily.

 

The base is relatively heavy glass, so unless you do something extraordinarily stupid, you most likely will not knock it over or spill it. Fill it, close it, use it. I love mine. And once you get one going you're going to want another.

 

Oh, and once last thing. If you're using it as it was originally intended, you don't need to fill the pen with ink. Just leave the pen in the ink well for an hour or so to allow for the capillary action to suck up the ink and load the feed, and you're ready to go.

 

Next thing you know, you'll be ready for one of these.

 

fpn_1460661682__dipless_407_whole.jpg

 

“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928

Check out my Steel Pen Blog

"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne

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They show up on eBay fairly regularly.

 

And then you'll need a base for your desk pen. :)

 

“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928

Check out my Steel Pen Blog

"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne

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