Jump to content
Classifieds is broken, please do not submit any new ads ×

mhphoto
 Share

Recommended Posts

I got a used Pilot Justus 95 with a medium nib in the mail a few days back because I've wanted to try one for some time now. I've always been fascinated by the Doric's adjustable nibs, and now having a small collection of them in all their different sizes (except for #6 and #10) I was eager to compare the old, somewhat fragile Doric nib to the newer Justus nib.

 

Now, there's the obvious difference between the two nibs in that the Doric is a fantastic example of vintage flexibility (my example of the #5 model is one of the wettest noodles to ever wet noodled) and the Justus is a soft modern nib (less flexible even than my cast of Pilot Falcons).

 

And a quick but important aside: THIS IS NOT A THREAD COMPARING VINTAGE AND MODERN FLEX NIBS. Please don't devolve this thread into that trite bickering. This thread is about the philosophy, design, and usability of a nib that allows the adjustability of its line variation, regardless of the quality of the variation.

 

The first time I inked up the Justus and tried out the faux overfeed doohickey I immediately noticed that there was very little difference between the feeling of writing in the "H" setting and the "S" setting. Both were very soft and offered very little feedback, like the suspension of a late 80s Town Car. When switching the settings on an old Doric the effect is immediate, day and night almost. But the Justus went from squishy ("S") to squishy with a slightly discernible bottom ("H"). And in terms of the line variation the Justus offers between the two extremes of its settings, I could immediately tell that there was very little of a difference between applying the same amount of pressure to each. So I decided to use a technique I've been using for vintage nibs for a while now: carbon copy paper.

 

With carbon paper, the effects of different types of inks (wet, dry, feather-prone, etc.) and the wetness of the pen (whether it writes dry or is on the gushy side) is nil. All you see on the carbon copy is the direct line variation of the nib you're using. The advantage of bypassing the inks' quirks is invaluable for this comparison.

 

So let's talk vintage first. I have four adjustable nib'd Dorics, sizes #3, #5, #7, and #9 (I'm missing #6 & #10). All of the sliding adjusters are of the hollow design (see pictures) rather than the solid design. With all four Dorics, the difference between max flexibility and max rigidity is staggering. Click the slider forward and you're writing with what nearly feels as solid as a nail. Click the slider all the way back and (depending on the individual nibs) you have a gorgeously responsive flex nib. Th two extremes are worlds apart.

 

But with the Justus things are different. You twist the dial at the end of the section to switch between maximum flexibility (denoted by an "S" on the dial) and maximum stiffness (denoted by an "H" on the dial), which unfortunately feel nearly the same. There is more resistance on the "H" setting, but it only comes after you flex quite a bit. The only real effect the different modes have on the page is that script written with a heavy hand in the "H" setting is wetter than if you write the same thing with the same pressure in "S" mode. "S" mode does give you a bit more ink shading, but it also lets the feed run dry when you flex for more than a few words.

 

In the end, I feel that the Pilot Justus' flexibility adjustments are about as effective as Delta's asinine Fusion nib. There's a slight difference in nib feel between the two modes, but on the page there's barely a difference. And to prove it, I used the aforementioned carbon paper. Pictures will be in the following posts.

 

fpn_1451747045__img_1999-2.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 10
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • markh

    2

  • hari317

    1

  • mhphoto

    4

  • Icywolfe

    1

Firstly, here are the two Dorics. Notice how the distances between the lines change. There is some variation when set to be rigid, but the effect with ink of the page is a smooth, medium line.

 

Also note that on the right side I drew in the lines with ink so you have something to compare carbon lines to.

 

The #3 nib:

 

fpn_1451725558__img_20160102_0001-3.jpg

 

fpn_1451725488__img_20160102_0001-2.jpg

Edited by mhphoto

fpn_1451747045__img_1999-2.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And here's the Justus 95's carbon sheet.

 

fpn_1451725506__img_20160102_0001.jpg

 

Notice the ridiculous similarity between the hard and soft settings. There is a slight difference in how wide the tines will spread, but when inked up and writing on the page, it's negligible.

 

The Pilot's system just isn't very effective at limiting line variation and influencing nib-feel, independent of the nib's ability to produce line variation. It's not quite a gimmick (look up gimmick in the dictionary and Delta's Fusion nib is right there), but it might as well be. This pen shouldn't be one cent more than a Falcon. In fact, the Falcon's nib is better, both in feel and feedback, and in flexibility and line variation offered. And don't get me wrong, I'm really not intending to belittle the Justus. As just a regular premium pen, it's great. The nib is a bit too cushy for me, but fit and finish is great, and the resin's barley-esque finish is gorgeous. But as long as its street price is double that of the Falcon, which is for all intents and purposes a better all-around pen, I'll keep railing on it as a gimmick-shaped spot on the Pilot brand.

 

And let's just get it out there that it's nowhere near as cool looking as the Doric sliders…

 

fpn_1451725521__img_5163.jpg

fpn_1451747045__img_1999-2.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Delta's Fusion nib is pseudo science.

 

Welp this is what I came up with:

(Warning decently large image.)

 

 

 

 

efj0.png

 

 

#Nope

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have a vintage Justus (the original without the "95" that was released in 1979) and I find that the slider works a bit better than what you describe for the modern version. I haven't tried a modern Justus yet so I can't say how different it is but it would be interesting to compare it with those Dorics and the Justus 95.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 years later...

I have a vintage Justus (the original without the "95" that was released in 1979) and I find that the slider works a bit better than what you describe for the modern version. I haven't tried a modern Justus yet so I can't say how different it is but it would be interesting to compare it with those Dorics and the Justus 95.

Mind sharing some thoughts on it? I might be able to get one for about 40€. Wanted to know if it was worth it...

"He who obeys, does not hear himself"


post-127515-0-72380100-1492691142.jpg


https://www.instagram.com/aalexangelov/



Alex

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have a Justus, and think of its adjustment as flexible/non-flexible as using the wrong model.

 

The vintage Doric nib, when the slider is back is an expressive nib - wide and thin lines. When its forward its more of a hard nib as might be used for carbon paper. The range is behaviors is quite wide.

 

I would look at the Justus in a different way. A better comparison adjusts the nib from a Soft to Hard, in Japanese pen terms. Pilot (and Sailor, and Platinum) all sell soft nibs along with their regular nib. They aren't expressive in the vintage sense, and aren't intended to be. They do give a very different writing feel.

 

Visconti sells pens with Palladium nib they describe as "dream touch," which I think is a good description of the nib. The literature with the pen talks about needing no pressure to write with the pen. The nibs write with a soft feel and can be very enjoyable. They are slightly expressive but that's not their purpose. At the other extreme is the Pilot Namiki PO nib - hard as a rock - similar to vintage Sheaffer Balance or Lifetime nibs.

 

The Justus varies over these two ranges, maybe not a wide, but not at all like the Doric. It may be slightly more expressive when the overfeed is adjusted all the way back, but again that's not the purpose.

 

I have one of these in fine (and like most Japanese pens it is very fine indeed). I adjust the metal bar to reflect the quality of paper I'm writing on. Paper that's too absorbent (newsprint) gets the stiffest setting. Really high quality paper gets a softer setting and just feels better to use.

 

It also depends on how your hand works with the pen. If you have been using BIC stick pens all of your life, the soft setting might be hard to handle until you unlearn your old habits and learn new ones.

 

I think its a neat idea and like mine. But it doesn't substitute for vintage flex.

.

...

"Bad spelling, like bad grammar, is an offense against society."

- - Good Form Letter Writing, by Arthur Wentworth Eaton, B.A. (Harvard);  © 1890

.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think anyone thinks the justus is the flexible nib of the pilot world. I think a SF #5 in a 74 or 91 would do that job just as well, with the falcon being a little moreso and the FA being the true "flex" nib (which is about as close as we can get to a modern flex nib out of the factory these days)

 

I'd love a doric someday.

Edited by Honeybadgers

Selling a boatload of restored, fairly rare, vintage Japanese gold nib pens, click here to see (more added as I finish restoring them)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

I'd love a doric someday.

 

 

I have a few of these in different sizes. They are nice nibs. I actually think they are a bit "gimmicky", which of course is what they were intended to be - they are a marketing strategy. I doubt the most users changed the slider very frequently

 

But if you want to write a beautiful, expressive cursive hand, the Waterman #7 pink wins hands down.

 

.

...

"Bad spelling, like bad grammar, is an offense against society."

- - Good Form Letter Writing, by Arthur Wentworth Eaton, B.A. (Harvard);  © 1890

.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think anyone thinks the justus is the flexible nib of the pilot world. I think a SF #5 in a 74 or 91 would do that job just as well, with the falcon being a little moreso and the FA being the true "flex" nib (which is about as close as we can get to a modern flex nib out of the factory these days)

 

Like I said, not meant to be a comparison between vintage flex and modern flex. And I hated my FA nib. It bent itself too easily with barely any force applied and the feed Pilot paired with it was laughably bad.

 

I doubt the most users changed the slider very frequently

 

 

I move mine fairly often, but only to keep it lubricated. I've them lock up before and it's no fun, even if it's stuck on full flex.

fpn_1451747045__img_1999-2.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share



  • Most Contributions

    1. amberleadavis
      amberleadavis
      37978
    2. PAKMAN
      PAKMAN
      31107
    3. Ghost Plane
      Ghost Plane
      28220
    4. jar
      jar
      26101
    5. wimg
      wimg
      25602
  • Upcoming Events

  • Blog Comments

    • A Smug Dill
      @Texas42 Thank you. I myself have recently had the experience of cleaning out a Wing Sung 699, in which the iron-gall ink has been sitting for six months. No damage to the metal piston rod (whereas, in a Wing Sung 3013 vacuum-filler, it would have been corroded, turned green, and contaminated the ink in mere weeks), but there was a ring of colour at the far end of the barrel that wouldn't budge, and I found it impossible to unscrew the filling mechanism to clean the interior wall of the ink rese
    • Texas42
      Dang. You are a great friend!   One comment as a relative newcomer would be within the cleaning section: issues/differences in cleaning vacuum filler, piston filler in addition to cartridge/converter. I just cleaned out my Pilot 823 and while it wasn't particularly difficult I was a little paranoid about the drops of water that I could not get out. Perhaps this is something you are already including.   Anyway, great project and very thoughtful of you. I know it's a project fo
    • Splat
      Ah Ruaidhri ya wee heid banger, you do indeed have an Irishman’s way wid dose words now. I’ll be from outer Aberdeenshire up in the blizzard riven braes of the Grampians.  Amateur medicine and surgery is it? Well what noble aspirations you do possess, we need to encourage such noble experimentations.  I pondered on leaving my own battered shell to science, but, until I read your pearls of wisdom and lament, I had comedown on the side of leaving my body to Findus frozen foods.  However, your rema
    • austollie
      Hi Smug Dill,   Nice project.  If it were me, I'd cover stuff like: - nib types available, i.e. styles, materials (SS vs gold), flex vs nails; - filling systems (I love the "thingie" comment) and how once can use them in practice (e.g. fill cartridges with a syringe); - pen body materials and their consequences (pen not balanced of too heavy and big for the hand); - and, whilst you've made it clear that you do not like vintage pens, a discussion of these beyond "I d
    • A Smug Dill
      Thanks for your input! Yes, not putting wood in the list of body materials warranting a mention was an oversight. I love pens with wooden bodies, but my main concern, or chagrin, is that I have not come across a wooden-bodied pen with a wooden cap that seals well. Actually, there is one, but it isn't really wood per se: the Pilot Custom Kaede's maple body is resin impregnated. All other wooden pens I have can dry out while capped and undisturbed; that includes several Platinum #3776 models.
  • Chatbox

    You don't have permission to chat.
    Load More
  • Files

  • Today's Birthdays

    1. arthurm
      arthurm
      (22 years old)
    2. BMS
      BMS
      (61 years old)
    3. cacatua
      cacatua
      (72 years old)
    4. Cmg.sweet
      Cmg.sweet
    5. Dennis B
      Dennis B
      (74 years old)





×
×
  • Create New...