Relief 90

[antoniosz]

It came from England today

BHR two tone wide relief nib. Not 100% but a beautiful pen nevertheless.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b325/azavalia/1rel90.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b325/azavalia/2rel90.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b325/azavalia/3rel90.jpg

Edited March 25, 2007 by antoniosz

[Gerry]

What a wonderful looking pen.

 

Congratulations Antonios.

 

Gerry

[southpaw]

Antioniosz,

Congrats. Now for a newbie question - what is a relief nib? TIA

[Brian Anderson]

Nice pen Antonios! Glad to see it in better detail than the auction. I like those 90's, have a few of them myself, and wish Esterbrook would have stayed with a GF/GP trim option, even if it was thin.

 

That gold wash on the nib really has a tendency to wear off very easily. Yours is probably the best example I've seen.

 

As for relief nibs, "relief" is really a designation similar to oblique, but not at the same angle as oblique. IIRC, I think relief is 7-8 degrees, and oblique is a bit more. Maybe someone out there has a better technical definition?

 

Best-

Brian

[Gerry]

I was wondering, as one who does not know much about the Relief line of Esterbrooks, whether someone in the know might care to list a few of the more common variants of Esterbrooks and in particular Esterbrook Relief pens made - taking us to the emergence of the dollar pen phase of their history?

 

This might be a topic better served in a new thread, but since Antonios started with the Relief here I thought I'd ask here.

 

Regards

 

Gerry

 

Paul Hoban lists the following pens in the 1915 - 1933 time frame...

 

~1915 - the Relief 314, a BCHR eyedropper with a 14k gold ventless nib, flat feed

~1920 - a similar BCHR ED with a 314 nib that has a heart shaped vent, comb feed

~1928 - the Relief 1, a BCHR lever fill with a 14 Ct nib, spoon feed, heart shaped vent hole.

 

Antonios, your Relief 90 adds significantly to this list, and wonder how many more are our there...

[antoniosz]

In addition to this one I have:

1, 2-L, 5-L(parts) and 12, which I will eventually document here.

But Brian's web page (www.esterbrook.net) is by far the most comprehensive place to start looking into the british connection of Esterbrook. I am just a novice compared to him

Edited May 29, 2005 by antoniosz

[Gerry]

Of course, what was I thinking of?

 

For those who don't know, Brian maintains a formidable Esterbrook web site as Antonios has noted. (http://www.esterbrook.net/)

 

 

Gerry

Edited May 29, 2005 by Gerry

[Brian Anderson]

Paul Hoban lists the following pens in the 1915 - 1933 time frame...

 

~1915 - the Relief 314, a BCHR eyedropper with a 14k gold ventless nib, flat feed

~1920 - a similar BCHR ED with a 314 nib that has a heart shaped vent, comb feed

~1928 - the Relief 1, a BCHR lever fill with a 14 Ct nib, spoon feed, heart shaped vent hole.

Gerry, perhaps you are correct in that a historical relief perspective belongs in another thread, which I'll attempt to start in a minute or two, but let me propose something regarding the Hoban dating you mention.

 

It has been suggested to me, by someone kind enough to present an original Relief catalog, that the Relief pens were not in fact made as early as Hoban claims they were. Unfortunately, I lost the email from the gentleman when one of my mail accounts went under, so I can't even email back to confirm, but I believe the start date for the Conway Stewart connection started as late as 1938. This date sticks in my head due to the fact it was significantly later than that which has been proposed before. I think this date came from an advertisement introducing the "New" Relief line of pens, but I could be wrong here. 1928, however, is not likely to be correct.

 

Keep in mind Esterbrook was not afraid (perhaps spendthrifty?) to be using HR well after other manufacturers were switching to plastic, and despite the fact they themselves were using plastic in their V clips and early dollar pens, as far back as 1932. British pens seem to also follow the trend of using HR for quite some time into the 1930's so this doesn't seem to be too far out of place.

 

As for the dating of the eyedropper pens Hoban shows, that was also speculation, but eyedroppers are perhaps a different discussion for a different day. The first pen ca. 1915 he shows appears to be a Wirt copy, and those ventless nib/vented feeds were made for a considerably long period of time.

 

Best-

Brian

[Gerry]

So you suspect that there is *considerable* overlap in production dates of different models. I guess it is relatively common in most pen companies, and could be expected to be even more pronounced in one like Esterbrook, when it was operating in the UK as well as the USA, dealing with two quite different markets.

 

It will be interesting if people collecting Esties are able, through finding and sharing information from ads, books and other publications, to put more definitive dates around the production of various models and expand the body of knowledge in this area...

 

Regards

 

Gerry

[Brian Anderson]

I have my speculations as to when most models were produced, but have no definitive data for most of it, so I am hesitant to include such dates here or elsewhere. Esterbrook was a company founded by quakers, and I suspect they took many of their personal philosphies into their business. Like other companies, I suspect you'll never find a hidden NOS parts cache of 1934 clips. From what I've seen it looks like a lot of their stuff was used up before fully moving over to a new clip, lever, barrel imprint, etc. So, crossover did occur, and since Relief pens weren't actually made by Esterbrook themselves, is really a whole different ballgame.

 

In time, we'll have a better understanding of when these pens came into being, until then, all we have is mere speculation, which we all know can lead to misinformation and disappointment.

 

Best-

Brian

[Brian Anderson]

"Um., excuse me Mr. Anderson?"

 

"Yes, Alex, I'd like to take Esterbrook Relief Dating for $100"

 

"Answer: 1938"

 

Bzzzzt....

 

"What is....NOT the correct estimate for when Conway Stewart started making Relief pens for Esterbrook"

 

Ding!

 

"Correct! You still maintain control of the board Brian"

 

"Thanks Alex, I'll take Esterbrook Relief Dating for $200"

 

"Answer: 1933"

 

Bzzzzttt...

 

"What is... A more reliable and correct estimate for when Conway Stewart started making Relief pens for Esterbrook?"

 

Ding!!

 

"Correct! That's all the time we have for now folks, thanks for playing this special edition of pen jeopardy."

 

A simple look at one of my earlier posts from a would have reminded me of the more correct dating here.

 

Best-

Brian

[Gerry]

Heh heh - nice catch Brian. I notice I was repeating myself from January - had completely forgotten having that conversation...

 

Cheers

 

Gerry